Am I crazy??

Dune · 11-05-2009, 10:27 PM

Hey everyone. This is my first post and was wanting some feedback on some pictures we had taken for our sons football team. When I saw the pictures when they came in the mail I was kind of taken aback. They don't look natural to me.? I was wanting to see what everyone else thinks about these pictures. I am going to hold back what I think so I can see if I'm right in my thinking or if I'm just crazy in my thinking? I really appreciate any help you can give me.

**Big Mike** · 11-05-2009, 10:33 PM

The over exposure was toned done, which I think is an improvement. The biggest difference is the heavier vignette.

Dune · 11-05-2009, 10:45 PM

When I play around in a program like photoshop or picasa and move the slider on the sharpness/brightness to a sorta crazy level this is how it starts to look like to me. The kids take on an almost cartoon like look. The pictures are really bright(overexposed?) The photographer says he takes 5000 pics a week and knows what he's doing so I just wanted a second(or a hundred) opinion(s). I didn't want a refund or re-takes or anything like that, it was just a surprise when these came in the mail from a photographer who has 20 years experience taking pictures.

Dominantly · 11-05-2009, 11:01 PM

Well, I would say that you have reason to doubt his skill/ability. Those photos could be taken by anyone with a point and shoot camera. The editing also is sup par.

PatrickHMS · 11-05-2009, 11:01 PM

Anyone else think that the photos are kinda amateurish?

The vignetting just gives it a portrait effect, the photographer will tell you.

Seems the general consensus here on TPF is who cares if the photographer knows what he is doing or not, long as he has the equipment and charges money?

Dune · 11-05-2009, 11:15 PM

I guess I'm not crazy! I've taken shots of my son in his pads just like this picture with my Nikon d40 with the kit lens and to me are way better.?

These are the settings he says he used to make this shot.

f5, 1/800 SS, ISO 200, on a Nikon D3 with a 200mm f2.8 lens.

chip · 11-05-2009, 11:20 PM

looks like he shot it at +2. I would say the guy messed up.

PatrickHMS · 11-05-2009, 11:21 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dune

I guess I'm not crazy!

These are the settings he says he used to make this shot.

f5, 1/800 SS, ISO 200, on a Nikon D3 with a 200mm f2.8 lens.

No you are not crazy!

One of my pet peeves is someone who goes out and buys a high end camera, then decides to call himself a professional.

Obviously, these settings were incorrect. He would have gotten better shots had he left the D3 set on "auto".

Least he knows which end of the camera to point at your kid.

I can get wonderful shots with my D40, but I am not a pro, least not anymore.

Sw1tchFX · 11-05-2009, 11:29 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dune

I guess I'm not crazy! I've taken shots of my son in his pads just like this picture with my Nikon d40 with the kit lens and to me are way better.?

You need to understand the context here, this guy probably had more than just your kid to photograph. You mostly photograph the boy, this guy i bet had at least 12 other kids to shoot, and not a whole lot of time either. As for the picture, except for a little heavy vignette, and the background, your crazy or your monitor is outta whack.

Could this have been done better, sure. everything can always be done 'better'. But again, given the context, I think it's a pretty bold and ignorant statement to say that you can do better on your D40 (you might be a great shooter, but statistically you probably use the camera in Auto mode most of the time, in which case, no you probably could not have done better. i've been wrong before though).

I'm not trying to mean here, just observation.

Dune · 11-05-2009, 11:33 PM

I do not claim to be a pro...only a parent who loves taking pictures of their kids and wants to get action shots. This is the one I took before his first game. Any tips for making a better picture would be greatly appreciated!

Dune · 11-05-2009, 11:38 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Sw1tchFX

Quote: Originally Posted by Dune

I guess I'm not crazy! I've taken shots of my son in his pads just like this picture with my Nikon d40 with the kit lens and to me are way better.?

You need to understand the context here, this guy probably had more than just your kid to photograph. You mostly photograph the boy, this guy i bet had at least 12 other kids to shoot, and not a whole lot of time either. As for the picture, except for a little heavy vignette, and the background, your crazy or your monitor is outta whack.

Could this have been done better, sure. everything can always be done 'better'. But again, given the context, I think it's a pretty bold and ignorant statement to say that you can do better on your D40 (you might be a great shooter, but statistically you probably use the camera in Auto mode most of the time, in which case, no you probably could not have done better. i've been wrong before though).

I'm not trying to mean here, just observation.

I have pictures in hand..no monitor needed there...I've seen his pictures and I've seen my pictures...IN PRINT and think that his were way too bright in the original and he tried to tone it down in photoshop and it turned out cartoonish....no good skin tones at all. Last years pictures were taken by a different photographer and they were EXCELLENT!!! I did a side by side comparison and there IS no comparison! I know I don't know as much as he does! Of that I'm sure! But I do know what looks good and bad.

And yes he had 7 teams with 20 plus kids to do...so I know he was rushed and had limited time but he's a pro with 20+ years experience and should be used to dealing with time restraints.

PatrickHMS · 11-05-2009, 11:42 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dune

I do not claim to be a pro...only a parent who loves taking pictures of their kids and wants to get action shots. This is the one I took before his first game. Any tips for making a better picture would be greatly appreciated!

It needs some PP, but even just like it is, I like you picture that you took with your "lowly" (but I have one too) D40 than I do what Pro shot with his mighty D3.

If he is charging for his work, circumstances like # of photos, # of kids, time of day, lighting, hurried, busy, or other excuses should not affect quality of photo being taken that he is charging for.

That is what Pro is being paid for - to get it right.

And Pro's snapshots are not right. Yours has more potential.

Dune · 11-06-2009, 12:01 AM

Thanks Patrick. I appreciate your compliment. If you guys could only see this in print...especially the team picture.

I guess what gets me is that he thinks it's absolutely fine. He doesn't think there's anything at all wrong with it.

PatrickHMS · 11-06-2009, 12:06 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by Dune

Thanks Patrick. I appreciate your compliment. If you guys could only see this in print...especially the team picture.

I guess what gets me is that he thinks it's absolutely fine. He doesn't think there's anything at all wrong with it.

Don't thank me! Many people on here seem to think that I don't know what I am talking about.

Your Pro is a magician - he can take a WONDERFUL camera, a Nikon D3, and use it to produce a very ordinary looking snapshot.

And you can set your D40 on auto and do better.

Dominantly · 11-06-2009, 01:48 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by PatrickHMS

Quote: Originally Posted by Dune

Thanks Patrick. I appreciate your compliment. If you guys could only see this in print...especially the team picture.

I guess what gets me is that he thinks it's absolutely fine. He doesn't think there's anything at all wrong with it.

Don't thank me! Many people on here seem to think that I don't know what I am talking about.

Your Pro is a magician - he can take a WONDERFUL camera, a Nikon D3, and use it to produce a very ordinary looking snapshot.

And you can set your D40 on auto and do better.

That was good.

11-05-2009, 10:27 PM	#1
Dune TPF Noob! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Am I crazy?? Hey everyone. This is my first post and was wanting some feedback on some pictures we had taken for our sons football team. When I saw the pictures when they came in the mail I was kind of taken aback. They don't look natural to me.? I was wanting to see what everyone else thinks about these pictures. I am going to hold back what I think so I can see if I'm right in my thinking or if I'm just crazy in my thinking? I really appreciate any help you can give me.

11-05-2009, 10:33 PM	#2
Big Mike I am Big, I am Mike Site Moderator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Edmonton Posts: 22,107 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 224 Times in 212 Posts My Gallery: (91)	The over exposure was toned done, which I think is an improvement. The biggest difference is the heavier vignette. __________________ Edmonton Wedding Photographer Blog

11-05-2009, 11:01 PM	#4
Dominantly TPF Junkie! Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: San Diego, CA (RB) Posts: 1,494 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 85 Times in 51 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Well, I would say that you have reason to doubt his skill/ability. Those photos could be taken by anyone with a point and shoot camera. The editing also is sup par. __________________ Dominant Photography - San Diego, CA My Project 365 Photo Blog Topic #1, Exposure & Your Photographic Triangle Topic #2, Light Metering, White Balance, JPEG vs RAW formats Topic #3, Layers & Post Processing

11-05-2009, 11:01 PM	#5
PatrickHMS TPF Junkie! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Metro Atlanta Posts: 1,264 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 39 Times in 30 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Anyone else think that the photos are kinda amateurish? The vignetting just gives it a portrait effect, the photographer will tell you. Seems the general consensus here on TPF is who cares if the photographer knows what he is doing or not, long as he has the equipment and charges money? __________________ Been into Photography since 1969. Current Digital equipment ~ Nikon D80, D40, Nikon 18-55mm non-VR, Nikon 55-200mm VR, Sigma 18-50mm constant f/2.8 HSM Macro, Nikkor AF 35mm f/2, Nikkor AF 50mm f/1.8, Nikkor AF 35-105mm f/3.3-4.5 Macro, tons of filters, several flash heads and tripods. My favorite camera bags are the Tamrac 610 and 612.

11-05-2009, 11:21 PM	#8
PatrickHMS TPF Junkie! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Metro Atlanta Posts: 1,264 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 39 Times in 30 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Quote: Originally Posted by Dune I guess I'm not crazy! These are the settings he says he used to make this shot. f5, 1/800 SS, ISO 200, on a Nikon D3 with a 200mm f2.8 lens. No you are not crazy! One of my pet peeves is someone who goes out and buys a high end camera, then decides to call himself a professional. Obviously, these settings were incorrect. He would have gotten better shots had he left the D3 set on "auto". Least he knows which end of the camera to point at your kid. I can get wonderful shots with my D40, but I am not a pro, least not anymore. __________________ Been into Photography since 1969. Current Digital equipment ~ Nikon D80, D40, Nikon 18-55mm non-VR, Nikon 55-200mm VR, Sigma 18-50mm constant f/2.8 HSM Macro, Nikkor AF 35mm f/2, Nikkor AF 50mm f/1.8, Nikkor AF 35-105mm f/3.3-4.5 Macro, tons of filters, several flash heads and tripods. My favorite camera bags are the Tamrac 610 and 612.

11-05-2009, 10:45 PM	#3
Dune TPF Noob! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Gallery: (0)	When I play around in a program like photoshop or picasa and move the slider on the sharpness/brightness to a sorta crazy level this is how it starts to look like to me. The kids take on an almost cartoon like look. The pictures are really bright(overexposed?) The photographer says he takes 5000 pics a week and knows what he's doing so I just wanted a second(or a hundred) opinion(s). I didn't want a refund or re-takes or anything like that, it was just a surprise when these came in the mail from a photographer who has 20 years experience taking pictures.

11-05-2009, 11:15 PM	#6
Dune TPF Noob! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Gallery: (0)	I guess I'm not crazy! I've taken shots of my son in his pads just like this picture with my Nikon d40 with the kit lens and to me are way better.? These are the settings he says he used to make this shot. f5, 1/800 SS, ISO 200, on a Nikon D3 with a 200mm f2.8 lens.

11-05-2009, 11:20 PM	#7
chip I spend too much of my life on TPF! Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Cypress, CA Posts: 359 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts My Gallery: (0)	looks like he shot it at +2. I would say the guy messed up.

11-05-2009, 11:29 PM	#9
Sw1tchFX TPF Junkie! Join Date: May 2006 Location: Portland! Posts: 5,527 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Quote: Originally Posted by Dune I guess I'm not crazy! I've taken shots of my son in his pads just like this picture with my Nikon d40 with the kit lens and to me are way better.? You need to understand the context here, this guy probably had more than just your kid to photograph. You mostly photograph the boy, this guy i bet had at least 12 other kids to shoot, and not a whole lot of time either. As for the picture, except for a little heavy vignette, and the background, your crazy or your monitor is outta whack. Could this have been done better, sure. everything can always be done 'better'. But again, given the context, I think it's a pretty bold and ignorant statement to say that you can do better on your D40 (you might be a great shooter, but statistically you probably use the camera in Auto mode most of the time, in which case, no you probably could not have done better. i've been wrong before though). I'm not trying to mean here, just observation. __________________ MyFlickr Quote: Originally Posted by no dogs dragon man! Well if it is lyk raining the cannons are really good for that but nikon is like all black so maybe good for sniperz?

11-05-2009, 11:33 PM	#10
Dune TPF Noob! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Gallery: (0)	I do not claim to be a pro...only a parent who loves taking pictures of their kids and wants to get action shots. This is the one I took before his first game. Any tips for making a better picture would be greatly appreciated!

11-05-2009, 11:38 PM	#11
Dune TPF Noob! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Quote: Originally Posted by Sw1tchFX Quote: Originally Posted by Dune I guess I'm not crazy! I've taken shots of my son in his pads just like this picture with my Nikon d40 with the kit lens and to me are way better.? You need to understand the context here, this guy probably had more than just your kid to photograph. You mostly photograph the boy, this guy i bet had at least 12 other kids to shoot, and not a whole lot of time either. As for the picture, except for a little heavy vignette, and the background, your crazy or your monitor is outta whack. Could this have been done better, sure. everything can always be done 'better'. But again, given the context, I think it's a pretty bold and ignorant statement to say that you can do better on your D40 (you might be a great shooter, but statistically you probably use the camera in Auto mode most of the time, in which case, no you probably could not have done better. i've been wrong before though). I'm not trying to mean here, just observation. I have pictures in hand..no monitor needed there...I've seen his pictures and I've seen my pictures...IN PRINT and think that his were way too bright in the original and he tried to tone it down in photoshop and it turned out cartoonish....no good skin tones at all. Last years pictures were taken by a different photographer and they were EXCELLENT!!! I did a side by side comparison and there IS no comparison! I know I don't know as much as he does! Of that I'm sure! But I do know what looks good and bad. And yes he had 7 teams with 20 plus kids to do...so I know he was rushed and had limited time but he's a pro with 20+ years experience and should be used to dealing with time restraints.

11-05-2009, 11:42 PM	#12
PatrickHMS TPF Junkie! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Metro Atlanta Posts: 1,264 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 39 Times in 30 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Quote: Originally Posted by Dune I do not claim to be a pro...only a parent who loves taking pictures of their kids and wants to get action shots. This is the one I took before his first game. Any tips for making a better picture would be greatly appreciated! It needs some PP, but even just like it is, I like you picture that you took with your "lowly" (but I have one too) D40 than I do what Pro shot with his mighty D3. If he is charging for his work, circumstances like # of photos, # of kids, time of day, lighting, hurried, busy, or other excuses should not affect quality of photo being taken that he is charging for. That is what Pro is being paid for - to get it right. And Pro's snapshots are not right. Yours has more potential. __________________ Been into Photography since 1969. Current Digital equipment ~ Nikon D80, D40, Nikon 18-55mm non-VR, Nikon 55-200mm VR, Sigma 18-50mm constant f/2.8 HSM Macro, Nikkor AF 35mm f/2, Nikkor AF 50mm f/1.8, Nikkor AF 35-105mm f/3.3-4.5 Macro, tons of filters, several flash heads and tripods. My favorite camera bags are the Tamrac 610 and 612.

11-06-2009, 12:01 AM	#13
Dune TPF Noob! Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7 My Photos Are OK to Edit Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Thanks Patrick. I appreciate your compliment. If you guys could only see this in print...especially the team picture. I guess what gets me is that he thinks it's absolutely fine. He doesn't think there's anything at all wrong with it.

11-06-2009, 12:06 AM	#14
PatrickHMS TPF Junkie! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Metro Atlanta Posts: 1,264 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 39 Times in 30 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Quote: Originally Posted by Dune Thanks Patrick. I appreciate your compliment. If you guys could only see this in print...especially the team picture. I guess what gets me is that he thinks it's absolutely fine. He doesn't think there's anything at all wrong with it. Don't thank me! Many people on here seem to think that I don't know what I am talking about. Your Pro is a magician - he can take a WONDERFUL camera, a Nikon D3, and use it to produce a very ordinary looking snapshot. And you can set your D40 on auto and do better. __________________ Been into Photography since 1969. Current Digital equipment ~ Nikon D80, D40, Nikon 18-55mm non-VR, Nikon 55-200mm VR, Sigma 18-50mm constant f/2.8 HSM Macro, Nikkor AF 35mm f/2, Nikkor AF 50mm f/1.8, Nikkor AF 35-105mm f/3.3-4.5 Macro, tons of filters, several flash heads and tripods. My favorite camera bags are the Tamrac 610 and 612.

11-06-2009, 01:48 AM	#15
Dominantly TPF Junkie! Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: San Diego, CA (RB) Posts: 1,494 My Photos Are NOT OK to Edit Thanked 85 Times in 51 Posts My Gallery: (0)	Quote: Originally Posted by PatrickHMS Quote: Originally Posted by Dune Thanks Patrick. I appreciate your compliment. If you guys could only see this in print...especially the team picture. I guess what gets me is that he thinks it's absolutely fine. He doesn't think there's anything at all wrong with it. Don't thank me! Many people on here seem to think that I don't know what I am talking about. Your Pro is a magician - he can take a WONDERFUL camera, a Nikon D3, and use it to produce a very ordinary looking snapshot. And you can set your D40 on auto and do better. That was good. __________________ Dominant Photography - San Diego, CA My Project 365 Photo Blog Topic #1, Exposure & Your Photographic Triangle Topic #2, Light Metering, White Balance, JPEG vs RAW formats Topic #3, Layers & Post Processing

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