Am I the only one that refuses?

[o hey tyler]

You would use InDesign or Quark for serious graphic design, which doesn't even have the same abilities as photoshop.

I use PageMaker.

Oh, ya, goin back to the old school.

Ghetto desktop publishing love. Using Quark 4.1 currently. Still manages to run... on OS9 only.

 

[Arch]

ok guys calm it down a notch of this will end up locked... maybe it already should be...

 

[Boomn4x4]

But that should not make you alienate all those who openly admit that after the click the work on the photo only just begins. For a photo is NOT a photo through the click alone, no matter how well you did set your camera. In the end, it is YOUR way of processing your picture that will make it YOURS.

I am certainly not alienating those who openly admit that after the click the work on the photo only just begins... In fact, I've full acknowledged my respect for those that do....

I would also submit that people should not alineate those who openly admit that their current focus is on in camera work while ignoring off camera work. In the few short months I have been here, I have seen dozens of people post pictures of what I would consider garbage shots, and then ask 'what can I do to make this picture better'... then see just as many people take the time out of their day to post process the garbage into more garbage. In a "beginners" forum, I don't see how 'post processing' should even be in the vocabulary. It would be like handing a scalpal to a premed student and having him do a vasectomy.... Yes surgery is apart of being a doctor... but why would you start out doing it... .Just like post processing, whether in camera or out, certainly has its place.... for many reading this shouldn't even be thought about.

 

[nchips1]

but why would you start out doing it...

Because learning how to use the camera simultaneously with learning what to do after the picture is out of the camera is important. It's always useful and it can be done at the same time. I can't find any fancy metaphor, though...

 

[Overread]

I think I'm getting more confused with this thread - your starting point and your point now are greatly different stances - you're now saying that those looking to learn should not be encouraged to process poorer shots until they are able to take better photographs. I don't think anyone posting in this thread thus far would disagree with you - however it is a far cry from you starting post.

The thing is even if it is polishing poorer photography learning editing is still something that can be done - and poorer shots can sometimes show up how to edit better than well taken shots. Its about skill building - maybe some learn to edit before they learn to take photos - in the same way some learn to expose before they learn to compose

 

[Boomn4x4]

Then I probably typed it. Use some common sense for once.

Says the guy who just tried to insult me by using the word "Sha-wing"...

You might just as well have called me a "poopy face".

I already informed you that you're wrong; coming from someone that has direct Graphic Design experience. What else do you want? I can tell you again if you want.

Post Processing a photo =/= Graphic Design

You forgot the "Sha-wing" :lmao:

 

[Village Idiot]

But that should not make you alienate all those who openly admit that after the click the work on the photo only just begins. For a photo is NOT a photo through the click alone, no matter how well you did set your camera. In the end, it is YOUR way of processing your picture that will make it YOURS.

I am certainly not alienating those who openly admit that after the click the work on the photo only just begins... In fact, I've full acknowledged my respect for those that do....

I would also submit that people should not alineate those who openly admit that their current focus is on in camera work while ignoring off camera work. In the few short months I have been here, I have seen dozens of people post pictures of what I would consider garbage shots, and then ask 'what can I do to make this picture better'... then see just as many people take the time out of their day to post process the garbage into more garbage. In a "beginners" forum, I don't see how 'post processing' should even be in the vocabulary. It would be like handing a scalpal to a premed student and having him do a vasectomy.... Yes surgery is apart of being a doctor... but why would you start out doing it... .Just like post processing, whether in camera or out, certainly has its place.... for many reading this shouldn't even be thought about.

So to equate this to film, a beginner should just take the pictures and drop them off at Walmart's one hour instead of learning how to develop them theirselves? I mean, it is part of the process, like at least adding sharpening, and a bit of bump to the curves, contrast, or levels.

And like everyone has said quite a few times in this thread already, if you're shooting in JPG format, your camera is already doing this for you. It's like dropping off a roll of film at a one hour developer. Sure it gets processed, but you have no control what-so-ever over how it turns out.

 

[benlonghair]

When I took a basic photography course in high school, they taught me to develop film and print photos.

Should they have avoided teaching me to do any post processing in the darkroom?

 

[Boomn4x4]

So to equate this to film, a beginner should just take the pictures and drop them off at Walmart's one hour instead of learning how to develop them theirselves? I mean, it is part of the process, like at least adding sharpening, and a bit of bump to the curves, contrast, or levels.

And like everyone has said quite a few times in this thread already, if you're shooting in JPG format, your camera is already doing this for you. It's like dropping off a roll of film at a one hour developer. Sure it gets processed, but you have no control what-so-ever over how it turns out.

Why are you trying to equate this to film??? This has nothing to do with film... or even digital for that matter. This has to do with crituquing unprocessed photos for the benefit of learning how to take photos. Its about capturing a moment in time, and using that momement to analyze what the photographer did to capture that particular moment and then using those techniques to find what they did wrong, so as not to make the same mistake yourself. If you post a poorly exposed and composed image that was cropped and processed, you can't do that.

 

[sovietdoc]

Post processing is okay as long as a certain "effect" you're trying to get from it, is not the whole point of the photo.

I see a lot of redundant photos lately that have no significance of any kind that someone can go PP and make it have pretty colors and everyone looks at it like its art or something. Wrong. The most important thing of all is what is there in your shot that you're trying to emphasize (object, person, whatever). Then, the way you took the shot, does it add to the idea behind the object, does it reinforce what you're trying to show with that picture? And only then PP, does it add to the previous two.

Not the other way around when people take a garbage shot and PP it just so it looks cool.

 

[Boomn4x4]

When I took a basic photography course in high school, they taught me to develop film and print photos.

Should they have avoided teaching me to do any post processing in the darkroom?

Did they teach you how do do post processing the first day?

 

[bentcountershaft]

At what point would you suggest one to undertake the daunting task of adding the complication of post processing to their work? I'd be leary of waiting too long because once you are familiar with what you can do in post it changes the way you shoot. Take shooting at high ISO for example. Trying to get it right in camera will result in more noise than exposing slightly to the right and bringing it back down. Why learn things like that twice?

 

[Overread]

Why are you trying to equate this to film??? This has nothing to do with film... or even digital for that matter. This has to do with crituquing unprocessed photos for the benefit of learning how to take photos. Its about capturing a moment in time, and using that momement to analyze what the photographer did to capture that particular moment and then using those techniques to find what they did wrong, so as not to make the same mistake yourself. If you post a poorly exposed and composed image that was cropped and processed, you can't do that.

You should have said this 4 pages ago - your augment has changed again as has the focus. This has nothing to do with refusing or using editing but is not a commentary on the critique others get in the forum - considering that forum interactions are without structure, without guidelines and totally voluntary you are going to be getting various responses from different groups. If you want to control of modify those responses you have three basic options:

1) Move to have an enforced and structured critique area created with the exisiting forum structure - probably not going to happen on TFF (the closests would possibly be the mentor scheme)

2) Make your own site/group with a critique focus

3) Give the critique yourself - or within a group of dedicated members of the site

 

[benlonghair]

When I took a basic photography course in high school, they taught me to develop film and print photos.

Should they have avoided teaching me to do any post processing in the darkroom?

Did they teach you how do do post processing the first day?

Yes, because there's a relationship between light, the film, the developer, the paper and such.

It's the same way with digital. There is no way to do one without the other.

 

[nchips1]

There is no way to do one without the other.

:thumbup: