Buy a Camera, Start A Business?

[c.cloudwalker]

...it seems that people think they can just buy a camera, and start a business...

Hey, that's what I did. Nothing wrong with that. What's wrong is what you mention next. Having just taken a few photos. I had close to 3 years of photography when I bought my first camera.

But this problem is not new. I worked in graphic design for a printer and we saw the same problem there with the first releases of Windows. People would buy CorelDraw and call themselves graphic designers. Everyday we turned people away who came in with 4 color designs and wanted only 250 business cards. No, their clients probably would not want to pay $1 or $2 a card. Back then, understanding the printing process was a must for a graphic designer.

Guess what, today those crazy designs go to a laser printer, those people don't get turned away anymore. Those people are not better designers but the technology allows them to get away with it by getting their stuff printed. And if they can find enough clients who don't understand design either, they could be in business for a while. But most probably they won't.

And it's the same in photography.

Don't worry, be happy.

 

[UUilliam]

I feel if someone wants to start a business and know nothing about it, then thats their problem and they will have to later suffer the consequences.

No, It isn't "Their" problem...
It affects the whole industry, People under charging thus when real photographers share their prices people turn their nose up at them...
this uts the real photographers out of business for "Over pricing themselfs" so to tackle this the photographers have to lower their rate because of all the noobs.
Think of it like a bank...
If a newbie decides "I want rich I bank money, give me money I invest and pay you 50% AER" All the other banks loose clients cause this guy is offering 50% interest!!
so the banks have to raise their interest thus loosing money thus resulting in a credit crunch like we are experienceing atm (although not caused by this method... it is caused by dumb ass people thinking "iwannabusinessIapplyforcreditandmortgageformybusinessIbesuccessful - then 2 months later they realise - ahbusinesstoohardgiveup,bumpthebank." but not limited to.)

 

[Josh66]

... they could be in business for a while. But most probably they won't.

Yup.

I don't understand how people think that these people who just took their first picture a week ago are taking jobs from seasoned pros.

That would be like the maintenance department of a major car dealer worrying about going out of business because an AutoZone just opened down the street.

Sure, anybody can walk in there and buy a water pump, but it isn't going to hurt the dealer.


Some people sound like they think you should have to take a test and get a license before being allowed to even buy a camera.

 

[Jeffro]

That was some crazy quotes... LOL
When I was younger and my brother got married my mom got a friend of a friend with a camera to do the wedding and paid I think $400. Plus the cost of extra prints. She was sadly dissappointed with everything he did and told everyone she could about it. So a few years later I got married and she wanted a real photographer and Paid close to $1800 and he was a dream. She still loves the pictures and the album that came with it. She has told many people to spend more and get the real deal and alot of my friends have used my photographer. About 10 weddings he has done from my moms talks with people. And two more coming up soon. Also Two other really good photographers we know now have done two weddings apiece this year alone from friends of my moms.
So the way I look at it 1 wedding was lost to a cheapo, fly by night PHOTOGUY that just bought a camera and 15 or so good jobs came open cause of it!

I would think in some ways if it teaches the general public "GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR"
it can help Photography Pros out in the long run!

This all happened over the last 5 years but still!
I know my moms friends all preach that line!

Now I am going to my friends wedding in a couple of weeks and plan to take lots of pictures and he offered me a couple of times to pay me but I wont except. I also told him to get a real photographer and I made a few calls. I have a guy doing it for him now for a good price. Now I also ask if he would mind if I used the wedding to learn and practice since I helped to get him the gig and he said that was fine. I told my friend that I am promicing him nothing! cause I dont know what I will get. but I want the experience!

Plus at the end of it all the Photographer said he would take a look at my pics and see if he could help me! So another bonus!

But in the long run I never really want to do weddings anyways, just think it is good experience!

Everyone is happy here!

 

[c.cloudwalker]

I feel if someone wants to start a business and know nothing about it, then thats their problem and they will have to later suffer the consequences.

No, It isn't "Their" problem...
It affects the whole industry, People under charging thus when real photographers share their prices people turn their nose up at them...
this uts the real photographers out of business for "Over pricing themselfs" so to tackle this the photographers have to lower their rate because of all the noobs.
Think of it like a bank...
If a newbie decides "I want rich I bank money, give me money I invest and pay you 50% AER" All the other banks loose clients cause this guy is offering 50% interest!!
so the banks have to raise their interest thus loosing money thus resulting in a credit crunch like we are experienceing atm (although not caused by this method... it is caused by dumb ass people thinking "iwannabusinessIapplyforcreditandmortgageformybusinessIbesuccessful - then 2 months later they realise - ahbusinesstoohardgiveup,bumpthebank." but not limited to.)

Yes it is their problem! The last I checked anyone has the right to start a photo business if they so desire. I have lost a part of my business to people working for free but I didn't lose any income. I just went and did something else.

Photographers who lose income to this situation beg the question: how good are they themselves in the first place? Just look at the websites that you can find links to in this forum then come back and tell me what is percentage of those you would hire. Mine is not very high.

 

[thenikonguy]

i'm sorry, but in a small town like mine, I DO loose business to crappy "photographers" i would say about 75% of my business comes from online advertising.. sites like Kijiji.. and, joe crappy photoguy is also advertising on kijiji.. he is advertising "why pay high prices for photographers, when you can get great photos for less" i'm advertising "don't be fooled by cheap photographers.. " then, i send him an email posing as someone to book him.. i see his shots, they SUCK, and YES, he is charging a lot less than me.. but guess what.. "fred" sees the 2 ads, and sends cheap face an email, sees the pics, and is relitively happy with them.. so, he books him.. he doesnt even send me an email to say "can i see your samples" so, he's not seeing the better quality of my photos.. he's not seeing the time put into my photos...

so am I loosing bussiness to cheap no name business' that only last a few months.. yes.. i am.. does it have anything to do with my skill.. no, it has everything to do with advertising.. people see cheap, and the guy says "i have a DSLR" so they assume he's good..

 

[Jeffro]

Just look at the websites that you can find links to in this forum then come back and tell me what is percentage of those you would hire. Mine is not very high.

I think this is a different arguement all together. But I would love to make a thread about just that. Everyone Post your Photography websites!

I wonder if a guy with really great photos has a kinda crappy site should lose business but a guy with a really nice site and crappy picture would get the business? Just a thought?

 

[manaheim]

Nikon or Canon?

This particular type of thread has been warred over several times in the past. Probably far more than I'm aware of.

You get what you pay for, buyer beware, the market will sustain what the market demands, if people are buying then other people will be selling, etc.

Ask yourself why there is a HUGE telemarketing business? I have never, nor would I ever, purchase ANYTHING from a telemarketer... hell, more often than not I tell them to put me on their do not call list and as soon as I confirm, slam down the phone... I don't know a single person who has ever admitted to buying anything from them... yet they're still there. Why?

Because it works. People buy.

 

[bitteraspects]

I studied for a long time, and then worked along side different pros for a long time before I even considered doing anything by myself, other than family photos.. did I do it wrong? or are people just jumping ahead of the game...

really?
how long?
who did you study with?
what "pro's"?

your recent posts dont show any further skill then someone who "bought a camera and started a business"

since DSLR's have become so common in the consumer market, its pretty easy for just about anyone to "buy a camera and started a business". hell, you can buy them at walmart and costco. if thats not commercial, i dont know what is.
what you really need to ask yourself is, what are YOU doing to separate yourself from the herd?
if someone who just picked up a camera for the first time is taking your business, then maybe you should stop pointing fingers and step YOUR game up.

as someone already said. "The cream always rises to the top."
and that seriously sums it all up.

time for you to get creamy :lmao:

 

[Jeffro]

Well one question I want to ask is this.

What happens in a family or man get married can only afford say $300 for a photographer OR for some one taking pictures what is he to do. If I was broke I would still want some pictures of my wedding. What about those guys that know they cant afford the best but still something is better than nothing. Think any major photographer would give him the time of day? Are there Buget Photographers out there????



PS POST ABOVE SHOULD START SOME S$%T!!!
I will have to check out his shots before I step in anything!

 

[bitteraspects]

if thats the clientele youre after, by all means, lower your rates, undercut yourself, and take those jobs. however, if thats all the money they have to spend, and you feel your work is worth more than that, then let the job go to someone who is willing to take the lower rate. its that simple.

it all comes back to your sense of self worth.

 

[Josh66]

Well one question I want to ask is this.

What happens in a family or man get married can only afford say $300 for a photographer OR for some one taking pictures what is he to do. If I was broke I would still want some pictures of my wedding. What about those guys that know they cant afford the best but still something is better than nothing. Think any major photographer would give him the time of day? Are there Buget Photographers out there????

In that case, you need to do your homework. Look at portfolios.

I'm sure that there are excellent budget photographers, but you have to find them.

 

[Josh66]

Look, it's this simple -

If you are afraid of someone that has no clue what they are doing, maybe YOU are the one that doesn't know what they're doing.


Ignore them, and eventually they will go away. ...Or they will get better, then you might actually have reason to worry.

 

[Jeffro]

I know I am kinda changing the subject but what the hell

I dont have a business first of all. I did not say that I would take that job. But I would think that by someone taking that job, it does not affect MORE expensive Photographers. Also whos to say if that is undercutting. Maybe there is a way to get the job done and still make money. Say if the only thing the buyer gets is a few slideshows on some DVD's.

So if a Photographer prides himself in doing really small weddings for a smaller price and can still make money out there whats the problem. Hell the "REALLY Photographers" as some would say are losing business cause they would never take the job in the first place!

 

[bitteraspects]

someone doing a wedding for $100, IN NO WAY affects my business, because im not in the business of doing $100 weddings