Buy a Camera, Start A Business?

[Soocom1]

George Washington
Abe Lincoln
Thomas Edison
Andrew Jackson

The above mentioned had an education equivalant to that of a current colege level education. In those times, thier education had a classicle tent to it. Geroge Washington was educated in classic Greek and latin philosophy.
Lincolin was taught rudamentery education in various formats all throughout the fronteier. He was also tought some aspects of again Latin and some greek.
Again a similar story with Edison. Also Jackson.



Harry Truman

His mother influanced him greatly with an education level that far exceeded today's standards. Including music, reading and history... Again at a level far higher than today.

And I can go on.. Primary reason I say this, is because all of the aboved mentioned people and the others you cite were all classicaly educated, and with the concept of personal self worth, not self esteem, and were taought that they were owed NOTHING and had to EARN everything.

I understand what you are saying, but keep in mind Ozzy also never graduated, made a million dollars, married a hottie wife, and now is in retirement all before the age 220.
How many high school boys and girls used THAT excuse to drop from high school???? too many for me to count.

 

[Jeffro]

I wonder if a guy with really great photos has a kinda crappy site should lose business but a guy with a really nice site and crappy picture would get the business? Just a thought?

JEffro... So which am I?

I PLEAD THE 5TH LOL

 

[c.cloudwalker]

I wonder if a guy with really great photos has a kinda crappy site should lose business but a guy with a really nice site and crappy picture would get the business? Just a thought?

JEffro... So which am I?

I PLEAD THE 5TH LOL

:lmao:

 

[choudhrysaab]

my wife went to Sears and got a family portrait done. honestly speaking the end result wasn't really what we paid for ($100) for few shots. on the other hand I do take pictures of my daughter (which was the intention for family portrait) I get much better results (not only my personal opinion but opinion of others as well) so if someone sees my work and asks me to shoot their Special Day for them then why not? they know what i'm capable of by looking at my photos so if they're agreeing to that then its their choice.

any extra money coming my way is welcomed and i'll obviously be using that money to get better equipment (which you may not agree with as you say that its not the equipment that takes good shots).

here's my 2cents.

 

[UUilliam]

As I said.
If someone else asks you to do something for them, Sure go ahead

what im against is people realising there is money in the photography business without knowing anything about photography or the prices that it costs...
they go buy "cheap-o-professional-big-camera" and point and click then print at Asda (Walmart)
that is what I'm against.
I think photography should have thought and feeling behind every shot.
not just "Ima make **** loadsa cash fur this : "

 

[thenikonguy]

As I said.
If someone else asks you to do something for them, Sure go ahead

what im against is people realising there is money in the photography business without knowing anything about photography or the prices that it costs...
they go buy "cheap-o-professional-big-camera" and point and click then print at Asda (Walmart)
that is what I'm against.
I think photography should have thought and feeling behind every shot.
not just "Ima make **** loadsa cash fur this : "

this is EXACTLY what i've been trying to say.. i dont care if your friend wants you to do photos for them, go ahead.. I did HUNDREDS of these when I first got into photography.. but, don't go out advertising that your a photographer, and advertise that you know what your doing, and that your quality is great... get the experience first.. (by shooting for your friends and family)

 

[choudhrysaab]

this is EXACTLY what i've been trying to say.. i dont care if your friend wants you to do photos for them, go ahead.. I did HUNDREDS of these when I first got into photography.. but, don't go out advertising that your a photographer, and advertise that you know what your doing, and that your quality is great... get the experience first.. (by shooting for your friends and family)

so much anger and rage ... someone needs a big cold glass of Kool Aid

 

[c.cloudwalker]

I think photography should have thought and feeling behind every shot.
not just "Ima make **** loadsa cash fur this : "

Let's get real here. For most commercial photographers the main thought is to make a sale and the feeling is that of the client. Some photographers have managed to sell their own thoughts and feelings in their photos but those are a minority. Lucky minority but still a minority.

I related in another thread my experience attending a workshop by the top US wedding photog. Except for the faces, every wedding looked exactly like the next one. The guy brought in a studio (why deal with natural light when you can control studio light so much easier) and the set up was always the same. His only thoughts, as far as I'm concerned, were directed towards making it easier on him. And his only feeling seemed to be for the green coming in.

He didn't show anything but the formals. The rest, as he put it, doesn't sell so don't worry too much about it.

 

[itznfb]

As I said.
If someone else asks you to do something for them, Sure go ahead

what im against is people realising there is money in the photography business without knowing anything about photography or the prices that it costs...
they go buy "cheap-o-professional-big-camera" and point and click then print at Asda (Walmart)
that is what I'm against.
I think photography should have thought and feeling behind every shot.
not just "Ima make **** loadsa cash fur this : "

this is EXACTLY what i've been trying to say.. i dont care if your friend wants you to do photos for them, go ahead.. I did HUNDREDS of these when I first got into photography.. but, don't go out advertising that your a photographer, and advertise that you know what your doing, and that your quality is great... get the experience first.. (by shooting for your friends and family)

if these people are cutting into your business then maybe you got into the business a little too early yourself?
i don't know your work and i'm not saying anything bad about it but these people may make some minimal impact for a short duration but if you feel they are majorly impacting your life then you're in the wrong business.

the fact is everyone is entitled to pursue whatever they feel like pursuing. and there are people willing to pay them for what they think they are good at then so be it. some people feel like there should be feeling behind every shot and thats great... but a lot of people don't feel that way.

 

[ANDS!]

but, don't go out advertising that your a photographer, and advertise that you know what your doing, and that your quality is great...

How do you know its not? I bet I can put a camera in the hands of a newb, and they could take a better or comparable photograph than some of the stuff thats "pro" quality.

All of these "rants" or whatever all have the same undercurrent to it: "I want to validate the time it took me to build up my work, so I will make sure the bar is raised for others. . ."

Whether someone can produce quality work has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they followed some arbitrary protocol; it has everything to do with whether or not their work is quality, whether someone will pay for their work, and whether they have the business acumen/common sense to succeed. Period.

 

[shortpballer]

but, don't go out advertising that your a photographer, and advertise that you know what your doing, and that your quality is great...

How do you know its not? I bet I can put a camera in the hands of a newb, and they could take a better or comparable photograph than some of the stuff thats "pro" quality.

All of these "rants" or whatever all have the same undercurrent to it: "I want to validate the time it took me to build up my work, so I will make sure the bar is raised for others. . ."

Whether someone can produce quality work has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they followed some arbitrary protocol; it has everything to do with whether or not their work is quality, whether someone will pay for their work, and whether they have the business acumen/common sense to succeed. Period.

I agree to this statement!!!! Great reply :thumbup:

 

[HeY iTs ScOTtY]

Great reply - Some people are just born naturals and shouldn't be told they have to go to college or follow some type of predetermined plan to become successful.

 

[In2daBlue]

i'm sorry, but in a small town like mine, I DO loose business to crappy "photographers" i would say about 75% of my business comes from online advertising.. sites like Kijiji.. and, joe crappy photoguy is also advertising on kijiji.. he is advertising "why pay high prices for photographers, when you can get great photos for less" i'm advertising "don't be fooled by cheap photographers.. " then, i send him an email posing as someone to book him.. i see his shots, they SUCK, and YES, he is charging a lot less than me.. but guess what.. "fred" sees the 2 ads, and sends cheap face an email, sees the pics, and is relitively happy with them.. so, he books him.. he doesnt even send me an email to say "can i see your samples" so, he's not seeing the better quality of my photos.. he's not seeing the time put into my photos...

so am I loosing bussiness to cheap no name business' that only last a few months.. yes.. i am.. does it have anything to do with my skill.. no, it has everything to do with advertising.. people see cheap, and the guy says "i have a DSLR" so they assume he's good..

Well, it appears that "cheap face" as you call him has got something going for him then. Business, in photography and other areas, is mostly about your ability to advertise and solicit customers. On a secondary level, it's about being good at what you do. If "cheap face" is soliciting business with an inferior product and discounted rates than he is playing the game well. If his customers think his work samples are adequate for their needs than he is providing them a service for a price he feels is fair. What's wrong with that?

I get tired of people on here talking about how the hobbyists in the field are dampening their business. It's true, no doubt about it and will continue to become more true as camera technology gets better and cheaper. But, that doesn't mean that there isn't a place for high-quality photography. The market will just be squeezed with more people offering high-quality photography and thus prices will inevitably go down.

Market your skills and your price. Not everyone will be willing to pay your rates and will be happy to take "cheap face" up on his rates and product. Others, who have more money to spend and the desire for top-notch photography, will gladly pay your rates and will pass on "cheap face" in a heartbeat. But, if you're going after the same cliental as he is than you will lose every time unless you drop your rates. For, in the end, most of the people who are looking for photography are looking for the best price possible and are willing to sacrifice the best product possible to get it. "I like this guy's work better but cheap face over here has a much better price and I think his images will serve our needs," is what is being uttered more and more these days by businesses.

Wedding photography, photojournalism, high-profile advertising campaigns are areas where you will be able to find the higher paying clients who are more concerned about product than price. But, selling Web photography is not. When you're scraping the bottom of the barrel you are going to run into competition that charges pennies to your dollar.

P.S. Search my posts and you will see that I never down talk someone on their gear as I feel it's rude and because I believe gear doesn't make a good photographer. But, for someone who is complaining about consumers breaking into your professional market it's amazing to see your line up of consumer gear. Just a thought.

 

[ShotwellPhotography]

I do hope to one day have my own photography business, but I know I'm not ready just cause i have a good camera, I know I still have a lot to learn. I have asked on this and other forums how to go about it, and I am always told to become an assistant and learn from the pro. But it seems with the current times, at least in Phoenix, that there aren't many openings for that. So with out those positions available to learn from a pro, these overly eager photographers may feel it is his or her only way.

 

[benlonghair]

I don't sell my photos yet. However, I am a salesman, and here's what I know. I work for a very small drywall products yard. Literally 1/4mi away, as the crow flies, is a Lowes. We were worried that it would hurt us, because they buy products much cheaper than us.

Well, I get people saying "Oh, I'll just go get it at Lowes, it's much cheaper there" and I say go ahead. The next time they need sheetrock, wether they're picking it up or we're delivering, they come to us, even if we're $2 more per sheet. Why? Value. We know the product better, we have better selection, our deliveries are professional and on-time and where they're supposed to be and people appreciate that. Sure, there are people out there that price is the most important thing, but there are more people who feel that overall value is more important. Those are the people we look for and any pro photographer should be looking for. Let the others go, because you'll never make them happy.