Camera Bodies

[tsaraleksi]

Err, Canons have two wheels too. Can we please stop trying to make some kind of broad based judgment on which camera company is better and admit it all comes down to personal preference?

 

[DRoberts]

Hmmmmm. Should I buy a Ford or Chevy?
Age old argument, with the same old responses. Canon people will tell you that there is nothing better than a Canon. And Nikon people will tell you the same about Nikon.
As stated earlier in this post...How much do you already have invested in Canon compatible gear? Is it worth replacing all your equipment? Is it it a better choice to sale your Canon equipment to offset the cost of swithing to Nikon? Those are questions only you can answer.
Myself, I started with Canon film cameras...shot with an AE1 up till last year when I got my first digital which was an EOS XT (350D). Just upgraded to the 50D. I am very pleased with it and the features it has.

 

[Village Idiot]

An interesting opinion, and one that comes at an interesting time.

Let me quote letter for letter a posting that I read on the net recently... and that I verified and can vouch as being accurate because I actually went and checked all the numbers myself, just so that I could be sure:

I wouldn't say that Canon glass is any better than Nikon... what I think is more correct to say, is that both have low and high end glass, and that if you are serious about your photography, you will move towards the higher quality glass irrespective of brand.

Which is a nice opinion. But I see a lot of photojournalist using 1D series cameras. Even the ones from the local papers are using them. Ergonominics is pure opinion as well other in that list.

 

[Village Idiot]

I don't see a reason why you could justify going to Nikon. You are not 100% decided to change camps, yet you want less noise at higher ISO.

Have you done something easier like still crank up the ISO to get the shot, but use a quality noise reduction program in PS CS3 like Imagenomic's Noiseware Professional? Noise Ninja is one step below and all other applications are beneath Noise Ninja in terms of performance vs detail final results.

I'd look into at that route before investing in a new Nikon body and new lenses.

A fast note about ergonomics... many people say its not important, but they are usually the ones who have sore shoulders, sore fingers, carpal tunnel issues and miss way more shots due to not being able to get the right settings in time before the moment is past.

Nikon ergonomics work for most people much better than Canon (Canon likes to hide several important menu options a few levels down, where Nikon adds a 2nd finger wheel for faster access), but Canon feels "good" in many people's hands, better than a Nikon. Ergonomics is very important... especially since you are going to be using it for several thousand or tens of thousands of pictures. You want to test them both out, it is very important.

I personally really could not get comfortable with a Canon layout, even after practicing diligently for about 2 hours... but that's just 2 hours, not over a year like me and my D200. This was also a main reason my next camera is a D700. Ergonomically, it's like coming home for me and I could pick up the D700 and start to make changes to aperture, ISO and shutter speed without even looking at the camera or giving it any thought. There is no great learning curve for me in my soon to come upgrade.

The rebel line doesn't have the second wheel for aperture control and other changes that have to be made in the menu. That's like saying Nikon isn't as good as Canon because not all lenses can focus with all of their cameras. It's just not a fair comparison and if you would look at the line up, you would see that only the d40, d40x, and d60 have that "issue".

 

[Harmony]

A fast note about ergonomics... many people say its not important, but they are usually the ones who have sore shoulders, sore fingers, carpal tunnel issues and miss way more shots due to not being able to get the right settings in time before the moment is past.

Nikon ergonomics work for most people much better than Canon (Canon likes to hide several important menu options a few levels down, where Nikon adds a 2nd finger wheel for faster access), but Canon feels "good" in many people's hands, better than a Nikon. Ergonomics is very important... especially since you are going to be using it for several thousand or tens of thousands of pictures. You want to test them both out, it is very important.

I personally really could not get comfortable with a Canon layout, even after practicing diligently for about 2 hours... but that's just 2 hours, not over a year like me and my D200. This was also a main reason my next camera is a D700. Ergonomically, it's like coming home for me and I could pick up the D700 and start to make changes to aperture, ISO and shutter speed without even looking at the camera or giving it any thought. There is no great learning curve for me in my soon to come upgrade.

I agree here. Since Canon's entry bodies are quite a bit cheaper than Nikon's, I tried forever to get used to the way they feel... with no success. It does all come down to what your prefer. So Tighearnach, really, try them out.

 

[frXnz kafka]

The rebel line doesn't have the second wheel for aperture control and other changes that have to be made in the menu. That's like saying Nikon isn't as good as Canon because not all lenses can focus with all of their cameras. It's just not a fair comparison and if you would look at the line up, you would see that only the d40, d40x, and d60 have that "issue".

Or maybe like saying Nikons only have one wheel for exposure adjustments, because the D40 and D60 only have one wheel

But just to entertain Jerry for moment, I'm curious what Canon hides in the menus that Nikon adjusts with the second wheel. As far as I know, the second wheel on the Nikon is simply for aperture control. I'm fairly certain Canon doesn't hide aperture controls in the menu (let alone "deep down" in the menu) on even the Rebel series.

But maybe I'm wrong, I only had my Rebel for a year.

 

[NateWagner]

well, yeah, to control the aperture on the rebel series just requires holding a button with your thumb while turning the wheel. Pretty basic stuff that can easily be done without moving head from eyepiece.

 

[Joves]

Actually in the Manual Mode the second wheel is for the shutter speed. Once you get used to using the two wheels adjustments are fast. The rear wheel in Aperture Priority will adjust the ISO, Exposure Compensation and, so on when the buttons are pushed. Not sure if Canon has it but, the D300 also has the rear focus button, which I have become so used to that I wonder how I did with out it.
Also the diffrence between Nikon and Canon glass in the upper end is not that significant. It is in the budget glass where Nikon edges ahead, from what I have read from peoples complaints in other forums. With either company if you have deep pockets then that would not effect you.

 

[anubis404]

Overall, I don't think one company is going to be better than the other. IMO, Nikon is ahead at the moment with their D3 and D700, but that will change in time. The lower end bodies of both have drawbacks. With Nikon its the lack of AF motor, and with Canon its their small, plasticy, uncomfortable grips.

As for the OP, stay with canon. It'll be much less of a headache to sell all those lenses and your body to switch over to Nikon. Canon's mid level bodies are good. However, if you only have the 400D and its kit lens, then you could switch to Nikon without too much trouble. Selling an XTI kit is not too hard on ebay. If you do, I would recommend the D300.

 

[JerryPH]

Err, Canons have two wheels too. Can we please stop trying to make some kind of broad based judgment on which camera company is better and admit it all comes down to personal preference?

Touchy touchy! I did say personal preference... however, I also said that Canon likes to hide some of their menu options deeper down than Nikon. That did not come from me, but from a 25 year Canon user who is now digital from the day Canon released their first digital and agreed on by another several full time Canon users.

I also said that more people prefer the ergonomics of Nikon over Canon... that also comes from at least 10 Canon owners in my club... "I love my Canon, but wish it felt more like the Nikon in terms of ergonomics and feel...". It is also something one reads commonly on some photography forums. It is not heresy, its just the opinions of some people. No need to shoot the messenger.

You think I would argue that ergonomics are anything BUT a personal preference? If so, let me clarify... .how something feels to someone is entirely individual. It is also not the main reason why some people choose the model they prefer, either.

I don't think we need to start a stupid brand war at this time. We all know where those end up in the end.

 

[JerryPH]

I agree here. Since Canon's entry bodies are quite a bit cheaper than Nikon's, I tried forever to get used to the way they feel... with no success. It does all come down to what your prefer. So Tighearnach, really, try them out.

Equivalent model vs model in the Canon and Nikon lines, I would not say one is cheaper than the other, they match up pretty close. In the top of the line models right now, as far as I am concerned, there are only 2 factors and 2 decisions to be made that help you decide what you want.

If you want maximum resolution, get a Canon.
If you want minimum noise at high ISO, get a Nikon.

All the rest is more or less preferences.

I don't need anything bigger than a 16 X 20, and that's REALLY stretching it. 12MP is enough to do that and way more than I need 99% of the time because 99% of the time I print sizes under that for slidshow video or album use.

About 75% of my shots are in low light or using strobes though, so my decision is a no brainer... Nikon D700 it shall be.

 

[frXnz kafka]

If you want maximum resolution, get a Canon or a Nikon.
If you want minimum noise at high ISO, get a Nikon or a Canon.

Just had to fix that.

 

[JerryPH]

Uh uh...

- A 12 MP camera cannot have the same resolution as a 20+ MP camera. Nikon has nothing over 12.1 at this time, Canon does.

- A 20+MP camera will not have the same noise reduction capabilities as a camera will less MP crammed into the same size sensor. That has already been proven.

So...

If you want maximum resolution, get a Canon.
If you want minimum noise at high ISO, get a Nikon.

Now if Nikon releases a D3x with 24mp on Nov 21st, that may change, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[gsgary]

It still comes back to the person pressing the button best cameras of any make don't make best photographers, in the end it is just a tool

 

[Village Idiot]

Uh uh...

- A 12 MP camera cannot have the same resolution as a 20+ MP camera. Nikon has nothing over 12.1 at this time, Canon does.

- A 20+MP camera will not have the same noise reduction capabilities as a camera will less MP crammed into the same size sensor. That has already been proven.

So...

If you want maximum resolution, get a Canon.
If you want minimum noise at high ISO, get a Nikon.

Now if Nikon releases a D3x with 24mp on Nov 21st, that may change, but I'm not holding my breath.

Actually, the noise reduction capabilities depend on the sensor and processor. I mean, if your comparison was true, a 10mp 40D would have worse noise than a 6mp D70 with both at 1600 ISO. That's not the case.