D700 Purchase Checklist Help....

[manaheim]

oh my god this needs to die...

 

[JerryPH]

Ok guys, back to a more friendly mode, ok?

Higher end = more complexity = a demand from the shooter to understand all this new stuff, and know how to use it.

And... if you thought ISO 6400 was amazing... how about a spoonful of ISO 25,600? :

EXIF Info:
Camera: Nikon D700
Exposure: 0.8 sec (4/5)
Aperture: f/16
Focal Length: 24 mm
ISO Speed: 25600

 

[JerryPH]

This has got to be the stupidest comparison ever. I've driven many cars. Put me in a ferrari and show me the controls and I can drive to the mall, grocery store, beach, etc...

That is the point I highlighted... you need someone to show you, you lack knowledge it will take effort to learn how to clutch that car so it doesn't stall for you at every light and make you look the fool... it takes additional work, you confirmed what I was saying all along. Also, one doesn't want to drive around a parking lot with a Ferrari, we want to push it... hard. If all you drive your life is a Pathfinder and I put you on a race track, and you don't know how to shift a manual car... you WILL be circling it in 1st gear at 2 MPH... how exciting... lol

One doesn't want to make just snapshots with a higher end consumer camera, we want PHOTOGRAPHS.

As for if I car or not if he purchases the camera, go back and look, I never said he should not. I did say he was in for a world of frustration because the D700 is very unforgiving if the holder is inexperienced... times 10 if they are weak in the basics of photography to boot.

Flash Harry mentioned gimmicks. NONE of the items I mentioned are gimmicks. If you do not understand those items and many more, you are not getting out of the camera what it can give you (still stuck in first gear).

 

[JerryPH]

And to say that nothing but pro glass can be used on it is crazy too.

Try doing evening shoots of wildlife with a 500mm F/8 lens. Now try that again with a F/4 lens... nice improvement. Now try that one last time with a camera that does acceptable ISO 6400.

The basic rule is that you invest in the highest quality glass BEFORE you upgrade the body. The basics of that rule say that if you have a good body and great glass, your results will be better than if you have a great body and mediocre lens. You are lowering the overall quality of each shot with crap glass on a good camera.

If you are going to buy a higher end camera, why put a kit lens on it and lower the quality of each and every shot you get out of it? I say THAT is crazy, not the other way around.

 

[manaheim]

I actually really agree with Jerry, but I still think it's all about budget.

If Donald Trump were posting on here saying "what camera should I get?" each and every one of us would likely tell him to buy a D3 or D3X and all three lenses of the holy trinity, plus a really good macro and a really nice fisheye. Why? Because we know this would be a drop in the bucket for him, so why the hell not?

However, both Donald Trump and our OP here would probably have the same issue... while they most certainly would be able to work both that camera and a lesser body effectively, there would be more to learn and to really make the camera sit up and bark on command.

If you consider how long it takes to learn photography (even when obsessing over it) that does make the more expensive camera seem a little crazy, but then if you really have the money should you buy a lesser body?

I think the only time I would say yes here is if the person was more concerned about making a transition from a camera with more "auto" capabilities... but at that point, even the D100,D200,D300 are going to throw you for a loop, so the argument between a D3 and any of the lesser "full body" cameras is really kind of pointless.

I will say that I have made transitions between D100->D200->D300->D3, and yes... there was a bit of learning the eccentricities of each model, but I was able to use each progressive better model well from the moment I picked it up, so while there are more capabilities in the better bodies, my lack of immediate knowledge of them did not limit my abilities so much as give me more headroom for things I could grow into as my knowledge expanded.

I'm a little tired so I realize I'm winding, sorry... consider all the above as data points.

So factor in all those datapoints and I come to this...

It's all about budget.

Assuming someone is ok with not having auto modes, they may as well buy the best camera in the line that they can afford. It will give them more capability that they can grow into over time, and by and large will be just as difficult to work the basics as any other full body camera in the line, with the notable exception of being a bit heavier. Certainly, the higher level body camera in the hands of a seasoned professional is going to produce WAY better results, but it's not like the unseasoned guy is going to do any worse with the D3 than he or she would with a D300.

It's all about budget.

 

[Flash Harry]

Ok guys, back to a more friendly mode, ok?

Higher end = more complexity = a demand from the shooter to understand all this new stuff, and know how to use it.

And... if you thought ISO 6400 was amazing... how about a spoonful of ISO 25,600? :

EXIF Info:
Camera: Nikon D700
Exposure: 0.8 sec (4/5)
Aperture: f/16
Focal Length: 24 mm
ISO Speed: 25600

And this is one of those great shots is it?

I settled for a D300, I use good glass, I've no complaints and no reason to go FF as I rarely have anyone request enlargements over 16 x 12, and this is the only reason to upgrade. Your menus are gimmicks, I admit, some are useful but like the D40 shooter with the super-tele, anyone with the knowhow of exposure/composition/aperture/iso/shutter can get many exceptional shots from any camera.

Within minutes of owning the 300, I had set it up and firing off test shots, I have tweaked it slightly since, set all buttons/wheels etc to suit myself but basically its a doddle and the 700 is no different, another good tool for the job, thats all. H

 

[Parkerman]

And this is one of those great shots is it?

I settled for a D300, I use good glass, I've no complaints and no reason to go FF as I rarely have anyone request enlargements over 16 x 12, and this is the only reason to upgrade. Your menus are gimmicks, I admit, some are useful but like the D40 shooter with the super-tele, anyone with the knowhow of exposure/composition/aperture/iso/shutter can get many exceptional shots from any camera.

Within minutes of owning the 300, I had set it up and firing off test shots, I have tweaked it slightly since, set all buttons/wheels etc to suit myself but basically its a doddle and the 700 is no different, another good tool for the job, thats all. H

I will actually disagree with you on one thing... Size wouldn't be the only reason for going full frame.. The low light capability is the reason I chose the D700 over the D300.

 

[Flash Harry]

We use flash over here, in low light if I don't want flash I meter then do a long exposure, I tend not to photograph living subjects in dark places without flash so the hi iso is not a major concern, last time 800iso medium format film for a winter wedding, outdoor only, otherwise I keep to 1-200 with no problem. H

 

[JerryPH]

And this is one of those great shots is it?

Have you even TRIED an ISO 25,600 shot???

Try... THEN speak.

 

[Flash Harry]

Go away fool. H

 

[JerryPH]

Go away fool. H

HAHAH! Reality really sucks for you sometimes, huh Harry? And you are the one that opened the door to make themselves look the fool. I will however just move on. My point's been made. Those of you that get it, get it. Those that do not... well, it realy doesn't make a difference either way.

 

[Flash Harry]

Are you for real? what sucks? I make my living from this crap and can see you on here spouting nonsense to these kids, who, I reckon, get it, those that don't are on your level. H

 

[manaheim]

I love the internet.

Let's all pig-pile on Jerry. That's constructive. Let's be sure to insult his photography too. Yeah, that's -awesome-. What else can we do here? Hm... I know! I'll state some stuff that's totally uninformed as absolute fact. That will win me some points.

There are a couple of you on this thread that should really consider listening more and talking less. Parkerman, in particular. If you stopped flapping your virtual gums for 10 seconds you'd stop ticking off some of the photogs on here that really have a lot to offer... Jerry included.

I'd try to post some kind of more level-headed reasonable post to see if maybe that would get people to think a bit before they went off on someone again, but I already tried that... and clearly here on teh Internetz, that's boring and not worth reading. So yeah. Shut your face and open your virtual ears for 10 seconds and maybe you'll learn something.

K?

K.

 

[LuckySo-n-So]

Let's all pig-pile on Jerry. That's constructive. Let's be sure to insult his photography too. Yeah, that's -awesome-. What else can we do here?

Well, he IS from Quebec--which is just one step above a Newfy....(J/K Jerry...:cheers

 

[Parkerman]

I love the internet.

Let's all pig-pile on Jerry. That's constructive. Let's be sure to insult his photography too. Yeah, that's -awesome-. What else can we do here? Hm... I know! I'll state some stuff that's totally uninformed as absolute fact. That will win me some points.

There are a couple of you on this thread that should really consider listening more and talking less. Parkerman, in particular. If you stopped flapping your virtual gums for 10 seconds you'd stop ticking off some of the photogs on here that really have a lot to offer... Jerry included.

I'd try to post some kind of more level-headed reasonable post to see if maybe that would get people to think a bit before they went off on someone again, but I already tried that... and clearly here on teh Internetz, that's boring and not worth reading. So yeah. Shut your face and open your virtual ears for 10 seconds and maybe you'll learn something.

K?

K.

Honestly, from what I have seen.. and checked out post/threads... All Jerry really has to offer is equipment C&C... Which I could care less about.. I hardly EVER see C&C anything in the actual galleries, but.. You never know.. Maybe I miss all that stuff.

And I really haven't posted all that much in this thread. 5 times... 6 including this one... All I wanted to get across is that the D700 isn't hard to use. I guess it is to SOME... but its not a FACT that it is a difficult camera to use. Sue me for disagreeing with your friend.



To the OP, Honestly, get whatever you want.. Go play with a D700, if you like it.. buy it.