Frustration with 3 light setup.

[tirediron]

We could all speculate endlessly on what the issues are and what you need to change... how about posting a diagram of your lighting/shooting set-up and a couple of the images with detailed info on what you see as the issues?

 

[tirediron]

You have to light both seperately, your backdrop (usually takes 2 lights to be even) then your model. I usually use 4, 2 for the backdrop, 1 main and 1 fill.

No, you don't. You can light them separately, but you do not HAVE to.

 

[c.cloudwalker]

You have to light both seperately, your backdrop (usually takes 2 lights to be even) then your model. I usually use 4, 2 for the backdrop, 1 main and 1 fill.

No, you don't. You can light them separately, but you do not HAVE to.

:thumbup:

Absolutely agree.

To Bossy: store your fourth light and work with only 3 until you can get a decent picture. Then, and only then, should you bring back out #4.

Then again, if you are doing the strobist thing, I'll shut up because I have no idea how to do that. I also happen to think that it is a waste of time mlearning the strobist ways. Nobody in their right mind in a real studio will do the strobist thing.

 

[tirediron]

To Bossy: store your fourth light and work with only 3 until you can get a decent picture. Then, and only then, should you bring back out #4.

Actually, I'll take that one further. Store three of your four lights and spend some time practicing with only ONE [Think: Dean Collins]

Then again, if you are doing the strobist thing, I'll shut up because I have no idea how to do that. I also happen to think that it is a waste of time mlearning the strobist ways. Nobody in their right mind in a real studio will do the strobist thing.

I'm going to strongly disagree with you here (to a point). If all you ever shoot is in a studio, with full studio lighting, perhaps. But today, very few photographers shoot that way. I think some of the tips, tricks, and techniques that can be learned from strobist type lighting are invaluable, especially for the location shooter who suddenly realizes that his 400w/s strobe has packed it in and all he's left with is a 'Bag o' Speedlights'!

 

[Bossy]

I get decent photos with 4, and I don't mind using the extra lights Thanks though

And we can agree to disagree about the lighting the backdrop seperately.

 

[Rephargotohp]

Why are you trying to Blowout gray? It's hard enough to get white high key white and not have Blow back spill on your subject and now you're trying to take gray there which will take another 2 stops at least of power???

And then why are you trying to do high key - which takes a lot of experience- just starting out?

Take it in steps,try a 1 light setup and get your subject looking good with one light, if you can't get that how you want, the rest won't come

 

[c.cloudwalker]

To Bossy: store your fourth light and work with only 3 until you can get a decent picture. Then, and only then, should you bring back out #4.

Actually, I'll take that one further. Store three of your four lights and spend some time practicing with only ONE [Think: Dean Collins]

Then again, if you are doing the strobist thing, I'll shut up because I have no idea how to do that. I also happen to think that it is a waste of time mlearning the strobist ways. Nobody in their right mind in a real studio will do the strobist thing.

I'm going to strongly disagree with you here (to a point). If all you ever shoot is in a studio, with full studio lighting, perhaps. But today, very few photographers shoot that way. I think some of the tips, tricks, and techniques that can be learned from strobist type lighting are invaluable, especially for the location shooter who suddenly realizes that his 400w/s strobe has packed it in and all he's left with is a 'Bag o' Speedlights'!

And I'm going to strongly disagree with you

There has always been plenty of amateur photogs doing it the half-ass way just for fun. And if that is what the OP wants, fine. I, however, will assume that the OP wants to learn the best way to do things, unless stated otherwise. Even with limited gear. And there are ways. And that's what I will try and teach rather than re-enforce the idea that one can do it with the Strobist way.

Now, of course, you can get some decent results that way but you will find yourself severly limited in no time. And there are strobes available that are no more expensive than some hot-shoe flash units. So why learn a half ass way instead of learning the right way from the start?

 

[gsgary]

I started with 3 lights but I never had more than one behind the subject. I don't think there is a need for it with real studio strobes (of sufficient power that is,) especially if doing head and shoulders as in the examples shown. One thing that is very important however, is to learn how to be satisfied with the results you can get with such a set-up so long as it doesn't interfere with the quality of the image.

For example, in gsgary shot, the background is nicely white but there is a definite lack of light on the front of the subject. By moving one the strobes off the background, you could have have had a nicely lit subject but your background may not have been perfectly white. Which is more important? Background or subject? The subject is imo.

The way I used to do head and shoulders type shots is very simple. A bare bulb strobe right behind the subject head which lights the background and also plays as a "hair light." You need to be careful about the positioning of your subject in this case because the strobe can show.

Another version of this is to put the strobe just over the highest part of the frame. Works better as a hair light but not as good as a background light as it may not be as even.

The choice of the background can also help quite a bit. Don't use white or if you do, don't worry if it is not quite white. I found it easier to use either a black background and not lighting it at all or, if black is too much, whatever color but still not light it. The lighter your background color, the lighter it will be in your shot but you can use the back strobe only as a hair light and get better results this way.

I never worked with flashes in the studio but just thinking of the size of the head I imagine it's going to make a fairly big difference in the results.

Hope this helps.

Yes on this shot the sitter is under exposed, it was towards the end and someone asked if we could shot a white background so i lit the background gave them a reading and let them light the subject i think it was a shoot through brolly because i was packing all my gear away

 

[c.cloudwalker]

Yes on this shot the sitter is under exposed, it was towards the end and someone asked if we could shot a white background so i lit the background gave them a reading and let them light the subject i think it was a shoot through brolly because i was packing all my gear away

I don't think you needed to explain yourself here. Those of us who know you know this is not representative of your work.

 

[gsgary]

Yes on this shot the sitter is under exposed, it was towards the end and someone asked if we could shot a white background so i lit the background gave them a reading and let them light the subject i think it was a shoot through brolly because i was packing all my gear away

I don't think you needed to explain yourself here. Those of us who know you know this is not representative of your work.

Cheers here a link to some of the shots they got, i think i will be setting it up once a month got some good feed back only problem i only took about 10 shots after they set the lights so i could give them an idea where they went wrong
News

 

[kundalini]

Ummmmmm, just thinking outside of the box (pun intended), if you're shooting head & shoulder shots, you can actually use your modifier as the white background. These were shot today for this excersize......... and I actually ironed the shirt!


Main metered at f/11 with 24x36" softbox and positioned at 45°x45° from the camera right. Fill at f/4 behind the camera and ~10" to the right, bare bulb in 7" reflector. Background was a 47" Octabox metered at f/2.2, ~42" behind subject. Lighting was PCB White Lightnings.

Thanks for giving me something to shoot today.



Hmmm, upon reviewing the posted photos, the whites of the originals don't look nearly as bad as they do here.

 

[gsgary]

Ummmmmm, just thinking outside of the box (pun intended), if you're shooting head & shoulder shots, you can actually use your modifier as the white background. These were shot today for this excersize......... and I actually ironed the shirt!


Main metered at f/11 with 24x36" softbox and positioned at 45°x45° from the camera right. Fill at f/4 behind the camera and ~10" to the right, bare bulb in 7" reflector. Background was a 47" Octabox metered at f/2.2, ~42" behind subject. Lighting was PCB White Lightnings.

Thanks for giving me something to shoot today.



Hmmm, upon reviewing the posted photos, the whites of the originals don't look nearly as bad as they do here.

You look like a real Dandy in those shots

 

[jwbryson1]

Ummmmmm, just thinking outside of the box (pun intended), if you're shooting head & shoulder shots, you can actually use your modifier as the white background. These were shot today for this excersize......... and I actually ironed the shirt!


Main metered at f/11 with 24x36" softbox and positioned at 45°x45° from the camera right. Fill at f/4 behind the camera and ~10" to the right, bare bulb in 7" reflector. Background was a 47" Octabox metered at f/2.2, ~42" behind subject. Lighting was PCB White Lightnings.

Thanks for giving me something to shoot today.



Hmmm, upon reviewing the posted photos, the whites of the originals don't look nearly as bad as they do here.

Those are some great images! Really like them. Just what I'd like to accomplish. I think I'll move to our unfinished basement and try my luck down there. Upstairs there is just no room for a studio.

 

[Alpha]

omg just Google three point lighting and lighting ratios. Why is there a multi-page thread about this?

 

[jwbryson1]

Just to give people like you something to whine about.