fstops, action shots, & depth of field

[dEARlEADER]

BZZZ! The AutoISO function doesn't work the way most people think. Even Thom Hogan suggests to not use it.

When I leave something to the camera, especially something like choice of ISO, it makes choices that I would not make in the same situation, and depending on what mode you are in (P, S, M, A), it does things VERY differently. Now I am not going to go into detail here as it is not necessary, but I do not suggest that the OP does this with the D700 if optimal quality are his primary goals.

Does it work, sure, but it is taking the lazy way out and your results will not be optimal compared to what they could be if you fix the ISO to a setting that you know will get the job done right and is as low as possible for best results.

Jerry, if you care to enough dispute a method as incorrect, at least take the the time to provide something convincing to prove the theory wrong. I did not advise the OP to use any other mode other than manual. Using this method is nothing close to a lazy approach. If anything, it might be superior because auto iso typically adjusts in smaller increments. You might lock a fixed ISO of 1600 whereas auto iso might use 1280 for that particular exposure. LESS NOISE. The excuse that auto iso reacts differently is different modes is no excuse not to use it. Learn how to use the camera and benefit from it's various features.

I don't use auto-iso all the time, but I have used it flawlessly several times where a fixed shutter/aperture combination is desirible.

 

[JerryPH]

If he wants DOF he should be in Aperture priority( i always shoot in manual the only time i am out of manual is when i'm shooting with 2 camera , main camera on manual ), and i would not use machine gun tactics, when i'm shooting dog agility my camera is set to shot one shot at a time i have found over time that you will get the shot before and after the shot you want

He wants both, but he NEEDS a minimum shutter speed. Shutter speed changes while in A-mode... NOT while in S-mode. Machine gun tactics have nothing to do with this... wait, maybe they even do a little. A fish flopping on the end of a line is in the air for a VERY brief time. His chances of getting "the shot" increase if he is blasting away at 8FPS vs trying to time it "just right".

For example:

You are not going to easily get a shot like above... and don't say that you can, becuase you see, I was in a room with 30 other photographers at a strobist meet, and NO ONE got a shot close to this... and I was firing away about 10 frames at 8FPS to get it, even then, it took 3 tries. Also, firing away gives you the ability to choose. Having one shot, gives you a simple yes or no choice and chances are... you will have way more "no's" than "yes" shots.

A lot depends on so many factors, but the shutter speed issue... is not a shutter speed issue as much as it is an ISO issue.

 

[JerryPH]

Jerry, if you care to enough dispute a method as incorrect,

"D", I did not say incorrect. I said it was not his best choice if he wants optimal picture quality. His shots are for magazine articles and precise control of the ISO will affect his pics.

Leaving the camera in this "point and shoot" method is just lazy and the camera will just choose the highest ISO based on the modes. I even said "Does it work, sure, but it is taking the lazy way out and your results will not be optimal compared to what they could be if you fix the ISO to a setting that you know will get the job done right and is as low as possible for best results"

The D700, in autoISO mode prioritizes the ISO over the other settings, depending on mode and almost always chooses a higher ISO than what is needed if making an exposure and acts differently in between the modes. In some cases, like the suggested Aperture priority mode, this can be disastrous... becuase it will max out ISO AND THEN slow down the shutter to speeds as low as 1/30th (or whatever your selected minimum shutter speeds are in the camera menus), just to get the exposure at your chosen aperture.

Now go from A to M mode without disabling the Auto ISO, and you are almost guaranteeing that the ISO will be WAY higher than you need... matter of fact, it will be pretty much always at whatever you always had it set at your higest ISO setting for... 3200 ISO for all your shots.

Again, Thom Hogan goes into 3 pages of explanations about the dangers of using AutoISO... if someone needs that explanation, they are welcome to get their own copy, I am not going to cut and paste that info here. They can choose to accept that it is a fact that Auto ISO is not the best choice for optimal quality pictures... or not, that is totally up to them.

 

[dEARlEADER]

"D", I did not say incorrect. I said it was not his best choice if he wants optimal picture quality. His shots are for magazine articles and precise control of the ISO will affect his pics.

Leaving the camera in this "point and shoot" method is just lazy and the camera will just choose the highest ISO based on the modes. I even said "Does it work, sure, but it is taking the lazy way out and your results will not be optimal compared to what they could be if you fix the ISO to a setting that you know will get the job done right and is as low as possible for best results"

The D700, in autoISO mode prioritizes the ISO over the other settings, depending on mode and almost always chooses a higher ISO than what is needed if making an exposure and acts differently in between the modes. In some cases, like the suggested Aperture priority mode, this can be disastrous... becuase it will max out ISO AND THEN slow down the shutter to speeds as low as 1/30th (or whatever your selected minimum shutter speeds are in the camera menus), just to get the exposure at your chosen aperture.

Now go from A to M mode without disabling the Auto ISO, and you are almost guaranteeing that the ISO will be WAY higher than you need... matter of fact, it will be pretty much always at whatever you always had it set at your higest ISO setting for... 3200 ISO for all your shots.

Again, Thom Hogan goes into 3 pages of explanations about the dangers of using AutoISO... if someone needs that explanation, they are welcome to get their own copy, I am not going to cut and paste that info here.

So you are saying you basically don't listen????

Nobody advised the OP to use Auto-Iso in any other mode save for manual.

In Manual, auto-iso will use fractional adjustments to bring your image to the correct exposure. This will often trump a fixed setting.

Auto-iso WILL NOT use the highest ISO setting for all your shots. This misinformation shows you have no idea what you are talking about, and that you have not physically tried the technique. Further, should you find auto-iso exposes too hot (or cold) your camera has a wonderful option called Exposure Compensation.

 

[JerryPH]

In Manual, auto-iso will use fractional adjustments to bring your image to the correct exposure. This will often trump a fixed setting.

Wrong. It uses the settings that you tell it to use via in camera menu settings or in certain auto modes it defaults to 1/3rd stops... nothing else "fractional". My D700 never gave me 1/4. 1/8th or 1/16 ISO "fractional adjustments".

Auto-iso WILL NOT use the highest ISO setting for all your shots. This misinformation shows you have no idea what you are talking about,

1 - I have tried it
2 - It does exactly as what Thom Hogan says it does. It will make choices that are less than optimal compared to what even a moderately knowledgeable person would choose in the same cases.

should you find auto-iso exposes too hot (or cold) your camera has a wonderful option called Exposure Compensation.

You need to learn that exposure compensation is not designed as a fine tune method for Auto ISO inconsistencies (something that I've never even heard of before). I have no over or under exposure issues, (do you have any issues with your D700? Oh.. you don't even own one. m'kay, that explains a few things.)... it's primary usage is for adjusting the tonal ranges so that black looks black, and white looks white... you know, that whole "the camera only adjusts to 18% grey" thing? That.

 

[Flash Harry]

The mag should have sent a photographer. H

 

[dEARlEADER]

1 - I have tried it
2 - It does exactly as what Thom Hogan says it does. It will make choices that are less than optimal compared to what even a moderately knowledgeable person would choose in the same cases.

You need to learn that exposure compensation is not designed as a fine tune method for Auto ISO inconsistencies (something that I've never even heard of before). I have no over or under exposure issues, (do you have any issues with your D700? Oh.. you don't even own one. m'kay, that explains a few things.)... it's primary usage is for adjusting the tonal ranges so that black looks black, and white looks white... you know, that whole "the camera only adjusts to 18% grey" thing? That.

oh boy... so many inconsistencies ...

You(and Thom) have tried it and it makes less than optimal choices. What does this mean? Then in the same post, you say you don't have over/under exposure issue's. If your auto iso is making less than optimal choices, then you must be getting an over or under exposed image. So which is it?

In manual mode, when you assign a underexposed aperture/shutter combination, you will see the result in your cameras meter through the viewfinder. When you activate auto iso, the camera simply applies the minimum amount of ISO required to bring the meter back to center. What is less than optimal about that????

Whatever you are proclaiming about the purpose of exp comp doesn't really make much sense either. Should the operator decide that camera center is not desirable, he/she can use exp comp to instruct the camera to apply more or less ISO value. Using the same scenario, if I would like to expose to the right I can assign a +0.7 exposure compensation. As the cameras aperture and shutter are locked, the only choice remaining is to increase the ISO past the point of a centered exposure.

To the OP, sorry to hijack your thread. I think I'm finished now.

 

[bluewaterjon]

Guys, thanks very much for the input so far. The thing about these fish is they are way less predictable- and ten times as fast- than any human, plus they are often erupting from places when you weren't even aware that they were there. They go berserk when they are hooked and try to thrash wildly to throw the hook, which they often do (don't worry we are releasing them anyway once we get them to the boat).
Harry, the reason they send me is that I am a writer and take good pictures. Photographers are cool to send, but most highly trained pro photogs that I know- and I have traveled with a bunch of them for shoots for Field & Stream & Nat Geo when I was appearing as the angler-most of them only shoot, they don't write as well. In contrast, photojournalists like me take pics to support the features they write etc. I may get less epic shots, % wise, out of a shoot than would a trained pro, but I get some great ones- from above and below the waterline.
Here's one from a couple weeks ago

 

[Samriel]

You need to learn that exposure compensation is not designed as a fine tune method for Auto ISO inconsistencies (something that I've never even heard of before).

Although I have not heard of it either, I find it an interesting concept. Could you elaborate on these Auto ISO inconsistencies a bit more, and how they negatively influence D's Manual Auto ISO concept (didn't read Hogan's opinion yet)? As far as I understood it, the light meter measures, and since the shutter speed and aperture are fixed, it will adjust the ISO as much as it is allowed. The exposure compensation is than used to fine tune the Auto ISO as you stated. So if the meter says that at f8 and 1/1000 the correct ISO (per Auto ISO) is 1600, than by setting Ev+1 the ISO should jump to ISO3200. Correct or not?

Of course full manual will give better control, but as we all know in circumstances where timing might be of critical importance a certain degree of automation might be preferred. Else nobody would use any of the priority modes, and we'd all be using our flash in full manual all of the time.