If prints were made from slides in 1960, would the lab have done the following?

Discussion in 'Photography Beginners' Forum' started by oldkodachrome, Oct 22, 2009.

  1. oldkodachrome

    oldkodachrome TPF Noob!

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    Hey,
    Go back to the year 1960 or 1961 and suppose you had some Kodachrome slides from which you wanted to have some color prints made (size 2-1/2 by 3-1/2 inches). Would the processing lab have torn open the cardboard slide holders to remove the film to make the prints?

    Were there several different ways a lab could have made prints from slides back then?

    We're having some debate as to when some slides were photographed and wondering if the dates written on the slide holders in ink pen by a now deceased family member are accurate, along with the little red-ink slide number in the top corner of the cardboard.

    I'm a complete newbie to photography and didn't find my answer in this Forum's FAQ, so anything you old dudes can tell me will be very appreciated! The answers to my previous Posting have been wonderful. Thanks folks!

    John
     
  2. Rekd

    Rekd TPF Noob!

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    Slides can be made from negatives any time, so the dates may not be accurate. Typically when slides are made (instead of prints) the date is written on them. My dad did it all the time, but we developed a lot of our own stuff. As for the portraits and stuff, yeah, the dates were pretty accurate. I'd be willing to be your are too, to some extent.
     
  3. Plato

    Plato TPF Noob!

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    I don't know of anyone that would have used Kodachrome to create slides from negatives. The latitude of +/- a quarter of a stop just doesn't hack it. Certainly your father never used Kodachrone for that purpose if he developed the film himself.
     
  4. Rekd

    Rekd TPF Noob!

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    I was referring to slides in general. :thumbup:
     
  5. Plato

    Plato TPF Noob!

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    Are you SURE that these slides are Kodachrome (as opposed to Ektachrome)? There is a REALLY REALLY BIG difference!

    I'm aware of two ways that Kodachrome was used to make prints. The less desireable method was to first take a picture of the slide with negative film (and create a so-called "internegative") and then use that negative to make a print. Obviously, you lost a lot of quality as well as the richness of the Kodachrome colors that way. As far as I can recall, that was the only way that Ektachrome was printed. The better way to print Kodachrome was a laser print directly from the Kodachrome slide. I had slides printed both ways and they always came back in the original holder. I have no clue if the holder was removed and then put back.

    Kodachrome slides should have the words "Kocachrome Transparency" and "Processed by Kodak" (with Kodak's logo) on the emulsion side. Because of the cost of the equipment, almost no one other than Kodak developed Kodachrome. If the text is right side up, the image is upside down. The date (top right) and slide number (top left) are machine-printed (black) on the non-emulsion side. As with the emulsion side, the "top" is with the image upside down.
     
  6. Plato

    Plato TPF Noob!

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    Actually, I suspect that the slides that the OP has are not really Kodachrome.

    Getting back to my earlier post... Just be aware that Kodachrome stands by itself and almost no generalization about slides can be assumed to apply to Kodachrome.
     
  7. newrmdmike

    newrmdmike TPF Noob!

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    i would guess the year is correct . . . people don't usually misdate things by the year, maybe a day or month, but not usually the year and if so only 1.

    edit: slide holder as in the container or as in the cardboard holder?
     
  8. oldkodachrome

    oldkodachrome TPF Noob!

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    I most definitely have KODACHROME slides. They have a red border on one side of the cardboard and the printing is as follows on the emulsion side (it is printed on both the top and bottom, one side up and the other side down): "KODACHROME TRANSPARENCY Processed by Kodak" On the shiny side of the film, it has "MADE IN U.S.A." which is upside down to the image viewed if held in your hand. They were made in 1955, 1956, 1957, 1958, 1959, 1960 and on and on up to around the 1980s.

    The slides in question are those made from 1955 to 1959. You see, I am scanning the slides, the transparencies you know, using a photo scanner and I'm trying to determine when a few of them were photographed. In 1961 or maybe 1962, a stack of prints made on photographic PAPER, you know, the kind of paper that snap shots are printed on, like billions and billions of paper photos are made with (got that?!), were made at some photo processing lab FROM THE KODACHROME SLIDES. I know that for a fact, because right here in front of my computer monitor, I have the slides (transparencies) and the PAPER PRINTS.

    Granted the paper prints are of poor quality, with washed out colors that look like crap. Even I know you can scan the slide and produce a much better quality paper print using even a cheap inkjet printer.

    So my original question remains unanswered: Would a processing lab in 1959 or 1961 or 1962, rip apart the cardboard slide holder to get just the 35mm strip of film just so they could make a paper print on paper? You see, my senior-citizen mother (and note that memories can fade & distort after 50 years), believes the slides were opened up by the lab, and then re-mounted into new cardboard slide holders with all new numbers and then my father wrote down in ink pen in the margin of the slide when they were taken (by him) and he likely screwed up all the dates, because the slides came back from the lab in a random order in new mounts.

    But I would really, really like to believe that there WAS in 1959, some technique whereby you could make a paper print of a slide without ripping apart the cardboard slide mount (or holder as I have been calling it).

    So might you know anything about the good ol' days about 50 years ago regarding making prints from Kodachrome slides?

    See? It's really a very simple question. Unfortunately, I just don't have any knowledge of film, photography, processing, lab chemicals, old techniques, and so on to even know where, when or how to go about finding an answer to my question.

    Kind Regards to all!
    John
     
  9. Plato

    Plato TPF Noob!

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    Now, I'm truly clueless regarding your question. Of course, your sarcasm didn't help.

    Toodle-Ooo!
     
  10. newrmdmike

    newrmdmike TPF Noob!

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    i for one loved the sarcasm because of this forums wolfish attacks on any people claiming some photographic ignorance, regardless if the ignorance is there.

    anyone older than 21 please correct this is your experience says otherwise
    color prints fade easily especially then, so perhaps they weren't bad prints, and perhaps other prints had been made that you don't have?(and they were torn for those other prints) or they all are torn? Either way i wouldn't associate tearing it with a industry standard. i also expect mine to be remounted when i have them printed. in my experience labs vary greatly and nothing is too crazy for them to do, so i wouldn't expect you can make any conclusion by the torn holders. . . perhaps your father tore them at some point ? who knows.
     
  11. Torus34

    Torus34 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    Kodachrome was spooled in 20 and 36 exp. Slides, when processed, were numbered sequentially in the order in which they were taken. It was a normal procedure to date a box of slides when they were received back from Kodak. The basic method for making a print was by using direct positive paper. If you wanted the very best, usually in multiple copies, and didn't mind the expense, the method of choice was dye transfer.

    Was there. Did that.
     
  12. Dwig

    Dwig TPF Noob!

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    You're right, everyone misread your first post and went of on a tangent.

    Labs very, very rarely would unmount a slide in order to make a print. The only time this would have been done would be by a high end custom lab, and then generally only to make an internegative.

    Kodak's own labs never printed unmounted slides; their equipment for printing on reversal paper was only setup to hold mounted slides. There were times when they would unmount and remount a slide before printing when the mount was damaged to the point that it wouldn't fit properly in the printer. These remounted slides would not be dated nor would they be numbered. They also returned to old mount so that you could copy off any markings you had made on it.

    If your slides are marked either "Kodachrome" or "Ektachrome" and "Processed by Kodak" and are date stamped you can rely on the mounts being original. The dates are, of course, the processing date and are often quite different than the date of the photograph (We never let dad live down the time he shot two Halloweens on the same roll). When Kodak made duplicate slides, they would be marked "Kodachrome Duplicate".

    BTW "About ATVs" and "Plato", while slides can be made from negatives it is a very rare occurrence and they will NEVER be marked "Kodachrome". Slides made from negs by Kodak are marked "Kodacolor". In fact it is impossible to make a positive slide from a negative with Kodachrome. Duping a negative on Kodachrome materials results in another negative.
     
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2009

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