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Discussion in 'Critique Forum Archives' started by ccd333, Jul 16, 2005.

  1. ccd333

    ccd333 TPF Noob!

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    Fellow photographer sizing up his next shot on Trail Ridge Road in Rocky Mountain National Park. He and I were the only ones up this early. I never talked to him.....he seemed very "focused" on his work!

    Panasonic Lumix FZ5
    ISO 80
    f/8
    1/30s
    B&W conversion
    Manfrotto 676B monopod

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Hertz van Rental

    Hertz van Rental TPF Noob!

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    Please could you read the Critique Forum guidelines here:
    http://www.thephotoforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23315
    What is it you would like people to comment on with regards to your picture?
    As it stands it properly belongs in the Photo Gallery.
    If you want a crit please edit your post to give us some indication as to what you want to know.

    Thank you.
     
  3. ccd333

    ccd333 TPF Noob!

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    Okay....

    1) Is there enough contrast for a good black and white shot?
    2) Is the image interesting? In other words.....does it make you want to be where the guy is standing?
    3) Is the composition strong enough.....or does it need cropped? Or made wider next time?
    4) Does the road and person in the image detract from what is ostensibly a landscape scene?
    5) Is there visible noise on YOUR monitor?
    6) Is it unfortunate that the photographer's color coordination for his choice of clothing is not apparent in the B&W conversion?

    I added the last one to be silly, of course. But I WISH there was an alternative gallery to post on. This one is TOO specific and the "Photo Gallery" is too general. Perhaps a compromise is in order?

    We've had these discussions before, I know. Probably ad nauseum for all I know. I don't have the time to read everything or look at every photo. This used to be a good critique forum IMHO....where someone could post a shot without need to "explain" what is wanted for critiquing. As it is, it seems too clinical. Too sterile. The spontaneity and the allowance for one's own sense (as a critiquer) of what to critique is, for all intents and purposes, taken away . And the "critiquee" has the burden of transposing that concept to the critiquer. I don't like that idea. I like letting the person looking at my post to come to their own conclusion as to what to critique. That way you get a wider array of comments. And I don't have to decide what to choose as the one who posts the image.

    And Hertz is the forum resident "attack dog". He is on your post faster than my camera shutter. I know, he will say I'm TOO sensitive. So be it. I'm used to it by now. I don't even care. I believe his fairly polite way of guiding you to the "rules" is his way of having control over what goes on here.....almost as if he is the moderator. I've never recognized his authority to be such, though I will confess it does "encourage" the other forum members to watch for non-adherence to said rules. I'm sure he will respond to this RIGHT AWAY.....he can't help himself! :) And I'm guessing he will remind me of the reasons for the rules.....and that he is merely helping out.

    I know I have other options....that is to go somewhere else. But I wanted to express my thoughts on the matter more explicitly......but I know I am not active enough here to have any clout to form policy. I guess I'm hoping that enough people will act, whether that is to support these statements.....or move on to another forum (no personal offense to those in charge here) to show their disapproval. It's not my intent to offend anyone here, but I stand by my comments.
     
  4. Hertz van Rental

    Hertz van Rental TPF Noob!

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    If you care to look at the bottom of the forum page where it has the moderators names you will see.... ooh, look. Two Mods ;-)

    Your comments are noted.
    The reason that we ask for an indication of a critique being required is that this Forum - in 'the good old days' - was a mess and just an extension of the Photo Gallery. The 'critiques' had degenerated into 'oh, wows' and smilies.
    It was decided that the Crit section needed to be got back on track so that it could start to be useful again.
    The consensus is that it is getting there.
    It would get there a lot quicker if people read the guidelines - and looked to see how others post - and then follow the example.
    An indication of a crit being required is asked for so that we know you intended to post the image here in the first place.
    This helps JonMikal and myself considerably. It also helps with responses - people have a starting point to work from.
    If you want people to give you help with your photography (which is what this Forum is about) then you have to give people an idication of what it is that you want help with.
    You don't have to be too specific. Try looking to see what other people write.
    If you realy do not want to put any comments with your picture but 'let the image speak for itself' then post it in the Photo Gallery. You will find you will still get some critical feedback.

    Does that make things any clearer?
     
  5. ccd333

    ccd333 TPF Noob!

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    I think it's clear, but I don't agree with it. I appreciate your reply, but frankly the Photo Gallery is diluted down to the point where you rarely get some good feedback. There are a different set of photographers that typically frequent that gallery.....and they are the ones who use the wows and smilies. As I stated I was hoping for a happy medium of the two. But I have no expectations about it and no illusions of being catered to.....I appreciate you trying to clarify your reasoning for the change. It might be working well for most, but it's not for me.

    Here's what I wonder (and then I'll go away, I promise).....why everyone couldn't just disregard the wows and smileys that seem to bother them (or was it just bothering you guys?), and concentrate on the reactions they valued (referring to the "old" critique gallery)? I think "messy" is okay as long there's something substantive contained within. And I think in the zeal to "clean things up" you made it difficult for someone to feel comfortable. I don't appreciate someone making things more linear and then being so vigilant about sticking to it (at least not in this case). But I think there are other forums where that is not the case, so thankfully I have my choices.
     
  6. ccd333

    ccd333 TPF Noob!

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    Despite the differences evident here, major props to the moderators for keeping this thread and allowing opinions to be vented.
     
  7. lazarus219

    lazarus219 TPF Noob!

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    I think it is fine for other members to outline the rules, as long as it is done in a friendly way and just points it out to them (you can only expect they don't know, otherwise the mods can deal with it)

    About your shot, because thats what you want to know

    I think the photographer is too small of an element- he dosent stand out enough in the frame to be the focal point. Maybe from a different spot you could have made a shot showing him to be insignificant to his surroundings.

    Do you have any closer versions?
     
  8. ccd333

    ccd333 TPF Noob!

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    Hi Lazarus. I have a bit of a closer shot from another angle....it's in color. You might like this one a little bit more....though, again, I didn't want to bother the guy in his element. Here is that shot....it's a smaller version of the B&W:

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Rod-UK

    Rod-UK TPF Noob!

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    For me its just a tourist shot

    "look where I've been" !!!

    But if its any help the b/w is better, the coloured one looks a bit artificial rather P/S-ish



    ____________________
     
  10. Shurikem

    Shurikem TPF Noob!

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    I think you have your right to opinion.... but I also think that a photo must be firstly liked by his photograph. I like this shot and, if you go look my shots you may say some things as ****ty as you just did. Excuse me for my language but my english isn't that good. Well my opinion is that if you have to say it sucks.... give us a reason....and yes a tourist photo does suck. I'm sorry again.
     
  11. Hertz van Rental

    Hertz van Rental TPF Noob!

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    Please play nicely, Shurikem, and keep on topic. We only crit the pictures here, not each other.
     
  12. ccd333

    ccd333 TPF Noob!

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    Thanks for the support Hertz and Shurikem. Just a quick reply to the "tourist shot".....I would agree if this was taken a few hours later. Trail Ridge Road is a tourist mecca during the day.....but in the wee hours of the morning there is hardly a soul up there. Makes it seem much wilder despite the nearby highway. The area has some amazing landscape opportunities....on this morning I took several with no sign of intrusion by man. As I said this gentleman and I were the only ones for several miles.....I would say that disqualifies it as a tourist shot.
     

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