Neutral Density Filters vs. GND filters for landscapes

[D-B-J]

I would not recommend a graduated ND filter for that purpose, because it isn't what it's made for. A solid neutral density filter is much more practical for that purpose, as it is exactly what it's made for.

I wouldn't even get a GND for its intended purpose, as digital photography allows for other tools, such as HDR or my preferred method, "manual" blending in Photoshop using Jimmy McIntyre's Luminosity Masks. If you have to get it all in one exposure (e.g. if you shoot for National Geographic, which I bet you don't…), a GND may be useful, though with the great dynamic range the Pentax K-3 provides in Raw files you may not even need it at all.

If I do go the multiple exposure route, I'm not sure how to spot meter on the K-3. You don't shoot Pentax by any chance, do you?

I don't, but there's no need to use spot metering for this. Look at the image on the LCD, inspect the color histogram (not just general brightness, but brightness for each channel) and see if that works for you. An even easier way to do this is with Live View. I think Jimmy McIntyre has at least one tutorial about how to shoot and set up the camera for digital blending.

I would not recommend a graduated ND filter for that purpose, because it isn't what it's made for. A solid neutral density filter is much more practical for that purpose, as it is exactly what it's made for.

I wouldn't even get a GND for its intended purpose, as digital photography allows for other tools, such as HDR or my preferred method, "manual" blending in Photoshop using Jimmy McIntyre's Luminosity Masks. If you have to get it all in one exposure (e.g. if you shoot for National Geographic, which I bet you don't…), a GND may be useful, though with the great dynamic range the Pentax K-3 provides in Raw files you may not even need it at all.

Could you elaborate? What "isn't the purpose a G-ND is made for", and while I agree that software gives us a lot more options than we used to have, there's a lot to be said for getting the image right in-camera.

Well, to answer that I will just use your own explanation, which summed it up pretty well:

A G-ND is used to "even" exposure, that is reduce the difference between a shadowed foreground and a bright sky (at sunset/rise) or similar situations by reducing the amount of light which passes through a portion of the lens. A straight ND filter reduces the amount of light passing through the lens evenly.

Buying one strong ND would be cheaper than buying a complete set of graduated NDs. For the kind of exposure lengths the OP wishes to use—around 20 seconds—stacking graduated NDs, each reducing up to 3 stops (I'm not aware of any GND that blocks over 3 stops of light, but please correct me if I'm wrong), may require more filter units than anyone would actually ever use as GNDs, balancing brightness between two areas in the image.

For the record, I've found GND's to be incredibly valuable. I can drop in up to 3 filters (usually two GND's and a strong ND) on a sunset shoot and get a perfect exposure right in the camera. I've not understood the desire to want to post process and tone map and layer together--the minute it takes me to set up the filters and get a perfectly exposed shot is sooooooo much nicer than the hour it might take to try and layer those images together later in the software.

Also, they do make 4 stop GND's, but those are more of a specialty item rather than a commonplace filter.

Also, I've used a GND inverted as an ND. It works well, and I've even gotten away with it on my
16-35 on a full frame sensor. So, they can be used as a regular ND, if need be.

ALSO, spot meeting is EXACTLY what you need if you want to get the proper exposure using filters or layering. You need to meter for the different spots, so they're properly exposed. Matrix metering or center weighted wouldn't work for this application.

In addition to the regular histogram (I've never used the colored histograms), also pay attention to your blinkies(the info that blinks when the highlights are blown). Those are infinitely useful when doing long exposures to make sure your highlights aren't clipped.

Cheers!
Jake

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Thans for the info...by inverting a GND do you mean covering the lens with the dark part of the GND?

Exactly!


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[Brendan O'Connell]

I would not recommend a graduated ND filter for that purpose, because it isn't what it's made for. A solid neutral density filter is much more practical for that purpose, as it is exactly what it's made for.

I wouldn't even get a GND for its intended purpose, as digital photography allows for other tools, such as HDR or my preferred method, "manual" blending in Photoshop using Jimmy McIntyre's Luminosity Masks. If you have to get it all in one exposure (e.g. if you shoot for National Geographic, which I bet you don't…), a GND may be useful, though with the great dynamic range the Pentax K-3 provides in Raw files you may not even need it at all.

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

 

[480sparky]

................I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

................................................................................

 

[medic2230]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

 

[Brendan O'Connell]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

 

[D-B-J]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

I'd wait until the holder comes in. No need to jeopardize the safety of the lovely and beautiful black glass.


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[Brendan O'Connell]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

I'd wait until the holder comes in. No need to jeopardize the safety of the lovely and beautiful black glass.


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Thanks. I'm going to wait now that I think about it.

 

[medic2230]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

I'd wait until the holder comes in. No need to jeopardize the safety of the lovely and beautiful black glass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks. I'm going to wait now that I think about it.

I think you made a good choice there. I remember a while back people were waiting months for the Big Stoppers to even come in so they could buy them. I'm sure you will enjoy using it more with the right equipment.

Nothing sucks more than dropping a expensive filter and watching it break.

 

[D-B-J]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

I'd wait until the holder comes in. No need to jeopardize the safety of the lovely and beautiful black glass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks. I'm going to wait now that I think about it.

I think you made a good choice there. I remember a while back people were waiting months for the Big Stoppers to even come in so they could buy them. I'm sure you will enjoy using it more with the right equipment.

Nothing sucks more than dropping a expensive filter and watching it break.

In my last workshop someone's filter holder came off and shattered their ND... And it hurt my heart.


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[Peeb]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

I'd wait until the holder comes in. No need to jeopardize the safety of the lovely and beautiful black glass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks. I'm going to wait now that I think about it.

What did you decide?

 

[Brendan O'Connell]

I think I'm going to go with the Lee Big Stopper. Instead of dropping another $100+ on the adapter, is it possible just to use rubber bands to secure the filter to the camera?

So you're saying you want to hang a $150 filter on the front of your lens with a rubber band?

You do realize that filter is glass and breaks easily right?

Do it right and get the filter holder for it. Spend once and be done with it.

I understand the danger, I meant to add in "temporarily" as I definitly will get the adapter.

I'd wait until the holder comes in. No need to jeopardize the safety of the lovely and beautiful black glass.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks. I'm going to wait now that I think about it.

What did you decide?

I'm going with the big stopper. For this trip I have a set of screw ins that work surprisingly well for the cost-no color cast- but I can't wait to try out the Lee

 

[grahamclarkphoto]

Hi all,
I have no experience with these types of filters, but I'm going to Ireland later this year and would like to get long exposures on the coast at sunset with that blurred water/cloud effect. I'd also like to get shots like this around my area. Knowing Ireland is usually cloudy but sunsets are bright, which would be better for me: a GND or ND filter? Also, what is a pretty versatile stop? I'm thinking maybe around a 6-stop ND? Pentax K-3 with wide angle lenses if that helps. Also, what are some affordable ($120 or less) brands? I know that some of the lesser quality filters often put a brown/blue tint to the photo, but this can be countered in post-processing, depending on the severity of it.

Thanks for the help!

Hey Brendan,

This is all you need:

1. 6-stop ND
2. 3-stop Hard Reverse GND
3. 2-stop Soft GND
4. Shutter release cable

At ISO 100 at F11 to F18 with 6-stops you'll be in the 2-4 minute range after the sun sets below horizon for sunset. Use Bulb at ISO F14, shoot for 2 minutes, check exposure, go up or down from there. Once you have it right add 15 seconds in-between exposures.

Examples below of the above settings + stuff, no photoshop.

That's it!

Graham

 

[thereyougo!]

Save up for the 6 stop little stopper too with the Lee system, it will be more flexible for evening and dawn shoots where light changes quickly. I would definitely have some grads too rather than just relying on software grads. Better to get it closer to correct in camera and then do a tweak in software rather than having to resort to using more drastic measures after the event. You will have more scope to change things if you are shooting in RAW. Also bear in mind that the histogram on your back screen is based on the jpg that the camera generates, not the RAW image. Live View will give you what the sensor sees, but on long exposures will eat your batteries for breakfast.

Bear in mind also that Lee Big Stoppers, although advertised as 10 stop can actually be darker than that. I've had two (one slid out of the holder and cracked all over) and they are quite different. You will get a colour tint with any 10 stop filter so really important to shoot in RAW. Also get used to shooting in manual focus. Will be worth getting a laser measure they are pretty small but very accurate so you can work out your hyperlocal distance as it gets darker - oh and a torch for finding your way from the beach.

The West Ireland coast is stunning. But wet. Make sure you have plenty of wet weather gear and thermals - yes even in 'summer'