New KP

pez · Feb 28, 2017

smoke665 said:
@pez on the K3ii (also on K3) i can't find a definitive answer on if the High ISO noise reduction works on a raw file. I recently tried mine with it on and off. To me the raw files with it on looked like there was less color noise.

I don't think there is any noise reduction in raw, certainly not by default. But pretty much always in jpeg. I didn't think any tweaking was available in raw in the camera except after the exposure if you convert it to a jpeg.

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smoke665 · Feb 28, 2017

I know some settings will affect the raw and some JPEG only. In the case of Highlight/Shadow correction, the highlight correction does affect the RAW file - basically the camera underexposes by a stop (it tells you that it is using for example ISO200 when it is actually exposing at ISO100), calculates the maximum highlight value(s) and then offsets (scales by histogram shift) the data so that the highlights are just clipped before writing the file. It works most of the time, unless the highlights are already clipped even with a stop of underexposure. You can get the same effect by underexposing and then correcting in post-processing. The shadow correction on the other hand only affects JPEGs - it tweaks the response (alters the gamma mapping) at the dark end, expanding the blacks. In the case of High ISO noise reduction, there's nothing in the book, and one source says it affects the raw file, and another claims it doesn't. As I said it "appears" to me that it decreases the color noise, but not the noise.

pez · Mar 1, 2017

smoke665 said:
I know some settings will affect the raw and some JPEG only. In the case of Highlight/Shadow correction, the highlight correction does affect the RAW file - basically the camera underexposes by a stop (it tells you that it is using for example ISO200 when it is actually exposing at ISO100), calculates the maximum highlight value(s) and then offsets (scales by histogram shift) the data so that the highlights are just clipped before writing the file. It works most of the time, unless the highlights are already clipped even with a stop of underexposure. You can get the same effect by underexposing and then correcting in post-processing. The shadow correction on the other hand only affects JPEGs - it tweaks the response (alters the gamma mapping) at the dark end, expanding the blacks. In the case of High ISO noise reduction, there's nothing in the book, and one source says it affects the raw file, and another claims it doesn't. As I said it "appears" to me that it decreases the color noise, but not the noise.

Wow, this issue is apparently multi-faceted. I posed the question over on Pentax Forums and got some interesting answers...

smoke665 · Mar 1, 2017

@pez

And now you see, what I was saying. The settings that I verified that do/do not work on the raw are from Pentax documentation, various references in sites like Imaging Resources, and trial and error. On settings that do, I haven't been able to beat the camera by choosing one of the manual settings (low, medium, high) vs auto in terms of picture quality. That's probably because of my experience level and a lack of understanding on the actual effect of each setting. I posted a link a few days ago in the Pentax section here that is one of the most detailed reads I've seen on how Pentax works. If you haven't read it, I would suggest do so. Pentax K-3 II Review - Exposure
One other thing I noticed here was that some features such as saturation, hue adjustments in camera were not applied to the raw image but we're included in the Metadata such that LR will give you the option of applying those features.

Footnote: Part of the problem is that there is some speculation that even with this feature turned off - there is at least some noise reduction applied that would affect the raw file.

pez · Mar 5, 2017

In the menu, under noise reduction, for Slow Shutter speed NR and also for High-ISO NR, there is Auto, custom, and Off. If it still applies NR on the off setting, that would constitute a breach honesty on the part of the manufacturer...

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smoke665 · Mar 6, 2017

pez said:
In the menu, under noise reduction, for Slow Shutter speed NR and also for High-ISO NR, there is Auto, custom, and Off. If it still applies NR on the off setting, that would constitute a breach honesty on the part of the manufacturer...

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Maybe we are talking semantics here, but by virtue of the sensor design, the improved CPU and software, your KP is able to offer significantly less noise then my K3II from the start.

I still haven't been able to get a definitive answer on the High ISO Noise Reduction feature and it's affect if any on the raw file. I posted this question on the PF and got one response. The respondent claimed "it did not" affect the raw file, but when I asked for him to cite references for that claim there's been no other response. The respondent did confirm what I already knew:

Highlight Correction "WILL" affect the raw file, because it underexposes the image, but I'm still not sure his explanation that it increased ISO to compensate is correct. Seems to me that a highlight blown because of oversposure would still be blown.
Slow Shutter Speed "WILL" affect the raw file. The explanation given by the respondent that it (takes and extra exposure and subtracts hot pixels from the image) is not verified. This is the first explanation I've seen of how the feature works.

pez · Mar 7, 2017

Well anyway, the KP is way fun to use, and all the little things it does well add up to a truly great walk around camera. The 20-40 Limited makes a perfect companion for it, BTW.

pez · Mar 16, 2017

Solarflare · May 10, 2017

Whow ! These are really good product images !

jcdeboever · May 10, 2017

Handsome hardware.

pez · May 10, 2017

That's the largest grip on it. I've since gone to the medium one. I love the night display mode for astro and general night photography.

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