Pricing advice kindly appreciated!

[Ruth Ellen Brown]

I'm a product an lifestyle photographer based in the UK, I have 7 years training in fine art with photography from one of the most renowned art institutions in the UK, since graduating with a masters degree, I worked professionally as a commercial photographer for 4 years, in a high-end photography studio shooting for some renowned brands and have been published in several magazines. I also work as an ambassador for The Prince's Trust of England, giving talks on photography, e-commerce, business and creativity UK-wide.

Recently I have gone freelance and I'm wondering what I should be charging for my services (I suspect I should be charging more than my hourly rate at the studio I was employed at). My employed salary was very low and now I am concerned about under-selling myself as a freelance photographer.

Would anyone be kind enough to take a look at my website and guess a ball-park figure as to what kind of might be a reasonable charge for this kind of quality, level and experience of work? I do product, styled product and lifestyle photography.

Thanks so much in advance, my website is www.ruthellenbrown.co.uk

 

[The_Traveler]

In any big city in the US, I think you would be getting many,many multiples of your current daily rate.
Your site is elegant, your work is impressive and commercial (in a good way).

 

[tirediron]

Ruth Ellen - I've taken the liberty of moving your thread into 'General Shop Talk', where it will hopefully see a little more traffic. Lew's comments are spot on. You should be thinking of increasing that 70 pounds by 10-20% and using that as an HOURLY rate*! You have very nice work, great presentation, and an all-around solid, professional and skilled appearance.

*I say that based solely on what I see of your work, and what I would expect someone in my area with commensurate skills to charge; I have no idea if the market in your area would bear that charge, but from what I recall of UK prices, a SIGNIFICANT increase is in order!

 

[sm4him]

OP: I haven't even LOOKED at your website yet (but I will), and I really have no pricing advice, as I'm struggling with that myself (only in a theoretical, what if I started…sense), but I can tell you this:

If ^^^^THOSE two guys^^^ think your work is outstanding and you should charge more, you should definitely pay attention!

 

[Ruth Ellen Brown]

Point noted! Thanks!

 

[Gary A.]

'Freelance' pricing is not only dependant upon quality of work, but all what the market can bare and 'credentials'. Especially the latter. Most/all who are entering a marketplace as a new entity typically price themselves low to establish a clientele/customer base, then work their way up the the pricing scale. Unfortunately having a master and working for someone else does offer a lot of currency in the credentials department. While it does help and it does put you a leg up on other photographers of equal photographic skill who haven't a masters or worked for a 'master' photographer. In turns of freelance, do you mean work for yourself part time on the side or you're gonna give it a go as your own business?

In the beginning I would price myself on the lower end of the freelance scale (certainly not the end ... but lower than what you're wishing for). Starve for a year or so then who your way up. All new businesses are a tough go. Photography is one of the toughest. In the photography business, marketing and aggressive/good business practices are more important than photographic skill. If you have both, then you are very well positioned to succeed.

Good Luck,
Gary

 

[Ruth Ellen Brown]

Well, I went freelance a year ago after quitting the photography studio, and since then, my first year in business turned over just over £8,000, and this year it's doing a lot better, but I kept my pricing low to attract customers and through speeding up my process and adding value, I've managed to give myself an 'organic' pay rise whilst customers feel they are getting more value than ever and my current day rate is £150. But I still feel I am undercharging, and I personally value the work I do at around three times this amount, but I've been advised to value it even more than that. I think it can be a psychological rut - if you start cheap, the clients don't value you, and when they don't value you, you worry it might be because you're not 'worth' what you're charging.

 

[sm4him]

Yeah, from what I understand there are two schools of thought on this:

1. Start out on the lower end of the pricing scale, in order to generate business.
2. Determine the price you *should* be charging and stick to it.

I'd tend to go more with the latter, particularly given that you clearly have the skills. The danger, in my opinion, of the first strategy is that once you've started out charging on the lower end of the scale, you begin to attract clientele who are comfortable with that pricing. Then you increase your prices and you lose them and have to start all over trying to attract the clientele that you were really interested in gaining in the first place. It's rarely very easy to convince someone who is used to paying $100 for something to suddenly be okay with paying $300 for the exact same thing (just using those numbers as examples, not as realistic prices).

Do you know what your CODB is? If not, that's your first step, imo. Know what it is COSTING you to do business, and make sure that your fees are at least covering your costs (and that includes a salary). Otherwise, you're losing money every time you shoot.

 

[tirediron]

... I still feel I am undercharging, and I personally value the work I do at around three times this amount, but I've been advised to value it even more than that. I think it can be a psychological rut - if you start cheap, the clients don't value you, and when they don't value you, you think you're not worth what you're charging them and suddenly you can't pay the bills anymore.

I guarentee you that you are under-charging. Even three times your current rate (let's call that $700 CDN) would be below the mean for quality commerical work in my area.

 

[Ruth Ellen Brown]

Thanks for the encouragement and for taking the time to look at my site - it's always difficult to move from a job that tells you 'this is what you are worth' to defining your own worth according to the market. I'm not sure if the U.S. has higher prices than the U.K, as I think the U.K is still laggin behind the U.S somewhat with the recession, but I am undergoing a serious rethink of my prices now!

 

[Ruth Ellen Brown]

I worked out that my absolute minimum should be £12,000 a year and my ideal wage (i.e. I have some spending money) should be £22,000. I tend to put a third of my earnings back into the business for equipment at this stage as I'm in the building stage as well, so it's a bit tight on the cash front for a bit, which is why I'm feeling like there has to be a better way!

 

[tirediron]

Thanks for the encouragement and for taking the time to look at my site - it's always difficult to move from a job that tells you 'this is what you are worth' to defining your own worth according to the market. I'm not sure if the U.S. has higher prices than the U.K, as I think the U.K is still laggin behind the U.S somewhat with the recession, but I am undergoing a serious rethink of my prices now!

If you haven't already done so, it is IMPOSSIBLE to over-state the importance of Sharon's (sm4him) comments with respect to doing your CODB calculations, and using those as the MINIMUM for your prices!

 

[Gary A.]

If it was my biz ... and if I had been established for a year ... I'd raise my pricing. But, my return customers would enjoy:

1) no price increase; or
2) a discount rate to return clients based upon my new customer pricing.

Gary

 

[Ruth Ellen Brown]

Good advice Gary.

I think it's important to me, that my existing clients enjoy the benefit of no price increase. The ones that are good enough to come back to me time and time again. I could even send out a bulletin about price increases, while stating that it will not apply to existing customers, as loyalty is important to me.

 

[bratkinson]

Figuring out your cost of doing business (CODB) is absolutely essential. MLEEK, a former forum member here wrote an excellent article on calculating CODB. Here's the link: Finding your CODB and your hourly rate... | Photography Forum

Perhaps the biggest mistake one can make in their own business is not knowing what things cost to produce. I tried dabbling in real estate 25 years ago and lost my shirt (and almost my house!) as I had grossly underestimated what my costs were going to be. Fortunately, it was a 'side business' and my day job kept me from declaring bankruptcy...by just a hair!