should i upgrade my gear??

darich · Sep 10, 2006

Hi guys.
I was originally thikning of upgrading to a 1Ds MK II but to be realistic about it, it's too much money to spend on something i do for a hobby.
So I'm now thinking about the 5D.
But the question is should i spend the money - somewhere around £1500 on one when i already have a perfectly good 20D. I have L series glass except for my EF-S 10-22 which i know will not fit the 5D. So I'm also kinda thinking that i mightkeep the 20D as a back up for wide angles.
The 5D has an extra 4-5mp and a full frame sensor so is the jump in quality big enough to justify me buying one?

what do you all think?

thanks
David

Digital Matt · Sep 10, 2006

It all depends on how important it is to you. It's definitely a worthy upgrade, imho.

LWW · Sep 10, 2006

It's your money. I would sink it in glass and printers.

LWW

darin3200 · Sep 10, 2006

Have you reached the limits of your equipment?

darich · Sep 11, 2006

have i reached the limit? if you mean do i use all the functions and want more then it's probably no. i do know how to use them all but most of the time i choose not to.
I'd rather not buy more lenses at the moment - the ones i have are as good as they come (L series) and my focal range is perfect for what i need. I also feel it's cheaper and easier for me to email my shots to a lab and they send me a print back.
The real thing I'm after is increase in picture quality at large image size. i've sold several images at 30inches by 20inches which means a lot of interpolation in CS2 from the 20D original. The quality is great at smaller sizes but i can see it starting to drop as i get towards that larger size.
Having a larger original would mean less interpolation and therefore higher quality image at the end. I also know the full size sensor will improve the quality but i don't know how much.

Orgnoi1 · Sep 11, 2006

I will leaveit to you like this... I have the 5D... and currently selling my 20D which was my backup... I would keep the 20D for sure, and if you want a camera that shoots really incredible pics... the 5D certainly fits the bill... it amazes me still every day with its clarity...

Rob · Sep 11, 2006

What would sell it to me is more the extra width of the full-frame sensor, and most importantly, easier composition/view through the viewfinder... Whether that's worth £1,500 - a 20D is only a question you can answer!

Rob

darich · Sep 11, 2006

Orgnoi1 said:
I will leaveit to you like this... I have the 5D... and currently selling my 20D which was my backup... I would keep the 20D for sure, and if you want a camera that shoots really incredible pics... the 5D certainly fits the bill... it amazes me still every day with its clarity...

i was actually considering keeping the 20D as a back up and also because my 10-22 EF-S lens wouldn't fit the 5D.
Selling the 20D and that lens probably wouldn't net me enough to buy the super wide angle lens i'd love on the 5D and almost certainly not the 10mm min focal range i currently have.
Going by your quote it seems you think the 5D blows the 20D away in terms of quality?

Rob - the full frame sensor is a big draw for me but just how much would it improve quality if everything else was equal? I know there are a few extra megapixels but how significant is the change in sensor size?

Digital Matt · Sep 11, 2006

darich said:
Selling the 20D and that lens probably wouldn't net me enough to buy the super wide angle lens i'd love on the 5D and almost certainly not the 10mm min focal range i currently have.

The 10mm focal length you currently have is really 16mm on your 20D. The Canon 16-35 is abotu $1400 new. I'd bet you could get close to that from selling a 20D and that lens.

ksmattfish · Sep 11, 2006

darich said:
The real thing I'm after is increase in picture quality at large image size.

If picture quality at large print sizes is most important then your best bang for the buck is medium format film or large format film. Any format 6x7cm and larger will blow away 12 mp for large prints, and you can get it for a fraction of the cost of a 5D. The 5D is a really nice camera though.

Orgnoi1 · Sep 11, 2006

Digital Matt said:
The 10mm focal length you currently have is really 16mm on your 20D. The Canon 16-35 is abotu $1400 new. I'd bet you could get close to that from selling a 20D and that lens.

I used to look at it this way also... but it isnt true... your CROP gives you the effect of being 16mm... but it is ideally still a 10mm lens. The only thing that really is effected is the field of view...

I currently shoot with a 1D Mark II and a 5D...I would have to say in the quality aspect... that if its something like scenery, or a genre of photography that doesnt require fast shutter or fast multi shutter the 5D wins hands down in quality of shot...even against the 1D Mark II... When I am out shooting trains (my main hobby shoot) I two-gun it... usually with the 1D Mark II/100-400L or 70-200L and the 5D/24-70L... and I will only put away the 5D first if the weather starts getting bad... and thats it...

Digital Matt · Sep 11, 2006

Orgnoi1 said:
I used to look at it this way also... but it isnt true... your CROP gives you the effect of being 16mm... but it is ideally still a 10mm lens. The only thing that really is effected is the field of view...

I understand that it is a crop factor, and not a mulitplication factor, but however you look at it, you are only getting 16mm, and not 10mm. There is no point in looking at it like 10mm, when you are not getting 10mm. If he puts a 10mm lens on a 5D, he's not going to get the same look that he's used to with a 10mm on a 20D.

darich · Sep 11, 2006

Digital Matt said:
I understand that it is a crop factor, and not a mulitplication factor, but however you look at it, you are only getting 16mm, and not 10mm. There is no point in looking at it like 10mm, when you are not getting 10mm. If he puts a 10mm lens on a 5D, he's not going to get the same look that he's used to with a 10mm on a 20D.

i thought the point of the EF-S lenses was to ensure that with the crop factor you would still get the stated focal length without multiplying by the factor. i always assumed that my 10-22 was actually 10-22 because it was EF-S and not EF.
The crop factor/focal length is another topic though - it seems that the 5D produces amazing images.
As for MF or LF - it's a side issue aswell - should i upgrade from my 20D?
the feeling I'm getting is that it would be worth it.

thebeginning · Sep 11, 2006

darich said:
i thought the point of the EF-S lenses was to ensure that with the crop factor you would still get the stated focal length without multiplying by the factor. i always assumed that my 10-22 was actually 10-22 because it was EF-S and not EF.
The crop factor/focal length is another topic though - it seems that the 5D produces amazing images.
As for MF or LF - it's a side issue aswell - should i upgrade from my 20D?
the feeling I'm getting is that it would be worth it.

I used to think that too, but it's not true, 10mm is 10mm on an EF-S lense.

i've always thought it was silly to buy expensive cameras as a hobbyist, but that might just be me. I usually go by this...'if you can make immediate profits or it can HELP you make immediate profits more easily, then it is worth a buy'. if that doesnt apply it gets a littel tougher. if you print bigger, yes, the 5d will do a better job. how often do you print? I know clients arent quite as particular about printing quality as some of us 'photo people' are, so they might still be very pleased with 20d images. i know many pros still use nikon's d2h, d1x, and 1d cameras, each of which has less than 5 megapixels. If you are getting complaints then yes, it is time to upgrade. if not, and you are fairly pleased with what you have now, there really is no need to.

Digital Matt · Sep 11, 2006

darich said:
i thought the point of the EF-S lenses was to ensure that with the crop factor you would still get the stated focal length without multiplying by the factor. i always assumed that my 10-22 was actually 10-22 because it was EF-S and not EF.
The crop factor/focal length is another topic though - it seems that the 5D produces amazing images.
As for MF or LF - it's a side issue aswell - should i upgrade from my 20D?
the feeling I'm getting is that it would be worth it.

The purpose of the EF-S lens mount is to let the lens protrude farther into the body. It allows them to make super wide angle lenses cheaper, and lighter, with fewer elements. It doesn't change the fact that the sensor is not the same size as a 35mm negative. The DSLR is based on the 35mm format in order for it to use normal 35mm lenses. You can't switch formats mid stream.

I realize this whole crop factor is another issue, but I think it's one to consider when buying a full frame camera. It's really one of the major perks to getting the 5D.