The ignorance of people outside of the industry

[craig]

I feel your pain for sure. We have all been there in one form or another. It is good that you posted your feelings. Ranting or venting your frustrations helps in many ways. The most important thing to realize here is that there are no excuses in photography. You get the shot or you don't. Next time you will do your very best no matter what the circumstances. At that point people can say or do what they want to and you will still be proud.

Love & Bass

 

[mrodgers]

So, you didn't read the complaint at all, did you? The issue isn't that the lady didn't want her photo taken. It's that because of one bad photo a group of people suddenly thought I was a terrible photographer and shouldn't be working for a newspaper.

Her, or anyone for that matter, not wanting a photo taken is just an inconvenience that led to the issue my rant was about.

No, I read, but at the point when someone stated....
"If someone doesn't want their picture taken, show them some respect and don't take it.
The thread took a slight turn and jumbled the original intent up a little for me.

I stand corrected, sir. :blushing:

But just for the record, when you are a photojournalist, a public figure not wanting a photo taken can be a very big issue. Everyday folk not wanting their photos taken is not a problem.

And just for the record, whether a public figure or everyday folk, there is still no law that states someone has to allow a decent photograph of themselves if they want to attempt to deny someone photographing them.

 

[Senor Hound]

No, I read, but at the point when someone stated....
"If someone doesn't want their picture taken, show them some respect and don't take it.
The thread took a slight turn and jumbled the original intent up a little for me.

I stand corrected, sir. :blushing:

And just for the record, whether a public figure or everyday folk, there is still no law that states someone has to allow a decent photograph of themselves if they want to attempt to deny someone photographing them.

There's also no law saying you can't take a horribly unflattering shot of them when they refuse to oblige, and then take the photo and make it look like she's having an affair with a Chippendale dancer...

 

[JerryPH]

Thats a little bit of the paparazzi mentality, that the photographer has the RIGHT to take a picture of someone whether they want it or not merely because they are in a public location or a person of some fame.

I believe that all people rich or poor, famous or absolute no-bodies have the right to ASK to not be photographed if they do not wish to be, and when they openly show that this is their wishes... the person behind the lens should back off.

However, if that is their stance all the time, it is also time for them to very seriously reconsider their chosen profession or raison d'etre for needing to be photographed outside in public... because no matter their desires, it is part of the price one shall pay to be where they are... willingly or not. So, if a photographer cannot get a close one pic, another one will "sniper" you from a distance without your knowledge or ability to yell and scream and make faces as you are being captured in all your radiance... lol.

I guess I can see it from both sides.

 

[Joves]

If someone doesn't want their picture taken, show them some respect and don't take it.

Then the woman should get a job in a private industry. As a now public figure she has lost her option to privacy at public meeting. Or she could do the arab thing. :twisted:

 

[tirediron]

Then the woman should get a job in a private industry. As a now public figure she has lost her option to privacy at public meeting

I'm not familiar enough with the details of US law to debate this issue with you.

Or she could do the arab thing. :twisted:

Do you really think this comment is appropriate?

 

[abraxas]

There's also no law saying you can't take a horribly unflattering shot of them when they refuse to oblige, and then take the photo and make it look like she's having an affair with a Chippendale dancer...

Or, as I did- I have a local community site for a little mountain village I work in. The local chamber of commerce has some members that don't like me for a few reasons, but none I feel are justified. I like the little town despite them. Since 90% of the town's business is on a little street about 2 blocks long, everybody knows what I look like.

Last year, one of the sacred cows of the chamber decided to try to screw up some of the July 4th parade photos I was taking. I saw what she was doing so I started making faces back and laughing at her. So I snapped this.

I call it: STOP THE MUSIC!

I thought it made her look a bit like an overfed crack whore. I ran it on the top page of the site for three months and made sure it got a good 100,000 views before I took it down.

I don't know if it changed anything as this year I had other things to do, but in a town so small and gossipy, I'm sure she seen how she looks to the camera's discerning eye.

Glad I don't work for anyone but myself too.

 

[tirediron]

There's also no law saying you can't take a horribly unflattering shot of them when they refuse to oblige, and then take the photo and make it look like she's having an affair with a Chippendale dancer...

I'm pretty sure there are laws against that!

 

[LaFoto]

Well, after a while I stopped reading all the comments given so far, Hooligan Dan, but want to say my little piece, all the same, which is only to say that - even though I'm definitely not into PJ - I know what it feels like when you suddenly find your credibility as a photographer put into question - by ANYONE, no matter how stupid that someone can be. It hurts. It gets to you. And what you need is some encouraging words by others who understand and who pick you up from where such silly comment left you. Haven't I posted something similar only a short while ago? Look . With me it was a silly photo contest and the silly remark of a silly person who did not believe I could possibly have taken that photo in the way I took it, and it GOT TO me. I couldn't help my inner reaction. I felt hurt. And it was Post 5 in that thread, where someone put into words what was actually happening, i.e. that my credibility as photographer was publicly doubted, which helped me move from a purely emotional to a more rational reaction.

So this is just to say that I sure see where you are coming from in your need to vent a little. I'm glad to hear that some colleagues have meanwhile come to your side and said how silly those remarks were.

 

[Ben-71]

Ah... Your job is to get a pic'?
- You get a pic'. A good one.

"I didn't do my homework because – a) I was sick, b) The dog
shredded my notebook and c) I forgot all about it" - has no room
in photojournalism, and in quite a few other jobs.

You stick a camera in front of her and she doesn't cooperate? –
take pictures so she doesn't notice the camera.
Use a Tele, for instance, as others had said.
Or, get a friend to stick a camera in front of her, and while
she's busy with him, get a series of pictures from another
angle, from farther away... It'll be fun instead of frustration,
and you may get some interesting shots... whatever.
There're endless options. Be creative and find a way.

Get the "I can't do it" off your dictionary.

Yes, there're negative people who would always criticize.
It's annoying, but remember that they are the loud minority.
The majority is typically silent.
Your best reply to that nasty minority is the good job you can do.
​

​

 

[Hooligan Dan]

Ah... Your job is to get a pic'?
You get a pic'. A good one. ​

"I didn't do my homework because – a) I was sick, b) The dog
shredded my notebook and c) I forgot all about it" - has no room
in photojournalism, and in quite a few other jobs.​

You stick a camera in front of her and she doesn't cooperate? –
take pictures so she doesn't notice the camera.
Use a Tele, for instance, as others had said.
Be creative and find a way.​

Get the "I can't do it" off your dictionary.​

Well, I'm sorry. Unlike you apparently I don't take perfect photos every time I press the trigger.

1. In small meeting rooms like the one at the district office telephotos don't work.
2. If she knows I'm a photographer, as she knew from when I got a mugshot of her before the meeting(which she oddly had no problem with), no amount of sneakiness if gonna make her forget a photographer is taking photos of her.
3. And finally, I didn't make any excuses for it at work. I said I took a bad photo outright. But the city editor and the editor/chief both thought the photo worked. The dog didn't eat my homework. In fact, the teacher took my homework and gave me a good grade. But I didn't like it and a few people on the blog didn't like it.

And like I said at the beginning, I was in a hurry. I needed to get a quick shot and get out. Photoj isn't always about getting the Pulitzer. Sometimes you need to get what you can get and move on.

 

[Emerana]

can we see it?

 

[Hooligan Dan]

can we see it?

Yes. Yes you can.

Shortly after this shot is when she started using the paper to block her face. Until then she was just turning the back of her head to me. The copydesk changed my original crop to fit the space. And what really pissed people off is the copydesk changed my correct spelling of her name, Kathy, to the traditional Cathy, which was wrong. So they also said I needed to learn how to write.

 

[Emerana]

well it isnt super hot but isnt worth flaming you for. For newspaper shot, I have seen much worse.

I guess I would have taken this shot then tried to ask nicely for a quick shot. She was just feeling self conscience that you were taking her photo when she was trying to do other things (worried about ugly open mouth shots). I bet she would have let you fired off a round if you have asked.

 

[Senor Hound]

I'm afraid, Dan, the only way people are going to stop criticizing you is when you stop defending yourself. You shouldn't even have to defend yoruself, and you have every right to do so, but the barrage will not stop until someone puts their digital fists down. And for the record, the shot is good IMO, but people just like to be cranky on the internet.

As I've said before, we need to treat the different people of the internet like we were each others' best friends. This shouldn't be a place to get mad at others for a bad day or something like that.

Also, since this thread has been going on for a while, I hope the photo is "yesterday's news," and already off your newspaper's website.