Well Then, Shall We Just Let the Blind Lead the Blind?

kundalini

Been spending a lot of time on here!
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It seems…. No, it is a reality, the ever popular and reoccurring thread passes through the halls of TPF that people are rude with their C&C. For arguments sake, let’s call them “pros”. Even though I know many, myself included, are not in fact, making any money out of photography and it is considered a hobby. In the same breath, they are seasoned, reasonable individuals and are passionate about photography. This assertion is unfairly misdirected mostly towards a small contingent of astute observers IMO. There are too many to mention and I wouldn't want to leave someone out, so go figure that one out on your own.

There is an even smaller circle of jerks that like to run amuck and merely stir the pot for a reaction. Guess what? They’re the ones you’re bitchin’ about.
But guess what again? Yer bitchin’ makes me want to stop altogether. WTF do I get out of this? A couple of “likes”, a few giggles, catch a mistake, put someone in their place, the occasional vent? It’s not that simple, at all. I like to share the wealth to the deserving, pay it forward so to speak. I’ve put a lot of effort to learn a few things about photography and it pleases me to pass that on to those willing to listen.

It may seem that there is a lot of “ME” in the previous paragraph, but that is not the intent. I know there are many others on this forum, which I have respect for, that are of a similar mindset. Some may actually be “pros”, but many are also just regular folk that know a thing or two. I thought of finding some of my better and some of my lesser C&C’s as examples. Some are very good and some are a waste of time. Everyone oscillates. But you can do your own damn searching.

So the question remains….. Why do the “pros” hang out in the Beginners forum? I’ll answer the question with another question. Why would you take advice from someone that hardly knows any more than you?


Notice: this post is on behalf of the rude, curt, blunt & ostentatious posters of C&C............. and for gsgary.
 
Kundalini, at risk of making a total idiot out of myself, I have to say I agree and respectfully disagree with you.

Yes, C&C shouldn't come off as trolling, but I honestly think that rarely happens on this forum. I think most of the problems arise due to the poster asking for the C&C jumping the gun and assuming they're right every time they hear "you shouldn't have" or "It's rarely a good idea to.."
I've started so many arguments outside this forum by simply stating that a photo didn't do anything for me it's absurd, so I've become a little tired of it. It makes me worry that the seasoned users on this forum will just give up on criticism altogether, which would suck because I've highly benefited from it.
 
Yup, this forum is interesting.

It's a range from complete idiots, not worth your time, to those very eager to learn and have valuable discussions with.

It's a range of people best ignored, to the best to listen too.

It's a range of class clowns to boring always serious people.

It's a group of people that complain about drama, but continually add to it, and act all innocent.

Yup, this forum is made up of people of all kinds.

Much like the real world.

You can even choose to ignore people you don't like, or argue with them, just like real life!
 
Yup, this forum is interesting.

It's a range from complete idiots, not worth your time, to those very eager to learn and have valuable discussions with.

It's a range of people best ignored, to the best to listen too.

It's a range of class clowns to boring always serious people.

It's a group of people that complain about drama, but continually add to it, and act all innocent.

Yup, this forum is made up of people of all kinds.

Much like the real world.

You can even choose to ignore people you don't like, or argue with them, just like real life!

Agreed.

Kun, it's FRUSTRATING as HELL. I get it. It frustrates me even more to know how much *I've* grown from all of your (you rude, bitchy, trolling, mean, hobby-proists :sexywink:) C&C and tips, and I don't recall ever getting defensive about it once. If I ever came *off* that way I think it was established at some point in the thread that it was because I was confused, not resisting. And you know... I'm confused a lot. :lmao:

To know how much I've grown in just a short year and a half (not that I don't have a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG way to go...), taking criticism as humbly as possible and with great consideration for my next shoot, and then seeing newbies come on and complain that someone saying their image was uninteresting, or lacked contrast, or wasn't straight, or that they cut this or that off... is rude. That's frustrating for *me* to see.

Because *I'M* not done learning yet. And these idiots are chasing all of you rude people off that I'm still benefitting from. And yes. There's a lot of "me" in that statement. :lol:

I even try to help here and there when I can, but when it comes down to someone who thinks they're God's gift to photography after 2 days of owning a camera, I just put them on a mental ignore list.

I think if all of you OOOH so rude seasoned hobby-proists would just ignore the idiots... they'll 1. Go away. 2. The people that need the help and WANT the help, GET the help, because everyone is ignoring the "YOU ARE SOOOOOO RUDE!" drama thread and applying their know-how elsewhere and 3. Uh. Well. There was a 3. I don't remember now.

Don't give up on the willing newbs! :sillysmi: And don't give up on us semi-newbs either :lol:

There are still people willing to accept your forward payment... you just gotta machete your way through the weeds to find the growing flowers. :biggrin:
 
yes, please dont give up on all us newbies!
I may know very little about photography, but I do moderate a different forum. and I am constantly helping out the newbies, explaining the same things over and over. sometimes I do request that they search the faqs because it can get tedious, especially when I sense that someone really just wants me to do all their work. why do I do it? because others have helped me and I like to help the next wave. I grow from explaining the same thing in different ways. it feels good. lots of reasons and many are selfish but hey, we all have many layers of motives. so I really dont care if someone enjoys poking fun at my bad pics while helping me grow my skills. if thats the price I pay for otherwise free education, so be it. and the truth is, I have never gotten any rude comments here, and I know the pics I post are garbage compared to most of the images here.
so thanks to all of you 'pros' for patiently urging me on. and for the occasional laugh at the silliness (ok, so I'm one of the 'boring/serious ones here)
 

It's sad when people can find a photo forum, but can't type in a simple google search...

I'm probably known as one of those that sometimes stirs sh*t up. I'm opinionated. I know what know, and I know what I like. I also know quite a bit about photography. I've been offering less and less advice for the exact reason Keith is showing right there. I don't know if I'll get my head bit off, or if someone will actually thank me for the time I put into helping them. The generation I'm in, unfortunately, is the generation of entitlement. I hate that. I've worked for everything I have. I had a mentor early in my photographic life, but I paid that mentorship back by being the reflector holder, or running the photo printing machine, or any other number of photography related, but not actually shooting, jobs. Not once did I get paid in cash, just film, processing and advice. I've learned a lot in 13 years. I don't make money on photography, and frankly, I don't want to either. However, I certainly don't mind sharing what I know with those willing to accept it.

Here's a thread I made about a year and a half ago, to try to combat what we're talking about now. It helped a bit at the time, but obviously, it's affects have worn off. It got locked about a year ago, due to some jackass who was basically thread stalking me and a couple other members. However, it's still worth a read, and a lot of the comments are very helpful in adding to what I was trying to say.

I have two very big pet peeves. If you want a rude reaction from me, here's how to do it:

1) Be too big for your britches. If you cannot take critique, advice, etc, because you are oh so awesome (even though you aren't), I WILL call you out.

2) If you have honesty/integrity issues. If you don't have your integrity, what do you have? Trying to misrepresent yourself, or lie, or anything else like that, I WILL call you out.

I try not to be rude. I give fair and honest, but blunt, and to the point critique. I won't say "Your shot sucks" without explaining why. If you cannot take the heat, do not post pictures here. Post them on Facebook, or print them out to show your friends and family. You won't learn anything, but hey, at least you'll feel good about yourself.
 
ALOT of the crit online for photo forums is completely bogus, and people post pictures up mostly for a pat on the back.

I quit posting pictures for serious crit on here long ago. And it's hard take it seriously when people say things like "i like this, but I don't know why" or their version of crit is how they would reshoot the picture, not talking at all about what the photographer already did (which is the purpose of critique).
 
Many people are here with a year's worth of experience. They know EVERYTHING about photography. Heck, they're already shooting engagement sessions, weddings, and portrait commissions. Most know how to operate their cameras and to ram images through Lightroom en mass, yet they often get really,really bent out of shape if it is suggested that they study photography. These are the people who get really,really irate and complain to the moderators when their work isn't lauded and praised. They want affirmation; after all they are "new pros", taking money for shooting photos. When told the real truth about their photos,many of these people get VERY agitated, and immediately begin ad hominem attacks on the C&C givers. They even begin posts complaining about how harsh the C&C they have received is. These people cause a lot of conflict here. With their year of experience or so, they feel slighted if ANYTHING is pointed out with their technique, methods, or understanding of concepts.
 
I think we are all guilty including you K. Now what can we do to change this? I am at the point where I pretty much ignore almost every post unless the poster is another active member, or the topic is so hot. Once in a while I reply to newer members but not often. Can people please stop posting their pictures on the beginners section unless you are a complete noob?
 
I wonder who that person is you mentioned Derrel? Could it be me?
 
I think we are all guilty including you K. .....
Guilty of what, exactly. Starting a ***** fest? Although it's still fairly sharp, my memory does fail me from time to time. Please point me to the errors of my ways Schwetty.
 
I didnt mean like that, I was just saying we all have done what you explained.
 

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