Black strip appearing in images?

[Harmony]

Hello everyone,

I was hoping for a bit of help.

I recently purchased a Canon TX and I just put my first roll of film through it (Ilford HP5 400). While many of the pictures came out well, there were a few in which a black strip appeared on the right side of the image. These were taken in the sun, at either smaller apertures (8ish and above) or quick shutter speeds (1/250 or 1/500). I've put some images for reference.

Are these film problems, or camera problems? And if so, what should I do?

As far as I can remember, the first and third photos were at 1/500, and the second was at 1/250.

 

[Petraio Prime]

Hello everyone,

I was hoping for a bit of help.

I recently purchased a Canon TX and I just put my first roll of film through it (Ilford HP5 400). While many of the pictures came out well, there were a few in which a black strip appeared on the right side of the image. These were taken in the sun, at either smaller apertures (8ish and above) or quick shutter speeds (1/250 or 1/500). I've put some images for reference.

Are these film problems, or camera problems? And if so, what should I do?

As far as I can remember, the first and third photos were at 1/500, and the second was at 1/250.

This occurs because the mirror is not moving properly and is not clearing completely out of the way before the shutter opens. The camera needs to be serviced.

 

[guitstik]

Are these at the beginning of the roll? If so, then you may not be advancing the film far enough before you start taking pictures. When you put the film in make sure that it is not bowed up but laying flat, the roll is engaged on the tabs, close the back and advance the film and snap a shot. I usually snap off two shots with the lens cap on before I even start taking pictures.

 

[Petraio Prime]

Are these at the beginning of the roll? If so, then you may not be advancing the film far enough before you start taking pictures. When you put the film in make sure that it is not bowed up but laying flat, the roll is engaged on the tabs, close the back and advance the film and snap a shot. I usually snap off two shots with the lens cap on before I even start taking pictures.

No, that would not cause this problem. The mirror is not moving properly.

 

[usayit]

This occurs because the mirror is not moving properly and is not clearing completely out of the way before the shutter opens. The camera needs to be serviced.

Doesn't the mirror move upwards? how would that explain the right side underexposure?

Canon TX has a horizontal cloth shutter.. that should give you a hint to what is probably going on. Probably requires a repair.

 

[guitstik]

If I am right, it is a simple fix that requires no monetary expenditure. When you run into a problem go for the simple solution first before you start throwing money at it.

 

[Petraio Prime]

If I am right, it is a simple fix that requires no monetary expenditure. When you run into a problem go for the simple solution first before you start throwing money at it.

I have seen this problem before, in many cameras. I know what it is.

 

[Harmony]

Thanks for the quick replies, everyone!

These pictures were taken at different times during the roll. As always, I advanced the film three frames before I started taking photographs, so that can't be the problem.

We considered a problem with the mirror, but since the mirror flips up, we weren't sure, mechanically, how that would work. Nevertheless, we're not ruling that out.

Usayit, thanks for the different answer, now we've got more to go on (and given your history with film cameras and this forum, I trust this answer the most!).

Thankfully, the shop I bought it from has a 30 day no-charge repair on all film SLRs, so money isn't a problem or a factor.

I've presently got another roll in it, and we'll experiment with the higher shutter speeds to see if the mirror is the problem. After that, we'll bring it in for repair.

Thanks so much for all the helpful replies!

 

[Petraio Prime]

Thanks for the quick replies, everyone!

These pictures were taken at different times during the roll. As always, I advanced the film three frames before I started taking photographs, so that can't be the problem.

We considered a problem with the mirror, but since the mirror flips up, we weren't sure, mechanically, how that would work. Nevertheless, we're not ruling that out.

Usayit, thanks for the different answer, now we've got more to go on (and given your history with film cameras and this forum, I trust this answer the most!).

Thankfully, the shop I bought it from has a 30 day no-charge repair on all film SLRs, so money isn't a problem or a factor.

I've presently got another roll in it, and we'll experiment with the higher shutter speeds to see if the mirror is the problem. After that, we'll bring it in for repair.

Thanks so much for all the helpful replies!

The problem is more likely to appear at high shutter speeds if the mirror is the culprit.

 

[Petraio Prime]

This occurs because the mirror is not moving properly and is not clearing completely out of the way before the shutter opens. The camera needs to be serviced.

Doesn't the mirror move upwards? how would that explain the right side underexposure?

Remember the image in the camera is upside down.

 

[Dwig]

The dark edge is the classic sign of a focal plane shutter that needs a clean, lube, and adjustment (CLA). Being along the short edge is normal for a shutter that travels horizontally. With vertical traveling shutters, the same shutter problem produces a dark edge along one of the long edges. The Canon TX has a horizontally traveling cloth shutter which travels from the wind side to the takeup side of the body. When the two shutter curtains begin to not travel at the correct speeds, they don't produce an uniform slit width as the travel across the image. If the second curtain runs faster than the first (whether its too fast or, more likely, the first is running too slow) it can catch up with the first. As it does the slit gets narrower the exposure is less (darker postive image) and eventually drops to zero as it catches up completely.

This type of shutter problem usually is more severe the higher the shutter speed. Its rare to see it at speed slower than the maximum X-sync speed (1/60th on the TX) but not uncommon on older shutters at 1/500th and 1/1000th. This problem can usually be repaired by a good service tech, but some cameras can wear out making reliable shutter performance impossible to accomplish. The Canon bodies of that vintage (Pellix, FT, FTb, FTBn, TL, TLb, TX) use soft sleeve bearings that can not be replaced. If they wear, and I've seen quite a number of cases where they have, curing the problem might not be possible. A good tech can tell without any significant disassembly. You only need to remove the base plate to access the end of the shutter spindles to test for wobble.

There is almost no doubt that this is your problem. It is certain that the problem is not:

1. a loading problem. That wouldn't leave an under/un-exposed portion of the negative.
2. a mirror problem. That can happen, but the shadowing would be along the long edge and would be vastly less distinct. Almost no SLRs would produce any visible flaw caused by a mirror lifting issue. This is because the shutter release button doesn't connect to the shutter on virtually any mechanical camera. The shutter release button actually releases either the mirror. The mirror releases the shutter when it finally lifts completely. If it doesn't lift completely the shutter never fires. When a selftimer is present, the sequence is usually shutter button > self timer > mirror/diaphram > shutter. In a few cameras, those with Copal bladed shutters and some Seiko bladed shutters the mirror/diaphram comes before the selftimer in the Rube Goldbergian sequence (remember the old game "Mouse Trap").


1.

 

[usayit]

Usayit, thanks for the different answer, now we've got more to go on (and given your history with film cameras and this forum, I trust this answer the most!).

You are very welcome... Actually Dwig, Mitca, and Compur seem to know more than I. I am just a Pack Rat that has accumulated junk ... er... lots of cameras (and other stuff) over the years.

Some of my buddies also consider me the expert in Jeeps... but I can't explain why mine hasn't been in running state for the past two years.

If the second curtain runs faster than the first (whether its too fast or, more likely, the first is running too slow) it can catch up with the first. As it does the slit gets narrower the exposure is less (darker postive image) and eventually drops to zero as it catches up completely.

This definitely seems to be the case... Note that 1st and 3rd photos taken at 1/500 end up almost 0 exposure by the time the shutter completes its travel while the 2nd photo taken at 1/250 still manages some exposure throughout the photo.

 

[Harmony]

Dwig, thank you very much for such a thorough and knowledgeable answer. I'll bring it in tomorrow to see if it's repairable.

Usayit and everyone else, thanks very much for taking the time to trouble shoot!

 

[Flash Harry]

Its the shutter not the mirror, probably a worn/duff spring. H

 

[christopher walrath]

Exactly. The shutter hangs up. Sometimes slow to close as in the second photograph. Sometimes jams open as in one and three. The shutter moves horizontally. The mirror moves vertically. IT IS NOT A MIRROR PROBLEM. Shutter.