Digital FM2 anyone?

What makes this interesting is that Nikon didn't just jam some cheap guts into the thing. It's not merely a cynical money grab.

If they wanted to just soak the hipsters, they could have crammed the D3200's guts into an FE2 styled body, chopped out a bunch of features, and sold it for $3000 just as easily. Maybe peel the AA filter off the sensor or something, just to mix it up a bit. Write a little software to make the B&W modes fancier. The result would have been smaller and lighter and more like an actual retro camera, AND it would have had more megapixels, AND the margins would be way higher. AND it would totally play into the hipster market. Or they could have retro-ed a Nikon 1, or used some Coolpix guts, or whatever.

This seems to be a stripped down D4, which is a bunch of viciously expensive parts, crammed into a retro-styled DSLR body. It ain't gonna win any beauty contests, but it's got a lot of professional bits and pieces going on. I'm not sure WHO the hell is supposed to buy this thing, but it's pretty interesting.

The more I look at it and think about it, the more I think it's an experiment to see what Nikon might be in 10 years. I think it's an experiment that got cost-cut and committeed pretty thoroughly, so it's no longer clear what the point was. But there's somethin' going on here beyond a cynical money grab.

Derrel's definitely on to something with the 'compatible with all the lenses ever' they're already plugging that on the web site. But who has $3000 to drop on a camera, AND cares about being able to use AI lenses?
 
Hmmm. Price killed it for me as there is no 51 pt AF. They would have to buffed the 39 to act exactly like the 51 to get my interest back. Can't tell if serious...

I'm being scarcastic but some people are so sensitive on this forum. Get off this forum join match.com n go get some.

Sarcasm? No, this is being hit over the head lessons in here. Sarcasm is down the hall.
 
What makes this interesting is that Nikon didn't just jam some cheap guts into the thing. It's not merely a cynical money grab.

If they wanted to just soak the hipsters, they could have crammed the D3200's guts into an FE2 styled body, chopped out a bunch of features, and sold it for $3000 just as easily. Maybe peel the AA filter off the sensor or something, just to mix it up a bit. Write a little software to make the B&W modes fancier. The result would have been smaller and lighter and more like an actual retro camera, AND it would have had more megapixels, AND the margins would be way higher. AND it would totally play into the hipster market. Or they could have retro-ed a Nikon 1, or used some Coolpix guts, or whatever.

This seems to be a stripped down D4, which is a bunch of viciously expensive parts, crammed into a retro-styled DSLR body. It ain't gonna win any beauty contests, but it's got a lot of professional bits and pieces going on. I'm not sure WHO the hell is supposed to buy this thing, but it's pretty interesting.

The more I look at it and think about it, the more I think it's an experiment to see what Nikon might be in 10 years. I think it's an experiment that got cost-cut and committeed pretty thoroughly, so it's no longer clear what the point was. But there's somethin' going on here beyond a cynical money grab.

Derrel's definitely on to something with the 'compatible with all the lenses ever' they're already plugging that on the web site. But who has $3000 to drop on a camera, AND cares about being able to use AI lenses?

Cyncial money grab. Hmm.. man, you say that like it's a bad thing... lol. From a marketing standpoint it makes sense to me that they wouldn't put this together as a "low end" camera, it's not the market they are after for Christmas sales. They've already released the D5300 for the more entry-level offering.

They aren't really after us camera geeks with this one, this is for the folks that have money to spend this Christmas and they are going to buy it based on the "latest and greatest" theorem. The people this is being marketed too don't know enough about cameras to know any different. Sadly I can tell you from experience that this is a much larger part of the market than you might imagine. As I think I mentioned in an earlier posting I spend a lot of time at the zoo - and if I had a dime for every time I ran across someone with $3000 to $5000 worth of high end equipment that was shooting in auto mode and had absolutely no idea what they were doing I'd be rich enough to afford this camera and quite a few others.

I'll have to go back and read Derrel's commentary to be sure what your referencing there, but if I were Nikon and I'd come up with a way to have the camera be compatible with all the older lenses I think it would make a certain amount of sense to test that on the marketplace with a camera like this one.

As for the point, well the point of this was to make Nikon money. I think in that regard it will most likely succeed.
 
amolitor said:
The button/dial layout looks pretty much like the D4, which is itself a buttonfest, but then they threw 3-4 "retro style" dials on top.

I just counted: my D3x has 19 separate external buttons and or controls on the back of the camera, and 13 buttons or control on the front and top side. 19 + 13 is 32 external buttons and controls.

I just counted: my D2x has 19 separate external buttons or controls on the back of the camera, and 15 buttons or controls on the front and top side. 19 +15 is 34 external buttons and controls.

The new camera looks pretty simplified to me, but then I'm used to a D1,D1h,D2x,or D3x and have 13 years' experience with Nikon's pro d-slr bodies, and 31 years shooting Nikon...to me this new layout looks VERY much like the Nikon bodies I was shooting 30 years ago as a college photojournalist...it looks pretty simple, really.

Moving the ISO setting and the exposure compensation to external, top-deck dials is basically a simple reversion to the manual,mechanical input that Sony and Olympus are now using on some of their newest higher-end and "enthusiast" models. Using external, ALWAYS-visible control dials as opposed to nested, multi-level menus makes a camera simpler and more logical to adjust. One of the bigger issues on the pro Nikons has been too much menu-based hiding of important stuff. The newer cameras are almost infinitely customizable, and that's been done through menus. A separate, EXTERNAL, dedicated ISO button is something the pro Nikon bodies have always had (plus, ISO adjustment from within in the LCD menus is also an option on the flagships); the consumer Nikon bodies have used a menu-only system for ISO adjustment.

The idea that using a 5-page, 2- or 3-level menu system to make adjustments is somehow "easier" or "better" is a common mistake many newbs make. Beginners often see a P&S or entry-level d-slr and think that the lower the button count, the "easier" the camera will be to use for serious picture-taking. Unfortunately, that's not really true. Now, if you're coming from a Nikon D3200 like amolitor happens to be, the set of dedicated external buttons Nikon has decided to put on a pro-level type of camera might seem frightening. But really, the camera's main external buttons and controls all seem like single-purpose, dedicated controls. That makes the controls both easy to find, and predictable. At the opposite was one of Sony's first mirrorless cameras: it had no external ISO adjustment, and Michael Reichmann ridiculed Sony's design because the camera required 16 separate button presses to get to the ISO adjustment "screen" in the menu-based system.

I bet that before too long, this thing will be offered in a DX-sensor version for half price.

See, now I'm stuck with a mental image of you taking out each camera, counting all the dials and buttons and yelling AHA! when your done with each one.. lol

I rather liked the dial arrangement, would like to see that or a version of it introduced in other models. If they do get around to releasing a DX version and I wait long enough that I can find one used that might be of interest to me, It wouldn't replace my current DSLR but I can think of some situations in which it might come in handy. At the moment the price puts it way out of my reach though, if I were going to spend that kind of money on a camera it wouldn't be this one. I get where Nikon is coming from though, I think sales wise this will be a hit for them. I don't see this flying off the shelves mind you, but considering the profit margin they are looking at per unit it really doesn't need too go like gangbusters.
 
This is a D700 replacement from a situational perspective. It's a $3K camera body (less actually) with the D4 processor just like the D700 was wrt the D3.
Whether or not a current D700 owner would see this as a replacement for their camera depends on a lot of things.
I have no plans to replace my D700 with this because, for my needs today, it would be a poor use of $3000.

On the other hand, if my D700 died tomorrow, which Nikon FX body would I choose to replace it? I have no idea - maybe none.
Hopefully I won't need to find out.
 
Really at the end of the day the 5d MkIII and the D800 are in the same price bracket and that just kills it for me.
 
Still think the DPreview crew has it right:

"As such, although I hate to say it: from a cold, hard practical point of view, I can't shake the feeling that the Df is a little bit... silly."
 
I'm not going to buy it.... but.... I like it!

I like the dials.. I like the silver/black.. I like the idea that they are pushing (hard) "pure photography". But then i learned photography shooting B&W film on a manual K1000 and developing/printing in my moms basement when i was a kid. The Df wakes up some part of my past where photography was more analog.

But... the 1/4000s shutter is a deal breaker for me.

Unless... The Df pulls a Nikon V1 and drops in 80% in price over the next 8 months :)
 
Still think the DPreview crew has it right:

"As such, although I hate to say it: from a cold, hard practical point of view, I can't shake the feeling that the Df is a little bit... silly."

From a camera geek's point of view? Yup. From a marketing standpoint though, I have to admit it makes perfect sense. I expect that come January or early Feburary they'll announce an upgrade to the 7100 and maybe follow that up with something meant to replace the D800 a little while later, so they can get a strong first quarter going.

I'd also suspect that by then the price on the DF will most likely drop significantly, they really don't have a high cost per unit here because there's pretty much zero R&D costs and most of the parts are straight off the shelf. They'll keep the price high through Christmas because a lot of folks honestly believe that more expensive it is better it must be regardless of the facts, and they'll use the D5300 to leverage the entry DSLR sales for the silly season.

Then once they reach the point where they feel like they've gotten all they can out of the "high dollar is always better" crowd they'll most likely drop the price on these pretty hard.
 
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