Do I seriously need a permit? And C&C at the same time...

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

I'm trying to kill a bird with two stones here so bare with me...

Last night I was bored so I went to a recent mall they just made. I was by myself, on a small bridge that goes over a little lake in the middle of it all. It's about 10pm but time is not an issue because that place closes late. About 5 minutes into my picture taking, I had barely started to play with the settings, Mr. Security Guard, that by the way looks like he just got dropped off by ICE. No joke. And this was roughly the words that where spoken.

Security Guard: " Ehhh...You have permit?
Me: "No, I don't need one, this is a public place."
Security Guard: " Ehhh... You need permit, I think.
Me: "No, I'm pretty sure I don't"

(He goes to touch my camera? WTF!)

Me: "Don't touch my camera!"

(He kinda freaks out, because I kinda screamed that at him)

Security Guard: "Ehhh...1123 to 1120...Over"
Security Guard 2: 1120 to 1123...what you need?"
Security Guard: "Ehhh, assistance on bridge. Please."

Since I see the poor guy struggling with his more than shattered english. I proceed to talk to him in spanish, since I'm cuban lol and that's all we talk at my house. So this is the rest of the convo translated into english.

Me: "Look uhh (look at his name tag) err... Juan. (I'm not making this up) I work for the sheriff's office in Collier County and I'm pretty sure I don't need a permit. I Know i need a permit if I where to take a picture of a house...that I understand. But a shopping mall? Come on buddy...

Security Guard: Yes, but ehh... I can call police right now.
Me: Call Him.

Long story short police never came, the other security guard came after 2 minutes and said the same thing "Juan" said but I could actually understand.

Since I work for the sheriff's office i've seen security guards trespass anyone they want and the property manager gives them that authority, and the Law Enforcement Agency has to oblige. So having that in mind, I left because I go to that shopping mall a lot, and it would suck to get trespassed.

So maybe I'm wrong, but I've never heard of needing a permit for shooting somewhere so public. If it was people or something, I could understand. But...idk....anyone to shed light on this would be highly appreciated.

And at the same time please CC the 2 pics I had time to take that night.

reg · Jul 23, 2008

Permit? No. If it's in public it's fair game. If you were actually ON mall grounds, the worst they can do is ask you to leave, and if you don't call the cops re: trespassing.

But the photos are kinda overexposed.

Puscas · Jul 23, 2008

This looks like public space, so pics are okay. But I'm not sure if you had to enter through some gate to get to that bridge you're talking about. I mean, if it's all someones property (i.e. the owners of the mall), I think it's a different issue.
But, like many people have stated here before, keep talking, explain yourself and it's usually no problem.

I love how these stories keep popping up.

pascal

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

Yeah I know...I started out with a low shutter speed, and then juan came....So I really want to go back. But I'm sure I'm going to but heads with idiots again.

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

Puscas said:
This looks like public space, so pics are okay. But I'm not sure if you had to enter through some gate to get to that bridge you're talking about. I mean, if it's all someones property (i.e. the owners of the mall), I think it's a different issue.
But, like many people have stated here before, keep talking, explain yourself and it's usually no problem.

I love how these stories keep popping up.

pascal

No. Bridge is for everyone to use.... I had tons of people pass by me that night. Who do I talk to so this doesnt happen again. I want these idiots to leave me alone.

reg · Jul 23, 2008

But, was the bridge actually ON mall property, regardless of how accessible it is?

BTW you don't need a permit to take a photo of a house.

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

reg said:
But, was the bridge actually ON mall property, regardless of how accessible it is?

BTW you don't need a permit to take a photo of a house.

yes...on mall property.

and, yes you do. at least in FL you do. if the house is occupied you need a permit.

Seefutlung · Jul 23, 2008

Looks and sounds like private property .. as such they can do what they like ... when they like. If you were on the sidewalk which butts up to a city/public street you'd be safe. Juan and company can demand you stop, but they haven't any grounds to stand on and you can tell them to pound sand and if they persist call the cops for harrassment.

Many cities now-a-days require a permit for shooting on public grounds if: A) you're shooting for commercial purposes, B) if you use a tripod.

Some places require that you sign a statement that you will not use the images for commercial or monetary gain (after signing the statement you're free to shot all you want).

Next time let Juan touch your camera then call the cops for assualt and/or robbery.

Gary

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

Seefutlung said:
Looks and sounds like private property .. as such they can do what they like ... when they like. If you were on the sidewalk which butts up to a city/public street you'd be safe. Juan and company can demand you stop, but they haven't any grounds to stand on and you can tell them to pound sand and if they persist call the cops for harrassment.

Many cities now-a-days require a permit for shooting on public grounds if: A) you're shooting for commercial purposes, B) if you use a tripod. Some places require that you sign a statement that you will not use the images for commercial or monetary gain (after signing the statement you're free to shot all you want).

Next time let Juan touch your camera then call the cops for assualt and/or robbery.

Gary

B sounds like the case here. Because the other security guard was interested in what I did with the pictures. Where would I get this agreement...I dont remember seeing an administration building there.

I really want to go back and take those pictures right.

Thanks gary...

reg · Jul 23, 2008

toofpaste said:
yes...on mall property.

and, yes you do. at least in FL you do. if the house is occupied you need a permit.

LOL, Florida....

But while you don't need a permit, per se, they can ask you to leave for any reason and if you don't then you can be charged with trespassing.

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

reg said:
LOL, Florida....

But while you don't need a permit, per se, they can ask you to leave for any reason and if you don't then you can be charged with trespassing.

Touche.

Seefutlung · Jul 23, 2008

toofpaste said:
yes...on mall property.

and, yes you do. at least in FL you do. if the house is occupied you need a permit.

Can you cite/link that law ... I find it had to believe that Flodida can abridge one's 1st Amendment rights without a serious challange by ACLU or individuals. Maybe, if it is for commercial purposes ... but I find it hard to abridge the 1st Amendment for non-commercial activities.

Gary

reg · Jul 23, 2008

In jest, I say.

I was born in Jacksonville, Florida....

And I don't plan to go back until I retire.

reg · Jul 23, 2008

toofpaste said:
Touche.

What did you just call me?

Oh hells no.

toofpaste · Jul 23, 2008

Seefutlung said:
Can you cite/link that law ... I find it had to believe that Flodida can abridge one's 1st Amendment rights with a serious challange by ACLU or individuals. Maybe, if it is for commercial purposes ... but I find it hard to abridge the 1st Amendment for non-commercial activities.

Gary

When I return to work, I'll look for it in the Statute Book. I do remember seeing it though.