Getting model releases signed

[gabelimom]

Okay, I'm sure this is not going to go over well, but it's a release, not a contract. (And I know you're all going to say that a release is a contract. I just don't think it should be a big deal for them. It's a standard release.) The release basically states that the images are mine, I can retouch them, that they don't have the right to "approve" images before they are used, and that they are over the age of 21. These two people I'm having a problem with are, IMO, control freaks. I have used this release literally 100's of times, and without incident.

I feel that if I send the release ahead of time, it seems like I'm making a big deal out of it, and it might make the subject think, "Whoa, there's probably something here I should worry about." To me, signing a release should be a non-issue. When I've been on TV, I've signed them, and it's no biggie.

And I don't breathe down anyone's neck for a signature. I give them the release, and then leave to break down my equipment. I always tell them if they have any questions to please tell me, and I will help them. Simple as that.

I do agree that the release has to be signed before the shoot starts, and I will do that from here on in. Thanks for the advice, everyone!

 

[craig]

What are the chances of seeing a link to the mag. Not like it is relevant to the thread. More like it is important to see creativity in motion and get an idea what we are talking about.

Love & Bass

 

[gabelimom]

Celebrity Parents Magazine

 

[craig]

Outstanding work! Love your portfolio and the mag is interesting. Certainly fills a niche here in LA. As far as your op goes... We can bable all we want. Only you can make the call. I think in the future you will figure out who is going to be a problem and act accordingly.

Love & Bass

 

[gabelimom]

Thanks! I think I'm just going to reword the release and take out the scary language (without taking away my rights as a photographer), and follow the advice here to get it signed before we start. I'll just chalk these two people up to a bad experience, learn from it and move on.

Thanks to everyone who offered advice.

 

[vegasvisionstudios]

In the last 5 years I have had 3 models want to change terms in a release, and two who have refused to sign. So that averages out to 1 per year. The only time I lost out of all of it though was 1 hour while a Beauty Queen sat on the phone going over the release line by line with her agent while in the makeup chair. She left with half a face on.

I always make sure that the release is discussed and explained in advance of a shoot and give it to the subject as soon as they step into the makeup and wardrobe room. If they don't sign, they don't shoot and everyone goes home and calls the subject a flake

If you are spending months setting shoots up, I would assume you are dealing with agents and PR people so start working on the release right there in the beginning. Make sure the subject understands up front long before they ever set foot in the studio that if they want what you are offering the release MUST be signed before anything else begins. Also in these preshoot negotiations just make it clear that the release simply can not be modified, they either accept the terms or they don't receive what you are offering. If they refuse then the only time you have lost is the time negotiating the terms of the shoot.

D Listers are the worlds biggest publicity freaks, they want it but it scares the hell out of them at the same time. Most D List Celebs are D List because they are afraid of the success and they make lots of stupid decisions which continue to sabotage their chance for advancement.

 

[Plato]

I always make sure that the release is discussed and explained in advance of a shoot and give it to the subject as soon as they step into the makeup and wardrobe room. If they don't sign, they don't shoot and everyone goes home and calls the subject a flake

Yeah, it's "Do it my way or you're a flake!"

About a year ago, I won a photo contest. However, in order to receive the prize, it was necessary for me to agree to conditions that the promoter demanded. I guess I'm a flake.

 

[Garbz]

They have that right and the photographer's only recourse is simply to not take photos of them.

Oh that goes without saying. My point is that it takes exactly 10 seconds to read the page and sign it, and if the subject didn't sign in after the fact I doubt they'd have signed it before.

 

[vegasvisionstudios]

I always make sure that the release is discussed and explained in advance of a shoot and give it to the subject as soon as they step into the makeup and wardrobe room. If they don't sign, they don't shoot and everyone goes home and calls the subject a flake

Yeah, it's "Do it my way or you're a flake!"

About a year ago, I won a photo contest. However, in order to receive the prize, it was necessary for me to agree to conditions that the promoter demanded. I guess I'm a flake.

No they are not a flake if they refuse the release conditions without actually booking the shoot. In the cases of the models I shoot with they know the conditions up front before they ever come to the studio. They agree to the terms and conditions of my release before we ever agree to shoot. If they choose not to agree then we don't book. If they book and then change their mind and refuse to sign the release then yes they are a flake who can not make a decision and stick to it. They have wasted not only my time but the time of my staff and their own time. So yes they would be a flake in my book and in my studios flakes do not get second chances.

About you being a flake? I don't know we have never met but obviously I have touched a nerve with you. I would ask you this.

Where the terms and conditions of the contest available to and know to you before you participated in the contest? If they were published in the Rules of the contest and you failed to read them before participating then the argument could be made that yes you would be considered a flake.

 

[Plato]

I always make sure that the release is discussed and explained in advance of a shoot and give it to the subject as soon as they step into the makeup and wardrobe room. If they don't sign, they don't shoot and everyone goes home and calls the subject a flake

Yeah, it's "Do it my way or you're a flake!"

About a year ago, I won a photo contest. However, in order to receive the prize, it was necessary for me to agree to conditions that the promoter demanded. I guess I'm a flake.

No they are not a flake if they refuse the release conditions without actually booking the shoot. In the cases of the models I shoot with they know the conditions up front before they ever come to the studio. They agree to the terms and conditions of my release before we ever agree to shoot. If they choose not to agree then we don't book. If they book and then change their mind and refuse to sign the release then yes they are a flake who can not make a decision and stick to it. They have wasted not only my time but the time of my staff and their own time. So yes they would be a flake in my book and in my studios flakes do not get second chances.

About you being a flake? I don't know we have never met but obviously I have touched a nerve with you. I would ask you this.

Where the terms and conditions of the contest available to and know to you before you participated in the contest? If they were published in the Rules of the contest and you failed to read them before participating then the argument could be made that yes you would be considered a flake.

The T&C were not available to me until I was advised that I had been a winner. They had conditions to which I did not agree. I had conditions to which they did not agree. I didn't sign their contract which is my right and they didn't sign mine which is their right.

My big objection to the OP's method of doing business was her belief that the models were somehow obligated to sign whatever contract she put in front of their faces and that they had to sign it without obtaining advice from agent/lawyer as appropriate. She felt that her explanation should be all that's necessary to resolve the scary language that she put into the contract.

 

[gabelimom]

This has become an interesting debate, and I can't believe that my release problem was the impetus for it! Now, my dear friend Plato, the way you have reworded my original post makes me out to be the big bad wolf. By writing that, "the models were somehow obligated to sign whatever contract she put in front of their faces" is quite harsh. Secondly, "the scary language that she put into the contract" is also not correct. The language is quite clear, but those who are not used to reading a release might find it intimidating. Therefore, I explain it. I am not out to have anyone sign their life away; rather, I just want to protect my rights as a photographer and not compromise them because someone has issues.

And from now on, I will take care of the release before the shoot, and hopefully this can all be avoided...but I doubt it.

 

[c.cloudwalker]

Some people are like slinkies...
Totally useless but still a lot of fun when you push them down a flight of stairs.


Thank you for advising us in advance that we need not take your posts very seriously.

 

[Plato]

This has become an interesting debate, and I can't believe that my release problem was the impetus for it! Now, my dear friend Plato, the way you have reworded my original post makes me out to be the big bad wolf. By writing that, "the models were somehow obligated to sign whatever contract she put in front of their faces" is quite harsh. Secondly, "the scary language that she put into the contract" is also not correct. The language is quite clear, but those who are not used to reading a release might find it intimidating. Therefore, I explain it. I am not out to have anyone sign their life away; rather, I just want to protect my rights as a photographer and not compromise them because someone has issues.

And from now on, I will take care of the release before the shoot, and hopefully this can all be avoided...but I doubt it.

I got the term "scary language" from you.

It did concern me that you expressed displeasure that several models refused to sign. Certainly you should protect your rights as you see them but other signatories should also protect their rights as they see them. I honestly don't think that it's any big deal that two parties do not agree on the terms of a contract.

 

[gabelimom]

No, I didn't write that. I wrote, "I think the language scares them..." There's quite a difference between that and "scary language".

And I agree with you that people should not sign something they are not comfortable with. My point is that there isn't anything in the release that goes beyond the simple fact of protecting my rights. I think I'm just going to reword the release so that it doesn't sound so technical, give it at the beginning of the shoot, adopt that wonderful "no signy, no clicky" mantra that some of you used (and I love!), and cross my fingers.

Thanks, and good night!

 

[Plato]

No, I didn't write that. I wrote, "I think the language scares them..." There's quite a difference between that and "scary language".

And I agree with you that people should not sign something they are not comfortable with. My point is that there isn't anything in the release that goes beyond the simple fact of protecting my rights. I think I'm just going to reword the release so that it doesn't sound so technical, give it at the beginning of the shoot, adopt that wonderful "no signy, no clicky" mantra that some of you used (and I love!), and cross my fingers.

Thanks, and good night!

I wish you all the best.