Hassy 120mm lens/prism viewfinder question

[nickTheCut]

Hey guys. I’m trying to understand what is happening here. What I’m trying to do is have very intensional composition and have little to no need to crop my negative. What is happening is I compose my shot and the image comes back with more boarder than wanted.
Here is a picture through my prism on a tripod at infinity

Here is a picture through the prism focused on the railing

Here is a pictures of the images I got after developing it.

Please help me understand how I can correct this issue so my images come back just as I view it through the prism.


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[Dave Colangelo]

There are a few things that could be happening here but the various Hassy's worked a bit differently so to help us answer,

What camera are you using? (specific model)
What Prism are you using?
What film back are you using (I presume its an A-12)?

If you are unsure of what exactly you have or dont know what to call it check out this site for a solid reference point.

 

[nickTheCut]

There are a few things that could be happening here but the various Hassy's worked a bit differently so to help us answer,

What camera are you using? (specific model)
What Prism are you using?
What film back are you using (I presume its an A-12)?

If you are unsure of what exactly you have or dont know what to call it check out this site for a solid reference point.

Hey THANKS

Hasselblad 500c/m
Marko Planar 120mm CF T
PM 5 prism
A12 back

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[Dave Colangelo]

Excellent, we have almost an identical setup the only difference being Im running the 150 CFT.

The first thing I would check is that there is no Diopter correction lens installed on the PM-5. this may be causing you an issue if you also have glasses or do/dont need diopter correction. I would not think it would cause such a disturbance but it might (maybe someone installed an improper one that happened to fit).

I did some research on the 120mm Makro and it looks like there maybe some internal differences with that lens since its also a macro lens. I looked over the PM5 manual and cant find any reference to any lens limitations or finder/film variants. Similarly the Makro data sheet does not mention any limitations either. It is possible that this particular lens/finder combo creates some kind of edge issue as a result of its macro design and the finders 3x zoom.

There is an interesting discussion on the topic here one guy quotes "The Hasselblad Manual" By Ernst Wildi and offers some numbers suggesting that the various finders do cause crop issues in the ~8% range. I don't have the book so I can't confirm (but its not on my "obscure hasselblad stuff to obtain" list)

Im going to be running some rolls on my 150mm soon for another reason, Ill run some shots with my PM5 and take notes on them and see if I notice a similar crop ill be honest I have not paid super close attention to this yet so its possible its been happening to me the whole time.

 

[nickTheCut]

Excellent, we have almost an identical setup the only difference being Im running the 150 CFT.

The first thing I would check is that there is no Diopter correction lens installed on the PM-5. this may be causing you an issue if you also have glasses or do/dont need diopter correction. I would not think it would cause such a disturbance but it might (maybe someone installed an improper one that happened to fit).

I did some research on the 120mm Makro and it looks like there maybe some internal differences with that lens since its also a macro lens. I looked over the PM5 manual and cant find any reference to any lens limitations or finder/film variants. Similarly the Makro data sheet does not mention any limitations either. It is possible that this particular lens/finder combo creates some kind of edge issue as a result of its macro design and the finders 3x zoom.

There is an interesting discussion on the topic here one guy quotes "The Hasselblad Manual" By Ernst Wildi and offers some numbers suggesting that the various finders do cause crop issues in the ~8% range. I don't have the book so I can't confirm (but its not on my "obscure hasselblad stuff to obtain" list)

Im going to be running some rolls on my 150mm soon for another reason, Ill run some shots with my PM5 and take notes on them and see if I notice a similar crop ill be honest I have not paid super close attention to this yet so its possible its been happening to me the whole time.

I’ll look into that discussion you referenced, TJ’s k you. My thoughts have been that the pm5’s 3x magnification had something to do with it. I also had similar results with a PME Metered finder, so I don’t believe it has anything to do with my current prism being the problem. I’ll look into the 120mm info.


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[nickTheCut]

Excellent, we have almost an identical setup the only difference being Im running the 150 CFT.

The first thing I would check is that there is no Diopter correction lens installed on the PM-5. this may be causing you an issue if you also have glasses or do/dont need diopter correction. I would not think it would cause such a disturbance but it might (maybe someone installed an improper one that happened to fit).

I did some research on the 120mm Makro and it looks like there maybe some internal differences with that lens since its also a macro lens. I looked over the PM5 manual and cant find any reference to any lens limitations or finder/film variants. Similarly the Makro data sheet does not mention any limitations either. It is possible that this particular lens/finder combo creates some kind of edge issue as a result of its macro design and the finders 3x zoom.

There is an interesting discussion on the topic here one guy quotes "The Hasselblad Manual" By Ernst Wildi and offers some numbers suggesting that the various finders do cause crop issues in the ~8% range. I don't have the book so I can't confirm (but its not on my "obscure hasselblad stuff to obtain" list)

Im going to be running some rolls on my 150mm soon for another reason, Ill run some shots with my PM5 and take notes on them and see if I notice a similar crop ill be honest I have not paid super close attention to this yet so its possible its been happening to me the whole time.

I’ll look into that discussion you referenced, thank you. My thoughts have been that the pm5’s 3x magnification had something to do with it. I also had similar results with a PME Metered finder, so I don’t believe it has anything to do with my current prism being the problem. I’ll look into the 120mm info. I’d love to hear how your PM5 & 150mm combo is working together. That’s the other lens that intrigues me, but really enjoying this 120 focal length

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[Derrel]

That's a HUGE difference! Not just a little, but a HUGE amount more on-film. Do you have some type of slide mask installed?

 

[Dave Colangelo]

I’d love to hear how your PM5 & 150mm combo is working together

Ill be posting some stuff in the coming months on it hopefully. I have a project shaping up that I plan to put it to work on. I used the lens pretty heavily on a portrait/engagement shoot recently with the waist level finder and really liked it. I currently have the 50mm, 80mm, 150mm, 250mm and a 500mm. The 150 sits in a really sweet spot that I find I like for all around use.

 

[nickTheCut]

That's a HUGE difference! Not just a little, but a HUGE amount more on-film. Do you have some type of slide mask installed?

I’m new to Hasselblad and this setup. I think you are onto something!
Here is what’s under my focusing screen.

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[Derrel]

Yeah...I thought so, just by looking at the view and then the actual image...

That has indeed been masked off!

Look into using an A16-series magazine, perhaps?

Hasselblad A16: Film Photography | eBay

 

[Dave Colangelo]

That's it indeed get rid of that!

Dave

 

[nickTheCut]

Yeah...I thought so, just by looking at the view and then the actual image...

That has indeed been masked off!

Look into using an A16-series magazine, perhaps?

Hasselblad A16: Film Photography | eBay

Great eye! Look what was under the viewing screen

It looks as though it’s masked off for 6x4.5, but has a clear square to frame 6x6 images. Problem with this is the composition if you want to utilize maximum amount of film plane.


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[nickTheCut]

My Polaroid back has given me quick results. This just in...
Viewfinder

Polaroid

My problem solved

Now... what was that insert used for, or benefit?

In my defense, it’s my first Hasselblad and would never deface a vintage camera body. Thank you all who thought with me and helped me come to this conclusion.

 

[nickTheCut]

I’d love to hear how your PM5 & 150mm combo is working together

Ill be posting some stuff in the coming months on it hopefully. I have a project shaping up that I plan to put it to work on. I used the lens pretty heavily on a portrait/engagement shoot recently with the waist level finder and really liked it. I currently have the 50mm, 80mm, 150mm, 250mm and a 500mm. The 150 sits in a really sweet spot that I find I like for all around use.

They way you appreciate the 150mm is the way I fewl about the 120mm.


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[Dave Colangelo]

Now... what was that insert used for, or benefit?

There are a few things it was used for.

Its possible the owner had some kind of printing limitation and it was inserted to denote the margins, this seems somewhat unlikely and irregular though.

Its more than likely the previous owner had one of the early digital backs that had a smaller sensor. Even the new digital backs don't cover the full 6x6 frame size although they are better than the early ones.

Its possible this was a crop mask for a film back but it does not seem to be in the shape/crop of any film back I know of for the camera. Hasselblad did make a A-16 back with the 645 crop factor, if you have a small ruler you can check the measurements.