I hate working for people

[Jarrod268]

Great! Glad you're happy.

Actually, it was directed at everyone. No matter what your profession be professional.

I'm not sure I would enjoy working with 90% of the people here. Not because of experience but because of maturity. I'm speaking from the perspective of a consumer.

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[Jarrod268]

Being a Diva, is like being Pro+. :thumbup:

Try a snickers

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[imagemaker46]

Well I have to agree about not wanting to work with the majority of people on here. I think there are some very skilled people on here, and probably more so in the jobs they do full time.

 

[kasperjd4]

Wow, I didn't read a lot of this but I'm going to chip in. Everything I'm going to say may have already been said, but oh well.

If you don't like working with people don't! Also if you're complaining about spending 3g on equipment then get out now, because things only get more expensive. Taking a bunch of quotes from other people and threads: Photography is 70% who you know and 30% what you can do. Sometimes you have to Fake it to Make it, but screw up too many gigs and you'll never get hired again.

If you're trying to make money off of photography you need to look at it from a business standpoint, considering the advancements in technology.

For one, sports are a lot different than Weddings. You may shoot an entire soccer game, or whatever, and only get 1 good shot, and hell, you might be the best soccer photographer in the world. That's why people usually don't pay for photographers to be there, they only pay for prints. You have to capture that moment. Just out of curiosity, who is buying your prints? Parents? The venue? Magazines? That all constitutes how/if you get paid, especially if mom and dad have their own camera shooting from the bleachers.

Personally, I work for a magazine. When I shoot sports, I get paid for my time, and my shots they use. But that's only because they are going to use my shots regardless if they are good or not. So if you want to get paid for your time, work for a magazine, or someone who is going to use the shots no matter what. BUT that means you still are working for someone.

I would recommend talking to these venues. Seriously asking them what they would need from you to pay you for your time, or how you could work out a deal.

@imagemaker46: I agree, with the new age of technology weekend warriors and photo mom's are becoming a huge issue for the livelihood of professional photographers. It really has been difficult. Almost all of the professional photographers with studios in my area have been put out of business because no one wants to pay for photos when they can "use a camera themselves." Now, I didn't read through all the posts so I'm not sure what went on. I really don't understand why people get so angry when they ask for honest opinions and you tell them. It simply baffles me. So sorry.

The only other thing I have to say is to everyone, not just you. The weekend warrior and photo mom phenomenon is something to be embraced I think. I really believe it separates us from them. When I go on craigslist and look at other photogs websites, 99% of the time, their work is not good. As I am not on my own in photography I'm not sure how to market against the "$300 best weddin photografy ever" (yes misspelling is intentional from someones craigslist ad) but I'm sure there is a way. The problem just needs to be harnessed instead of fought.

I don't know, just my thoughts.

 

[imagemaker46]

Kasperjd4. Well you pretty much summed up what has been going on throughout this thread. I don't shoot too much sports on spec and hope to sell, If I don't have a client that is paying me to be there I have no reason to go. I have an archive of images online that generates income as well. The ones that complain about not getting hired or not selling anything are generally not very good at two things, selling themselves and trying to sell poor quality images.

 

[Minga]

3k for equipment ?
Zeiss prime lens $ 1600
Zeiss prime lens $ 2100
Nikkor zoom VR lens $ 3000
Nikkor......and so on
D3 - have your own guess..
and i just shoot for hobby - my own satisfaction :thumbup:

 

[bennielou]

Thanks for the tally of your equipment Minga. I think a few of us around here have you beat by $50,000 or more......Sorry, I guess you are just rubbing me the wrong way today. You are like Debbie Downer. And who cares what the hell you paid for your equipment?. I've seen PPA loan photos and a Pulitzer winner come from a cell cam. It's not what you spend. It's what you do with it.

But getting back to the OP. If you don't like it. Don't do it. If you don't like working for people, they will know it. Go shoot something that doesn't involve people. Tons of people have made money doing stock work, Photojournalism, Catelog, Commercial......alll things that don't involve people (or at least to a lesser extent)

 

[imagemaker46]

Bennielou, I believe the OP was frustrated at the lack of interest in people wanting to hire him and that they wanted to see the photos before buying them. While I can understand his frustration, he is also not working as a professional, does not have a business and is under equiped for what he wants to shoot, which is sports. On top of it all he's believed his family and friends when they said he does great work. Clearly from looking at his flickr web site he has a long way to go, this is the web site he posted in another thread. www.brianciancio.com

 

[bennielou]

Bennielou, I believe the OP was frustrated at the lack of interest in people wanting to hire him and that they wanted to see the photos before buying them. While I can understand his frustration, he is also not working as a professional, does not have a business and is under equiped for what he wants to shoot, which is sports. On top of it all he's believed his family and friends when they said he does great work. Clearly from looking at his flickr web site he has a long way to go, this is the web site he posted in another thread. www.brianciancio.com

Imagemaker, I am starting to see why people get frustrated with you. You aren't reading the posts, you are skimming them.
Yes, he has a ways to go, but he isn't total crap.

He has that thing you can't buy with gear. He has an eye.

Does he have a ways to go? Yes. But I think he is well ahead of most people with a pile of gear that have no idea what to do with it. Is he ready to turn pro today? No. But if he works with others, I think he has a good shot.

JMO.

 

[imagemaker46]

I can only base my opinion on the photos that I looked at, I told him in an earlier post that there were a couple of nice ones, because that's all there were, a couple of them looked liked he fired off frames without looking though the camera. You use the "eye" in your posts, what exactly does that mean? You have said that about two people on here that have both posted average photos.

People get frustrated with me because I don't sugar coat my opinions. If I like something I say it, if I can look at a single photo or a group of photos and see what could be changed to make them better I will say it. But if I look at a group in photos that are 99% bad, I could say they are all out of focus, or the exposures are off on all of them, or the composition is off, or the shutter speed wasn't fast enough, or I could just say I know what you were pointing the camera at but there are too many things wrong with it, but you have an eye. I'm not going to make a statement that I don't agree with, simply to not hurt someones feelings. I grew up having my photos critiqued everyday, and I was told what was wrong with them, it wasn't sugar coated, but it made me a much better photographer than being told "nice try" Wanting to be a professional doesn't come with the words "nice try" they come with the words "well done" and when I see it I use them.

 

[bennielou]

Fine. I think I speak my mind to the point of being booted off this forum more than once in a decade. (I'm thinking four times, could be five).

What I learened is there is a difference in speaking out of fear, and speaking to help another photog.
If you want to hear some non sugar coated crit, you can come to me. And belive me, I will give you an earfull.
But there is crit, and there is meaness/envy/frustration.

You rarely have anything encouraging to say. It's all negative. I could go though every one of your photos and nit pic them to death.

And yes you learn by hard crit, but you don't DO hard crit. You just tell people that they have ****ty cameras, and no experience, and that they are beginners.

News flash to you lady, I've had people who worked under me and shot for me that are now way better than I am. And that is the best thing I could ever hope for.

IMO, you need an attitude ajustment if you want to keep in this business.

 

[imagemaker46]

bennilou, I welcome your nit piks on my photos. Do your homework before you start ragging on someone. You have no idea who I am as a photographer. You jumped to a conclusion, and a wrong one at that.

 

[bennielou]

I wouldn't have to guess if I saw a boatload of photos. Just saying.

 

[CNCO]

imagemaker, my shots are very good. i have been told by people that shoot for companies only you could dream about. the rink sucks and the lighting sucks. its the best you are going to get in that arena. im not saying that i am ready to quit my full time job and work for getty or ap, i know i have a lot to learn. what i do not like is that people(sport teams locally) assume that people are going to shoot their events and be their ***** for free. i wont do it. i have shot races with pros and they were impressed with my eye and how i can max out an old nikon d80. your thoughts do not matter unless you are a client.

yes i have a full time paying job that pays my bills. im not going out and spending 20k on equipment and work for free. im not an idiot im very smart when it comes to finances.

post all you want on my threads i dont care just throwing some humor around etc...

i would also love to see your work.

 

[imagemaker46]

I'm guessing that you haven't been going to the threads that I have been posting photos in. Did you even bother to visit the web site I posted? I took the time to visit your wedding site, and the images I did look at were creative and well thought out. Everything I say is based on experience. I try not to jump to conclusions without knowing the facts.