Is this weird for a photography teacher to say/encourage?

[blackrose89]

How in the world does a simple question turn into what you want it to be?
Because you think the two go hand in hand, all of a sudden it becomes a tilted horizon thread?
I have a Goose down pillow. I like it , so I tell someone that I like it. It goes hand in hand with a Goose.
Does that make the subject I was speaking about, change from pillows , to geese?

Anyway, it seems this describes it the best.

With exception to the part in bold, which is dead on the money......
Some of this "seems to" indicate that I can take a photo anyway I want. So long as I see it as Art, and call it Art and claim that it reflects my artistic abilities, throw in a few more fancy words, claim I intended for the image to be flawed.........throw in some deep dialog about how I felt the image........and VOILAAAAAAAAAA, I'm an artist.

Just say NO to tilted horizons......

Goose down pillow and goose was a really bad analogy for this thread.....

In all fairness I don't think any analogy would work. I've seen analogy after analogy used and no one is ever content I don't think I've seen one analogy used that didn't get shot down

 

[MTVision]

In all fairness I don't think any analogy would work. I've seen analogy after analogy used and no one is ever content I don't think I've seen one analogy used that didn't get shot down

TBH I just skimmed through the others but they were of a different nature. LightSpeeds was about your question/topic. You asked What people thought of a teacher saying something (advice) about tilted horizons.....it didn't really veer off tilted horizons. It may have been more then you asked but it didn't completely change to a whole other topic (like goose down pillows to goose). That's all I meant about the bad analogy.

 

[inallseriousness]

You clearly haven't seen all the "facebook photographers" that add unnecessary tilt to their images. Or even just accidental tilt that they don't fix (like a photographer should) in post processing.

Unnecessary according to whom? Who is the arbiter of necessary image tilts?

There is a certain time to use an unlevel horizon, and most people do not know when it is IMO. That's all I am saying. You're reading too far into my post. But, remain on your soapbox as you will.

Again with this appointed time. Please, only use tilted horizons ummm... when was it? Oh yes, to show motion. That is the certain time.

How's that soapbox working? Seems like a pretty good fit.

Inallseriousness, in all seriousness, you and your seven posts back you up with no credentials. If you want to start posting some work that you, in all seriousness, think is seriously a good use of tilt I'd be up for that. I said that there is a time and place for having an unlevel horizon. The time and place is not ALL THE TIME.

You first. I'll let you know what I think... you know, if you used it at the right time and place.

However at this point I see you as someone who doesn't even attempt to hold a camera level, of lack the knowledge or resources to do so in post. Troll it up, or post it up. I'd really like to know what your idea of 'good' tilt is. Who knows, I might agree! :thumbup:

I could care less how you see me. Preach on though on the rights and wrongs of all things photography... who knows, I might agree with something you say! :thumbup:

 

[Fred Berg]

The world hasn't been flat for about five to six hundred years or since Columbus bumped into America, whichever came first; so why all the fuss about having something which we know to be curved straight? The world is kinda twisted, as are most of the people in it, so if this tilt of the horizon was encouraged as a positive thing all those years ago, why should this be so surprising? Teachers are human.

 

[Bend The Light]

The world hasn't been flat for about five to six hundred years or since Columbus bumped into America, whichever came first; so why all the fuss about having something which we know to be curved straight? The world is kinda twisted, as are most of the people in it, so if this tilt of the horizon was encouraged as a positive thing all those years ago, why should this be so surprising? Teachers are human.

The world was never flat. Or did it flatten out when Columbus sailed around and crashed into America?

What was the highest mountain before Everest was discovered?

 

[Fred Berg]

The world hasn't been flat for about five to six hundred years or since Columbus bumped into America, whichever came first; so why all the fuss about having something which we know to be curved straight? The world is kinda twisted, as are most of the people in it, so if this tilt of the horizon was encouraged as a positive thing all those years ago, why should this be so surprising? Teachers are human.

The world was never flat. Or did it flatten out when Columbus sailed around and crashed into America?

What was the highest mountain before Everest was discovered?

I realise they say it's grim Ooop-Nooerth, but to have to live without a sense of humour is harsh indeed.

 

[Bend The Light]

The world hasn't been flat for about five to six hundred years or since Columbus bumped into America, whichever came first; so why all the fuss about having something which we know to be curved straight? The world is kinda twisted, as are most of the people in it, so if this tilt of the horizon was encouraged as a positive thing all those years ago, why should this be so surprising? Teachers are human.

The world was never flat. Or did it flatten out when Columbus sailed around and crashed into America?

What was the highest mountain before Everest was discovered?

I realise they say it's grim Ooop-Nooerth, but to have to live without a sense of humour is harsh indeed.

I have one...just obviously a different one to you...my post was in jest.

 

[ann]

As a professional educator I must say I find that an unusual statement to make to a beginner.

However, I have had students tell me "you said, .......," and in reality that was not what I said. So perhaps she heard exactly what they said, or perhaps she interpreted what was said.

And frankly I am getting testy about the phrase "those who can't do, teach" there are some who can do both

 

[o hey tyler]

You clearly haven't seen all the "facebook photographers" that add unnecessary tilt to their images. Or even just accidental tilt that they don't fix (like a photographer should) in post processing.

Unnecessary according to whom? Who is the arbiter of necessary image tilts?



Again with this appointed time. Please, only use tilted horizons ummm... when was it? Oh yes, to show motion. That is the certain time.

How's that soapbox working? Seems like a pretty good fit.

Inallseriousness, in all seriousness, you and your seven posts back you up with no credentials. If you want to start posting some work that you, in all seriousness, think is seriously a good use of tilt I'd be up for that. I said that there is a time and place for having an unlevel horizon. The time and place is not ALL THE TIME.

You first. I'll let you know what I think... you know, if you used it at the right time and place.

However at this point I see you as someone who doesn't even attempt to hold a camera level, of lack the knowledge or resources to do so in post. Troll it up, or post it up. I'd really like to know what your idea of 'good' tilt is. Who knows, I might agree! :thumbup:

I could care less how you see me. Preach on though on the rights and wrongs of all things photography... who knows, I might agree with something you say! :thumbup:

I'm not asking you to post YOUR work, I'm asking you to show me what YOUR idea of a good use of tilt is. So far you've done nothing, and added nothing to the conversation. When do you think tilt is good? Are you just going to troll my posts? Or are you going to cite examples at a bare minimum.

Soooooooo... If you're ready, you can find ANYONE's work and post a link to it. As I stated, I don't think using tilt all the time is good. It lends to a certain situation. Lots of people don't know the right situation...

Lets use Hoffer Photography as an example. I like a lot of their work, but I feel that some images are weak due to the fact that they're tilted... This image being one of them: http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos...679236569_25997811568_8875053_412417554_n.jpg

However, I feel that an unlevel horizon works in this photo, and that they used the angle to good effect: http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hpho...79321569_25997811568_8875055_1777444903_n.jpg

Feel free to disagree with me, but if you do you might actually want to have logic behind your opinions.

 

[RebeccaAPhotography]

I used to take piano lessons. I struggle with rhythm. I can't count beyond a sixteenth note. When my mom mentioned it to my teacher (who had not even tried to address it), her answer was that I was "taking creative license". I wasn't. I honestly couldn't count. Now, years later, I'm back into playing and I have to re-learn how to count because my teacher didn't bother to correct me years ago. I wish she had.

I haven't seen your friend's photos. It is completely possible that what she's doing is fine, but it's also possible that she just got into the habit and was never corrected like my music. Personally, I wouldn't hire a photographer who chronically tilted photos. It would drive me crazy. One or two, maybe, all of them, no way.

From knowing music that is total BS! Sorry they never taught you the right way

 

[Overread]

So in the end we are all in agreement - tilt is best used when its needed and not when its not and that one can indeed form an artistic style around the specific use of a certain presentation of a subject (which might or might not involve the use of methods such as tilting).





I would also add that sometimes certain photos don't work alone. Sometimes a photo needs to be part of something greater, a set or a series, to really convey its full meaning and impact. Yes we can harp on that each photo must stand alone etc.. and all that nice armchair theory - but in the end sometimes things work best when they are presented in a set or as part of a larger body of work.

Plus added to that we've personal taste - some of Bitter's stuff (as an example most of us have seen) would be a prime example of where someone, like myself, might not appreciate it half as much as other people. Doesn't make the work any more or any less valid, it just means that's my viewpoint on the matter.

 

[cgipson1]

As a professional educator I must say I find that an unusual statement to make to a beginner.

However, I have had students tell me "you said, .......," and in reality that was not what I said. So perhaps she heard exactly what they said, or perhaps she interpreted what was said.

And frankly I am getting testy about the phrase "those who can't do, teach" there are some who can do both

Ann.. I have used that phrase in jest before.. I assure you it was not meant seriously! If my use of it offended you, I apologize! I was using it to refer to those that truly CANNOT DO.. but still try to teach (it was in a Meetup question thread, talking about how bad some of the local meetup "Teachers / Pros" were.)

 

[inallseriousness]

I'm not asking you to post YOUR work, I'm asking you to show me what YOUR idea of a good use of tilt is. So far you've done nothing, and added nothing to the conversation. When do you think tilt is good? Are you just going to troll my posts? Or are you going to cite examples at a bare minimum.

Soooooooo... If you're ready, you can find ANYONE's work and post a link to it. As I stated, I don't think using tilt all the time is good. It lends to a certain situation. Lots of people don't know the right situation...

Lets use Hoffer Photography as an example. I like a lot of their work, but I feel that some images are weak due to the fact that they're tilted... This image being one of them: http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos...679236569_25997811568_8875053_412417554_n.jpg

However, I feel that an unlevel horizon works in this photo, and that they used the angle to good effect: http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hpho...79321569_25997811568_8875055_1777444903_n.jpg

Feel free to disagree with me, but if you do you might actually want to have logic behind your opinions.

Look, this is your original post on the matter at hand:

If she makes photos with tilted horizons in the WRONG way, then there's plenty bad about it.

There's a right and a wrong time for tilted horizons.

It is right to have a tilted horizon when the movement in the photograph favors such.

My logic has nothing to do with the inherent value of a tilted or straightened horizon. Instead, I was responding to your blanket statement about the photographer tilting horizons "in the wrong way" and that's bad, right, wrong, bad photography, etc.... as though it's perfectly valid for one to make such a claim. You even went on to say with specificity that the right/ correct way is when movement in the photography favors it. I have a problem with people trying to foist their opinions upon others and dress them up as something other than opinion by calling it right, wrong, correct, incorrect when those terms don't apply across the board. It's merely your own opinion and the photographic feature works for you or it doesn't. There's no right or wrong except to your own eye (and the photographer's, client's, curator's, gallery owner's or any other viewers). We may all reach a consensus of opinion, but there's no rule to be had here.

Every work has to be evaluated on it's own merit and while you may deduce that a tilted horizon doesn't work for you in photo A, but it does in photo B... realize that doesn't indicate it was applied in the wrong way (or the right one) to everyone's eye. It just did or didn't work for you... or maybe a hundred people, in which case the photographer may decide to change his/ her tact - or not. The point is, it's completely subjective. Your original comment is silly at best and arrogant at worst. You could apply what you said to ANY feature one might find in a photo and it'd have the same impact.

Good talk.

 

[The_Traveler]

There are no rules and the guidelines are only vague descriptions of how people see and expect to see things.
Generally one make horizons flat or buildings upright because people expect to see them that way and so, if there isn't an artistic reason for going against the guidelines, follow them.

If, however, you want to use the confounding of people's expectations as part of your composition, as part of your art, then do it - but always have a reason.

 

[o hey tyler]

In all seriousness, I seriously stick to what I said in my fist post.

There's a right and a wrong time, IMO.

Art is subjective, and that's my opinion. Your opinion might be that photos look great inverted 180 degrees... That might not be how the majority feels though.