Need help choosing studio lighting

Nikon_Mike · Dec 19, 2012

Greetings all, I'm new to this forum and I hope someone out there can help me. Photography is a hobby of mine but I'm not a professional, however I've been given the job of photographing the products my company sells. We're setting up a studio area and are in need of lighting. We currently have a Calumet SL455 light with (I think) 4500K lamps and 2 Smith Victor floodlights with 500W bulbs. The kicker here is that we sell large scale Christmas decor, things like wreaths up to 10ft in diameter and 12-14ft trees. Pretty much everything I will have to shoot will be large scale. My current lights are inadequate (and the color temps don't match) and I'd like to know what I need to be able to do the following:

1) All items are shot against a white paper background. I need the background to be completely white in the shots so that edges of the products, like pine needs and such, are clearly visible. The background needs to be bright even behind tall objects, top to bottom.

2) Tall items, like the trees I mentioned, must be evenly lit top to bottom.

I've been given authority to make purchases, but I don't have a unlimited budget. The cheaper the better, though I know that stuff like this usually doesn't have a cheap answer.

pic_chick · Dec 19, 2012

bulid a cyc wall. it will do the best job i think. the lighting lots of it and a product photography class is mostly going to be needed.

nycphotography · Dec 19, 2012

I somehow doubt the bosses are prepared for what a studio like this might cost, even at the low end.

What is your budget?

Are you being permanently allocated the raw space, or does this studio have to set up and break down?

tirediron · Dec 19, 2012

What is your budget in dollars? This could be done for $500 or $15,000 dollars. My suggestion is going to be somewhere in between. First (if you don't have it already) you'll need a background and support system. Since you're talking about tall objects, I would just mounting your seamless white background paper from the ceiling rather than on a traditional backdrop stand. This can be done with something as simple as a couple of 'J' hooks and a long pole.

For lights, I would consider something like the Elinchrom BX-Ri 500 w/s monolights. These are a good compromise between consumer-quality and pro quality, and should give you all you need. I would want at least five. You will need two for the background, and 2-3 for most big product shots. For modifiers, I would look at two large (48x48) soft-boxes and a large (12x48) strip box. These use the built-in Skyport triggering system, so no need for extra expense there. For support, you will want four GOOD quality 12' air-cushioned light-stands and at least one boom stand.

Altogether, that will probably run about $5000 give or take a little. You could use a budget consumer system such as Adorama's Flashpoint line and probably come in at around $1200, but those are NOT meant to stand up to the rigors of regular commercial use.

Nikon_Mike · Dec 19, 2012

Thanks for the responses.

Pic Chick - What is a CYC wall?

NYCPhoto - The space is being permanently allocated for a studio. In the past I had to break everything down and keep it out of the way but results were inconsistent and it was a huge hassle trying to shoot while people are walking through your set. Now I finally have room to work.

Tirediron - We have a 107" wide roll of background paper mounted to a pulley system that will allow for it to be raised and lowered up to 20ft. There is a system of ropes and snap links to suspend wreaths and other items that wouldn't normally sit on the ground. The walls have been painted white. That set up you mention sounds nice but $5000 is out of the question. I don't have a set budget, but I'd say $1500 is probably tops. Not much to work with, I know.

nycphotography · Dec 19, 2012

You will need from 1 to 4 background lights, with stands, possibly w/ softboxes. These are the key to getting white backgrounds. you don't have to light ALL the background... just behind your subject. you can clone out background falloff in post, so long as your subject is fully lit.

You will need 1 or 2 main lights, w/ stands, possibly w/ softboxes.

You will need 1 or 2 accent lights, w/ stands, possibly w/ softboxes, strip boxes, or grids.

You will need a flash meter.

You can use cheap lights like alien bees or the adorama or b&h budget lines. they work. I own alien bees. But I struggle with color balance. Maybe it's the lights, maybe it's me.

you will probably want to pay a professional to come in and shoot in your studio using your equipment at least once. Think of it as a free lesson. video tape the session.

Just some more thoughts based on your response.

tirediron · Dec 19, 2012

Nikon_Mike said:
...That set up you mention sounds nice but $5000 is out of the question. I don't have a set budget, but I'd say $1500 is probably tops. Not much to work with, I know.

"Cyc wall" = cyclorama wall: A curved, white background. The ceiling-mounted white seamless I think will work fine for this, but a $1500 budget is pretty tight. That's going to put you in the Flashpoint end of the spectrum with which there are a couple of problems: These are consumer-grade lights meant for amateurs who want to experiment and learn studio lighting in their home on weekends. They are NOT going to stand up to long-term commercial use, and you will run into white balance and colour-cast issues with them.

Something else you might consider is having a local pro come in for a consultation. Your bosses might regard the word of a neutral third-party more strongly than yours or some faceless Internet posts.

pic_chick · Dec 19, 2012

https://www.google.com/search?q=cyc...s=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a. here is a link to google

Nikon_Mike · Dec 19, 2012

I like the idea of a cyclorama wall, and while I believe we have the people and materials to build one, I don't know if that's an option that the boss will go for, but I'll present it to him.

Nycphoto and tirediron - You're recommending strobes then? Why would these be superior to continuous lights? Sorry for the dumb questions but I have very limited experience with strobes in a studio environment. I've always favored natural light shooting, so lighting is not my forte.

tirediron · Dec 19, 2012

Strobes are recommended because they have a much greater light output than continuous lighting. To adequately light a 12' tree with continuous lighting would require several Kw of light, and be very expnsive to buy and costly to operate. The strobes, while they seem expensive initially, will cost, by comparison, almost nothing to operate. They will also proved a more even and constant temperature of light, something which is only obtainable from very expensive continuous lights. They are also much easier to use and work with, once you learn the basics about studio lighting.

nycphotography · Dec 19, 2012

^ That. They call continuous lights "hot lights" and if you've ever worked on a set for a couple hours, you'll know why. Hot lights REALLY not appropriate for your scenario.

As to a cyc... 10' wide paper hung with a curve to the floor (ie secured at the top and taped down at the bottom) IS an infinite cyc for a 4' wide subject. ;-)

Nikon_Mike · Dec 19, 2012

Thanks for the answers guys, you've been a great help with this project.
I asked a friend of mine who is a photographer, and she recommended Dynalite strobes as good for the price. I looked at the prices and the kits run the gamut of $1500-$3500+. Any opinions on these lights?

Tirediron - You're right about needing something durable. We carry an extensive line of products, and my boss is quite picky - the lights will get a workout. Is there a affordable brand that you'd recommend outside of the Flashpoint line?

NYCPhoto - I looked at the Alien Bees line. I like that they are self contained, saves money, but your problems with color might be an issue. How bad are they? I'm pretty good with Photoshop (been using it since Ver.4) so I'm no stranger to color correction, but the less I have to do the better, as I'm usually pressed for time. Are the AB lights durable? I see that the most powerful unit listed puts out 640W max. Will that be enough to light something like a 12ft tree?

nycphotography · Dec 20, 2012

The 640ws light is powerful enough to light an entire studio... don't make the mistake of buying only the biggest lights... 160ws and 320ws will adjust down to lower settings for when you need it and you should have some of each.

As to durability, AB's take a good beating. They (used to at least) come in padded bags, and I've knocked them over plenty of times, so far I just broke the modeling light (std 60w bulb). Like most things, the more careful you are, the longer they last, but I wouldnt call them fragile by any means. The heads are compact which reduces the stress on the mounts. My old "cheep pre AB monolight" (excalibur I think) was long nosed and awkward and hard to balance on the light stands, but the AB's are well balanced.

Honestly, for white balance, I think its more me than the lights (i tend to do weird exposures and odd colors on purpose, so when I need to hit accurate color, i don't have much of an eye for it). At your budget you don't have many options, and the AB's will definitely do a great job (ask around).

If you use them so much you wear them out, then you definitely got your money's worth and you can replace them with better equipment when they're dead. Which will probably not happen for a good long while.

Mad_Gnome · Dec 29, 2012

I use two Alien Bees B800 strobes and a single White Lightning X1600 strobe (same manufacturer and design as the Alien Bees). I have no issues with color balance, and any minor issues I have ever heard of with AB strobes is easily corrected in post. I would recommend a single B800 as a key (main) light, a B400 as a fill, and potentially a second B400 to light the background if necessary. Add in a softbox for your key light and a couple umbrellas for your fill lights and you're probably still coming in under a grand. As for durability, I've had one of my AB lights for 4 years. It's been blown over, dropped, shot like crazy and otherwise abused, and the housing is cracked, but otherwise it continues to fire like brand new. I haven't even had to replace the flash tube yet.