Nikon Speedlights/Wireless

andrew99 · Apr 16, 2008

Hi guys, can anyone with experience with the Nikon wireless flashes comment on how reliable the wireless is? I believe it's infrared and needs line of sight to work. How is the range, and do you run into situations where the infrared is limiting? Also, say for example I have my SB600 on a stand and aimed backwards into an unbrella, will it still be able to "see" the infrared signal?

Currently I have a Nikon D40, SB600 flash and the Nikon cable which allows me to use this flash off camera. I'm thinking about adding an SB800 which I'll use on-camera (or with the cable) and use it to trigger the remote SB600 wirelessly. Or would I be better off getting a cheaper flash and some pocket wizards or some other solution? I'm a bit limied with the D40 (it has no wireless commander mode), so I'm not sure if a better body should be the priority. I see guys with D300's and pocket wizards, which makes me think upgrading the body won't solve all my problems!

Big Mike · Apr 16, 2008

Pocket Wizards...or any of the good radio triggers will most likely be more reliable than Nikon's system...especially outdoors.
Of course, with radio, you loose the TTL flash metering and remote control functions...you can only trigger the remote flashes.

Socrates · Apr 16, 2008

andrew99 said:
Hi guys, can anyone with experience with the Nikon wireless flashes comment on how reliable the wireless is? I believe it's infrared and needs line of sight to work. How is the range, and do you run into situations where the infrared is limiting? Also, say for example I have my SB600 on a stand and aimed backwards into an unbrella, will it still be able to "see" the infrared signal?

Currently I have a Nikon D40, SB600 flash and the Nikon cable which allows me to use this flash off camera. I'm thinking about adding an SB800 which I'll use on-camera (or with the cable) and use it to trigger the remote SB600 wirelessly. Or would I be better off getting a cheaper flash and some pocket wizards or some other solution? I'm a bit limied with the D40 (it has no wireless commander mode), so I'm not sure if a better body should be the priority. I see guys with D300's and pocket wizards, which makes me think upgrading the body won't solve all my problems!

It's not IR. It's visible light. The Commander signal is buried in with the monitor pre-flash.

I have the D80 and have used the pop-up as a Commander. I've never had a problem but my distances weren't all that great --- perhaps twenty feet indoors and also outdoors.

Edit --- I frequently use the pop-up as a commander for my 600 on a Stroboframe bracket (Nikon's extension cable is too long and it's clumsy with the Stroboframe). The pre-flash can't hit the 600's sensor directly. It must bounce off a wall or ceiling. It pretty much doesn't work at all outdoors but it's 100% reliable indoors and my son's yuppie house has 10-feet ceilings.

JerryPH · Apr 16, 2008

Speaking from experience, indoors it works awesome. Outdoors I am good to about 20 feet, BUT if I turn the off camera strobes to point towards me a little (and point the heads in the direction I want the flash to go), I have gone 35-40 feet from them on a bright day and not had issues with misfires.

I am waiting for the Radio poppers, so that I can use CLS or high-speed synch from *WAY* further and not need to worry about anything.

Garbz · Apr 17, 2008

Actually it is IR. IR is a more robust transmission mechanism than visible light. The SB-600 and SB-800 have an IR filter on their sensors. But yeah point taken the flash visibly fires.

I'll also second that indoors it works well. It works around corners behind the flash, the trigger needs just a small amount of light and providing there's a wall or roof nearby the flash will trigger from any angle, even behind the subject.

kundalini · Apr 17, 2008

I too have not had any issues with them firing when not in line-of-sight indoors. I have had my flashes positioned behind the camera, in another room even. I just make sure the receiver sensor is pointing in the direction of the on-board flash. You can twist and adjust the flash head in most any direction you desire.

I have had some misfires outside in bright sunlight when at ~15" away. But that was early on when I got the flashes and it could easily have been my error. I haven't tried in a while.

andrew99 · Apr 17, 2008

Ok, thanks for the insight, guys! The SB800 is definitely going to be my next purchase! Even if I decide to go RF sometime down the road, I think having an SB600 and SB800 will be a great combination.

Socrates · Apr 17, 2008

Garbz said:
Actually it is IR. IR is a more robust transmission mechanism than visible light. The SB-600 and SB-800 have an IR filter on their sensors.

I didn't think that my D80 has an IR transmitter so I did some investigating. I discovered that the pop-up mixes a visible light monitor flash with an IR commander signal and, obviously, the IR signal can not be seen.

Nikon recommends an SG-3IR filter in front of the pop-up if the subject is extremely close and there is a risk that the monitor flash will illuminate the subject. The filter blocks visible light and allows IR to pass. The filter is also recommended when rear curtain sync is used but I do not understand why.

The filter is included with the R1 and R1C1 close-up speedlight kits but apparently it's not available as a separate purchase.

Stranger · Apr 17, 2008

what i have just learned and think i will end up doing is getting an sb-800 and throwing a pocketwizard on that. And then buying other flashes will slave mode and using the 800 to command them. That way, i can upgrade to more pocketwizards when i really need them, and i can utilize the good $80 flashes.

Something to think about

kundalini · Apr 17, 2008

Stranger said:
what i have just learned and think i will end up doing is getting an sb-800 and throwing a pocketwizard on that. And then buying other flashes will slave mode and using the 800 to command them. That way, i can upgrade to more pocketwizards when i really need them, and i can utilize the good $80 flashes.

Something to think about

If you're looking to just have a commander on the camera's hotshoe to control multiple slave units, you can use the SU-800 commander.

skoundrel · Apr 17, 2008

i am so pleased with the nikon cls on both my old d70s and the d300. The d300 can control the output of all the flashes (in different groups so they can be set to differeent values) right from the camera!

i havent shot around other nikon photographers shooting in commander mode though at the same time.. does anyone have any experience/problems with this?

Stranger · Apr 17, 2008

kundalini said:
If you're looking to just have a commander on the camera's hotshoe to control multiple slave units, you can use the SU-800 commander.

you just saved me some money sir.... This will command non nikon slave units as well?

Garbz · Apr 18, 2008

No it won't. The SU-800 Commander is the Commander unit for Nikon CLS based flashes like the SB-600 and SB-800. It's a Nikon proprietary system and will work only with newish higher end Nikon flashes.

Socrates: Interesting, never knew Nikon had such a product. The flash itself emits quite a bit of IR light. I've seen flash photography done with IR filters on the flash and IR sensitive film before. It's the IR component of the visible flash light which fires the trigger. The SU-800 is a truly IR unit. I am led to believe that this unit will not fire a visible light when triggering the CLS slaves.

andrew99 · Apr 18, 2008

The SU-800 is almost as expensive as the SB-800! Argh! If it was less than $100 I would get one for sure.

Socrates · Apr 18, 2008

Garbz said:
No it won't. The SU-800 Commander is the Commander unit for Nikon CLS based flashes like the SB-600 and SB-800. It's a Nikon proprietary system and will work only with newish higher end Nikon flashes.

Socrates: Interesting, never knew Nikon had such a product. The flash itself emits quite a bit of IR light. I've seen flash photography done with IR filters on the flash and IR sensitive film before. It's the IR component of the visible flash light which fires the trigger. The SU-800 is a truly IR unit. I am led to believe that this unit will not fire a visible light when triggering the CLS slaves.

I am constantly amazed at how much experimentation is necessary merely to figure out how the camera bases its decisions. I like automation provided that I know what it's doing.