Question regarding paments

[fairchildphotography]

Hi, I'm fairly new to "professional" photography. I have what I am considering a unique issue and I was wondering if anyone had any input.

My full time job is at a music school and from time to time the school puts on shows. My boss, the owner of the school has requested that I do the photography for the shows so that she can use the images, or at least some of the images for the school's website.
A lot of the students also have mentioned that if I do this, they would like to purchase the prints of themselves.

My question is how do I go about charging for this.

My first thought was that I give my boss my hourly rate, including time spent taking the photos and time spent editing, charge her said amount and allow her to use the images (as long as her website will not allow people to right click the images and save them), then allow any performers wanting the images to purchase directly from me.

My concern came when I thought about the fact that my boss would be hiring me to take the shots for her. So doesn't that make the shots then hers...making me unable to then sell them to anyone else? Or does that way of thinking become null and void when the images are of specific performers, meaning that even if I have been hired to take the photos by the school, each performer also has the right to own a copy themselves.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance,
Mark
Fairchild Photography

 

[KmH]

The work you would be doing for the school would be commercial photography.

Selling images to the students would be retail. Commercial and retail have different pricing models.

There is no effective way to keep people from copying online images. If right-click is disabled, people can just take a 'screen shot'.

The Commecrial pricing model most used is to charge a creative fee that covers your time, talent, post processing, etc, plus the cost of a 'use license'.
Terms of the use license are based on the usage needed and the duration of the use.
As an example, for exclusive use online (and only online) at up to 400x400 pixels I charged $35 for 3 months of usage. If they wanted to use the images at up to 600x600 px it was $50 per image for 3 months online usage. As image resolution got bigger from there the cost per image for 3 months accelerated.

To learn more about the commercial business/pricing model visit www.asmp.org and on the left of their homepage click on 'Business Resources'.

As far as the boss owning the copyright to whatever photos you make, that will depend on what country you are in, which isn't indicated in your profile. Here in the USA you would own the copyrights unless you sign a document that states otherwise, known as a 'work for hire' agreement.

www.copyright.gov

 

[tirediron]

This is by no means a unique situation, but depending on what country your in, as Keith indicated, it can be a little tricky (BTW, fire whoever does your SEO; I couldn't find your website even though I entered "Fairchild Photography" directly in to Google!). You need to have some fairly good contract and release documents drawn up. My impression is that you and your business are not yet at the stage where you are ready to deal with a matter like this.

 

[orljustin]

Has your boss said he is willing to pay extra? Because he may just be figuring you'll do it as part of your job, and if so, they will likely hold copyright. Yes, I know it sometimes depends on what your current/expected duties are. If you can angle cash, charge a little more than your hourly wage, document all hours, and let the school use them for their site to show off the program ( looks good when your job comes up at budget time ).For the kids, just have your boss put a note in the program that performance images are available at blahblah.com and the just offer stuff at 25% over cost.

 

[KmH]

Not just sometimes orljustin, all the time.

See US Copyright Office Circular 9 - http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ09.pdf - and the part where is covers: Employer–Employee Relationship Under Agency Law.

Important: The term “employee” here is not really the same as the common understanding of the term. For copyright purposes, it means an employee under the general common law of agency

 

[orljustin]

Not just sometimes orljustin, all the time. See US Copyright Office Circular 9 - http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ09.pdf - and the part where is covers: Employer–Employee Relationship Under Agency Law.

Important: The term “employee” here is not really the same as the common understanding of the term. For copyright purposes, it means an employee under the general common law of agency

No, as I said, it depends upon the scope of duties/responsibilities of the employee and how the works were created. If the duties of the employee do not typically include photography, then the photo works do not necessarily fall under the existing employee-employer relationship which covers work for hire.See employees section here: http://www.artuntitled.com/pgextra/workhire.htmlThe OP doesn't say whether the boss 'has requested' he do it as part of his job, or whether he wants to hire him, like a wedding photog, as well.

 

[imagemaker46]

Full time job at a music school. New to "professional" photography. Doesn't sound like you should be at the "professional" stage just yet.

 

[Tony S]

If your boss is having you do the work and paying you your hourly wage you are most likely working under "work for hire" rules which means they have all rights to the photos.

If you are doing it on your own time, then it's up to you to hammer out a contract (no friendly handshake stuff here, it could get really sticky doing that with your employer) with specific terms including the time you will be there and how long you are to shoot for,exactly what you are shooting, the pay rate, and who gets to do what with the images. Don't forget your COI for shooting on location.

For something like this there is a charge for me to show up to shoot, a specific charge for each of the uses a client would want images for (ie, brochures, website, advertisement, wall posters), and the right to market the images to the other participants. It would all be spelled out in my contract including.