Questions about working in a studio

[NedM]

I took my portfolio, resume and decided to in touch with a local studio in hopes to get hired.

I have no experience in an actual studio but I'm aware of my skills as a photographer.

I showed up and the manager liked my work enough to give me a chance.

She decided she wants me to photograph some graduates at a church their studio was hired for.

She wants to see how I work and all that.

So she assigned me to shadow a photographer.

She said if all goes well, I will be making $50 each time I am sent out onto an event where I am needed.

*Note I am only making about $50 for photographing graduates at a church for about 3-5 hours possibly.

Is this chump change I'm making?

Am I better off trying a different studio?

I want to work in the studio not on location.

 

[Designer]

It's a test. If you pass the test, you could be worth more.

 

[IzzieK]

$50 a pop? 3 hours? You can do better than that....on your own if you really think you are good.

 

[pixmedic]

$50 for 3 hours IS chump change if you are paying taxes on it.

However, if you use it as a chance to show them a good product, you might be able to use it to negotiate a better price next time. Maybe.

Alternatively, that might just be what they are willing to budget.
You could always ask.

 

[tirediron]

If all you're getting is money, it's not worth it. If you're going to get a photographic education from working pros, it's a fortune!

 

[NedM]

It's a test. If you pass the test, you could be worth more.

I was thinking the same thing too, but it could be a while before I'm 'worth' anything.
I figured I would have to work my way up from the bottom.

$50 a pop? 3 hours? You can do better than that....on your own if you really think you are good.

I know my skills as a photographer has brought me plenty of paid but I figured I could add some studio experience in my resume.
Yes, 3 hours is a bit much, but I am shadowing a photographer so it's not that bad I suppose.

$50 for 3 hours IS chump change if you are paying taxes on it.

However, if you use it as a chance to show them a good product, you might be able to use it to negotiate a better price next time. Maybe.

Alternatively, that might just be what they are willing to budget.
You could always ask.

No, I am going to be paid under the table, so no taxes for me!

That is true, I suppose the more I shadow their photographers and show that I can provide what is needed, I can receive better payments each time.

I ended up taking the job and I figured, what do I have to lose?
I would just be sitting on my ass all day if I didn't take the job.
So why the hell not?

Besides, their providing with some equipment, and this could be fun.

 

[Big Mike]

There are plenty of people who would gladly shadow a professional photographer for free. It's the education that you should be interested in, not the money (at this point).

As I'm sure you'll find out, there isn't really a lot of money to be made when working for someone else. The real money is in working for yourself, but of course, that requires you to actually find clients, sell them and then run the business successfully.....and that's the part that usually trips people up, even if they are great photographers.

 

[KmH]

No, I am going to be paid under the table, so no taxes for me!

You will likely be being paid as an independent contractor which makes you responsible for the taxes.

If in fact the studio has said they will pay you "under the table", that would be a studio to be very wary of working for because they will have demonstrated that they are not honest.

 

[JoeW]

I took my portfolio, resume and decided to in touch with a local studio in hopes to get hired.

I have no experience in an actual studio but I'm aware of my skills as a photographer.

I showed up and the manager liked my work enough to give me a chance.

She decided she wants me to photograph some graduates at a church their studio was hired for.

She wants to see how I work and all that.

So she assigned me to shadow a photographer.

She said if all goes well, I will be making $50 each time I am sent out onto an event where I am needed.

*Note I am only making about $50 for photographing graduates at a church for about 3-5 hours possibly.

Is this chump change I'm making?

Am I better off trying a different studio?

I want to work in the studio not on location.

Okay, multiple responses:

1. Don't go in to photography to make money. It will break your heart. There are ways to make money doing this. But at this point in your career, it's not an appropriate thing to focus on.

2. Yes, $50 for 3-5 hours is chump change. And it's more likely to be 5 hours rather than 3. But here's the deal...if you're working as a subcontractor for a studio that is shooting kids' sports teams (or HS graduation or church portraits...ie: an assembly shooting hundreds or thousands of people) than you're not making much money PERIOD. That's b/c the studio has to mark up the prices in order to make a profit. And people don't go to studios like this for $7,000 sittings. They go for a $200 all-included package. Or a $50 glamour shoot. For someone with your experience level to get hired by a studio, $50 for 3-5 hours is what about you can expect. Going to another "studio" isn't going to get you a substantially better deal...it will probably be comparable (both in pay and in work).

3. What you really should be asking is if this experience is going to help you as a photographer. With no experience in a studio, getting a chance to shadow someone who might be a pro, to get a reference working from a photography business, acquire more experience about assembly-line shoots (like the organization, quick posing, managing large groups of people)...all of that is invaluable. B/c basically there are two types of photographers who make livings off of photography:
--those that command really big fees (they shoot a wedding for $20k).
--those that can shoot a lot and manage the assembly line (they shoot quickly and capture what they need, their work requires minimal post-production, they make quick decisions about what to keep, they have standard packages so the amount of negotiation/back-and-forth/unreasonable expectations are all minimized, they can edit in batch) so they have volume (these are photographers who may shoot 4 weddings in one weekend).

4. No insult intended but you've indicated your experience level here with your point about "wanting to work in a studio." Most of these commercial assembly lines (that shoot church parishioners or athletic teams or graduation photos) have the word "studio" in their name but they're shooting on-site. They go to an elementary school gym on a weekend, set up a backdrop and a couple of umbrellas, put camera on a tripod, put an X on the floor, have a soccer ball as a prop, an assistant to coordinate/organize the teams, and then shoot a new team every 20 minutes for 8 hours for 2 days...and none of it is in the studio. These days, for this kind of work (assembly-line, shoot in volume), you'd need to have a studio with waiting space for about 50-70 people and a huge parking lot, in order to shoot like this in your studio. So "studio" in the business name is just a way for public to get "oh hey, they take portraits!" A "studio" that actually isn't "on location" is going to be something like..."GlamourShots" or the Wal-Mart studios in the store (and those are probably a step down from what you're looking at). For my way of thinking, that (a Wal-Mart) is a pretty minimal difference from shooting in the elementary school gym.

 

[vfotog]

It's a test. If you pass the test, you could be worth more.

I was thinking the same thing too, but it could be a while before I'm 'worth' anything.
I figured I would have to work my way up from the bottom.

$50 a pop? 3 hours? You can do better than that....on your own if you really think you are good.

I know my skills as a photographer has brought me plenty of paid but I figured I could add some studio experience in my resume.
Yes, 3 hours is a bit much, but I am shadowing a photographer so it's not that bad I suppose.

$50 for 3 hours IS chump change if you are paying taxes on it.

However, if you use it as a chance to show them a good product, you might be able to use it to negotiate a better price next time. Maybe.

Alternatively, that might just be what they are willing to budget.
You could always ask.

No, I am going to be paid under the table, so no taxes for me!

That is true, I suppose the more I shadow their photographers and show that I can provide what is needed, I can receive better payments each time.

I ended up taking the job and I figured, what do I have to lose?
I would just be sitting on my ass all day if I didn't take the job.
So why the hell not?

Besides, their providing with some equipment, and this could be fun.

don't assume you'll ever get an increase. Since they are lowballing you, they aren't going to magically turn into generous people overnight. And you really need to clarify the remark about "under the table". If it's truly under the table, there's no reason to trust these people. They are breaking the law, they know it. and you know it. Any money you earn, you do need to report it. If they decide to ignore labor laws or choose not pay you anything, well, it's going to be pretty hard to collect what you're owed with no proof of anything. No taxes, no social security, etc etc. Now if they aren't really paying under the table, but making you an independent contractor and sending you a 1099 at the end of the year, be prepared to be responsible for your tax situation in a much more complicated way than a standard job. $50 bucks for 5 hours is definitely chump change. And odds are if you ever do get to shoot something eventually, you will want to clarify in writing what rights are yours, if any. You might not even be able to have anything for your portfolio as they'll probably want it all under their name. You ought to consider looking for a place that will offer you a position that's more on the up and up.

 

[pgriz]

Never mind the photography. This is your opportunity to learn how a studio or commercial shop work. It's about how to handle the person requesting the shoot, how to organize to do it effectively, how to do on-site setup and prep., how to manage your subject during the shoot (also known as "herding cats"), how to wrap up the shoot, etc. It also gives you the possibility of figuring out the economics of the shoot - is the shooting fee based on market demand or other factor? What are the inherent costs? What are the things that can send a well-organized shoot into left field? Based on your observations, what is the profitability of each shoot? What does that suggest to you as a business model?

Ideally, you'd like to work in a bunch of studios to learn how they make things work. Figure out what works well, and what is to be avoided. Then if you're into photography to make money, use your newly-acquired knowledge to not repeat the mistakes that others have made.

Edit:
The hardest thing about a carpentry business is managing your clients, managing your cashflow, managing your risks, (and if you have employees, managing your manpower).
Same for the driving school business.
Same for the personal trainer business.
Same for the cooking school business.
Same for the photography studio business.
See the trend?

 

[jamesbjenkins]

As my grandfather said, "there are a lot more ways than dollars and cents to get paid."

If you're getting to shadow an established pro photog, and learn from them, the fact that you're getting paid some "chump change" in addition is just icing on the cake.

However, if you're not getting any useful training, and they're not increasing your pay after the first job or two, I wouldn't stick around.

 

[e.rose]

Psh, I worked FOR FREE for one of the bigger name photographers here in town 3 times.

The third time he wanted to thank me so he threw me $50.

I wasn't there for the cash.

I was there for the experience... And we're talking less than a year ago I did this.

You have to weigh out whether you feel the experience will be worth it to you. If it is... then take the $50 and do it. If it's not, then find somewhere else that *is* worth the experience.

 

[MidnightUK]

Worth going along a couple of times, just to see how they set up etc. I did that in the past with a photographer. It was hugely useful as I mostly (in his case) got to see what never to do with customers and set up. Even working with a fool can be educational. He would tape down cables for safety but refust to sand bag lightstands or 20 feet high backdrops so they would sometimes fall - needless to say I did not shadow him for long but it was still a very good learning experience in all sorts of ways, both positive and negative.

However you say what do you have to loose? The biggest answer is the tax system - if they find you dodging taxes you will be flagged for life with them and any business you set up with be checked and double checked by them for years to come for any flaw they can pick up on and fine you for (I know someone this happened to, UK based - maybe other countries are less harsh). If they have ever caught anyone in relation to your employer dodging taxes they will be keeping an eye on anyone related to that firm.