Round ii- nikon d700 vs. x-e2

Discussion in 'Mirrorless Cameras' started by funnyfarm, Jan 24, 2014.

  1. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    Hmm, well I have the new X20 which is supposed to have their fast AF... (no idea on specs or comparison to the XE-2). Once it has focus, I don't think chasing kids around the yard would be much problem... I certainly wouldn't put it as notably worse than a 9pt entry level DSLR.


     
  2. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    Yes, but most programs will "apply" the WB setting to the raw file on import. Many OEM programs will even apply all of the Jpeg settings to the raw file... Not that it's "critical," but it can be extra work to "undo."

    I've done them all.. uni, custom, grey, etc etc...now I do none. Here's the reality...there is no such thing as a "correct WB." (and I can almost always find a pure white/black in an image, or close enough).

    Now, if I was doing a long shoot with a bunch of images taken in the same light..hell yeah I'd use a grey card... set WB for one image and copy it to all the rest. But I don't typically do that kind of work.

    The only good use for a color checker is to compare a print to your (hopefully calibrated) display...
     
  3. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    You really have to define your needs/requirements better... If you go with a DSLR, you have more options later if things should change. If you go with a CSC you are permanently closing some doors...at least right now, but not that many.

    You probably need to do the "three lists" thing... Must have, wants, might be nice. And for yourself, prioritize w/in the lists... If you can't knowledgeably create the three lists, well, then there's another issue...
     
  4. Ron Evers

    Ron Evers Been spending a lot of time on here!

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    I do not see a mirror-less camera, well not a higher end one @ least, being a limiter in this regard.
     
  5. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    Does "lifestyle" include lowlight/natural light? If so, the smaller formats will be more limiting. If it includes sports/action, then the smaller formats will be more limiting.

    But if it's more a general purpose type use, then almost anything can work well. I have a Fuji X20 and a Nikon V2... I'm plenty happy using them for a lot of things, and I would include general portraits and lifestyle in that list. They just hit their limits a lot earlier than my DSLR's.
     
  6. funnyfarm

    funnyfarm TPF Noob!

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    Thanks for the advice. I giggled at the 6 kids comment.

    All natural light, and the computer will be calibrated. ;)

    I'm in contact w a pro photographer who will sell me her d700 for $700 plus shipping, but it has 147k clicks. Is it worth the " risk" for that price? That's crazy low $!
     
  7. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    I would consider it worth the risk if it's in very good condition. The shutter is only rated to 150k and many die shortly after that, but many go well beyond that as well (keep in mind the DB is dependent on individuals actually reporting).
    And a shutter replacement ($250-500 depending on what else they decide needs fixing) would still put it under the average price.
     
  8. Ysarex

    Ysarex Been spending a lot of time on here!

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    What programs "apply" on import is their interpretation of the camera's WB; if you load the same photo into 5 different raw converters no two will show exactly the same WB. So you can't set a WB on the camera and then expect to see that WB when you open the raw file. It'll typically be close but each raw converter inputs the file using their own profile. I know they usually say something like "As Shot" or "From Camera" but what you get isn't consistent one to the next nor does it necessarily match what you set on the camera.

    Of course there's correct WB. That color checker for example has known colors that we can measured by the numbers. If you photograph the color checker so that the colors in your photo match the real colors in the checker you've got correct WB. Photograph a grey card and if the RGB values for the card in your photo are equal you've got correct WB.

    You can use a color checker to create input profiles for your cameras. I find that to be a good use especially if you want accurate color.

    Joe
     
  9. funnyfarm

    funnyfarm TPF Noob!

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    Thanks everyone. I passed on the d700. Part of me regrets it but the other half kf me wants to get away from dslr's
     
  10. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    I know that....but the point is that "correct" doesn't always mean true black/white/grey. In fact, for a lot of photography you don't WANT perfect color balance. And you don't usually want "accurate color." Quite often you want more/less saturation/vibrance/black point/white point, etc.

    By input file I assume you mean a custom camera profile... I suppose, if you want. You could also just do it manually.

    The end point really isn't that the image displays or edits "correctly" on a screen, but rather that it prints the way you expect it to. My screen can be jacked up, and my camera profile/defaults jacked up to compensate, and it wouldn't matter as long as it printed correctly (granted, that's a stupid approach).

    I do calibrate my monitor, and I use printer profiles... that's more than enough for me. If I have a bunch of images with the same exposure/scene then I will edit one and sync them... Taking a grey card image would make that more "accurate," but not "better."
     
  11. sk66

    sk66 No longer a newbie, moving up!

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    Well, at least it seems you are progressing towards a decision...
     
  12. Ysarex

    Ysarex Been spending a lot of time on here!

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    I don't want accurate color? OMG! All these years and I've been doing it wrong!! And that college class I teach in Color Management -- OH NOOO!!! How many students have I misled? :wink:

    correct

    adjective : true or accurate : agreeing with facts : having no errors or mistakes
    -- Merriam Webster

    The point is "correct" always does mean accurate. All I said was, "If you shoot raw and you really want accurate WB then you'll shoot a reference target for the light." And I can back that up. You came along with, 'Here's the reality...there is no such thing as a 'correct WB.'" So that's just nonsense and you're sounding very confused now and trying to redefine simple words.

    I think you want to say that you have license as the artist to interpret the color in your photo and if you don't want it to be accurate for whatever reason you're not wrong to do that. That's fine. Of course you can do that. But correct WB is a reality and an option for those who want to pursue it. There's a good argument held by experts in the discipline that your license to interpret the color in your photo is valid only after you can demonstrate that you posses the skill to be accurate when it's called for.

    Most people would in general say that accurate is better than inaccurate.

    Joe
     

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