To, or to not, shoot for free?

[JerryPH]

This is a really interesting point. I was told by business man (not a photographer) that in his opinion, people don't value your work as much if you do it for free or at a reduced price? He believes people value things more if they pay more for it. Its an interesting concept.

... and very common. I spend a lot of time in wedding and portraiture forums and read about this happening on almost a daily basis. People FAR undervalue themselves and their work.

I'm not talking about newbie photographers, but established professionals who often are struggling just to survive and looking to do almost anything to bring in business, hence lowering prices, shooting for free or next to free. This is TOTALLY the worst thing you could do. Want to succeed in business? Learn proper marketing techniques, then raise your prices!

 

[bhop]

I am one of those designers.. I will do quickie stuff for my family and close friends for free, but graphic design is my profession. It's how I pay my bills. If i'm working, i'm getting paid, or else they can find someone else. If photography was my profession, or the profession I aspired to, i'd feel the same.

 

[funkyphotography]

... and very common. I spend a lot of time in wedding and portraiture forums and read about this happening on almost a daily basis. People FAR undervalue themselves and their work.

I'm not talking about newbie photographers, but established professionals who often are struggling just to survive and looking to do almost anything to bring in business, hence lowering prices, shooting for free or next to free. This is TOTALLY the worst thing you could do. Want to succeed in business? Learn proper marketing techniques, then raise your prices!

Sometimes it takes someone else to look at your business! I got a fellow photographer to go through my business and be honest with me. He looked at everything - the time I spend on shoots, the time I spend editing, proofing, misc costs like stationary,petrol,mobile phone,props etc etc He then sat me down and said "Annie, taking everything into consideration - I've worked out you're on $2.34 per hour - how are you supporting your family?" - well I nearly cried! A few days later I did a quote for a wedding ($1500) and the girl looked at me and "no way - you're worth much more than that" - and she did, she paid me an extra $500 and paid for me and hubby to have a weekend away. I still underquote though, I can't help it. I never charge friends and family, and if I think something will look great for my portfolio I won't charge for that either.

 

[KD5NRH]

You should make sure that you never, ever shoot for free. If you're shooting a fountain in the park and someone walks by in the background, beat them up and take all the cash they have to pay for your work. If it's not enough, sell their organs until you get enough.

Or, you could just do what you want to do; it's your life, your camera, and your time, after all.

 

[Fiendish Astronaut]

Or, you could just do what you want to do; it's your life, your camera, and your time, after all.

And we have a winner!

 

[JerryPH]

And we have a winner!

Well.... yes and no.

You see, there is a big difference between some newbie charging someone 5 bucks or less for a 4-hour portrait session and a struggling photographer who quit his or her steady job to turn pro and is now struggling to make payments on their home and feed their kids.

The first instinct for most people with weak business skills is to think that lower prices (their way of increasing value) will draw in business. In fact, what it does is push away the people with the money because they see you now as someone that is not up to their standards. You will also attract the kind of clientele who see you as someone with poor business skills and will try to take advantage of you even further (can you lower your prices? can you do this or that for me for free? and on and on...).

The question will ultimately have a different answer to each person, but if you are a professional, unless there are extenuating circumstances (like family or the pro wanted to do someone a *helluva* favor), there is no reason (short of ignorance), that a pro should not be getting paid with every click of the shutter. There is every reason to learn how to run the business, how to market and how to succeed financially.

A photography business is all about making money, and a LOT less about taking pictures.

 

[JerryPH]

Sometimes it takes someone else to look at your business! I got a fellow photographer to go through my business and be honest with me. He looked at everything - the time I spend on shoots, the time I spend editing, proofing, misc costs like stationary,petrol,mobile phone,props etc etc He then sat me down and said "Annie, taking everything into consideration - I've worked out you're on $2.34 per hour - how are you supporting your family?" - well I nearly cried! A few days later I did a quote for a wedding ($1500) and the girl looked at me and "no way - you're worth much more than that" - and she did, she paid me an extra $500 and paid for me and hubby to have a weekend away. I still underquote though, I can't help it. I never charge friends and family, and if I think something will look great for my portfolio I won't charge for that either.

I rest my case.

I wonder how many pros REALLY sit down and calculate what their hourly rate is in real life? I bet many would cry too.

Now Annie:
- why did it take the photographer friend to tell you the obvious?
- why did it take the customer to give you more?
- why did you not know what your market could bear?

These are not questions to make you feel bad, these are BASIC BUSINESS questions that any business person should have the answers to before the first client comes knocking on their door.

This is the very start, the core, the basics... of business.

I will say it once more... a photography business is all about making money, and a lot less about taking pictures. Not knowing this little fact is one of the biggest reasons 95% of all budding photo businesses are failing.

Let me prove it to you...
- how many crappy quality photographers are out there making a GOOD living?
- How many purportedly good photographers out there don't know the difference between manual and aperture mode, yet make 6 digit per year salaries?
- How many crappy wedding pics have you seen and you KNEW what the couple paid for that crap?

I am not saying all pros suck because that is simply NOT true, however, I will have to admit that judging from what little parts of all the various markets that I have seen, there are WAY MORE crappy photographers making it, than really impressive photographers making it. The ONLY reason they are making it, is because they are good business people, and sadly not because of their photographic skills.

When you find those rare people that have both photographic and business skills, ask them about their calendars... if you can find them, because they are the ones with the full calendars filled with well paying clientele GRATEFUL for the results.

 

[this is my name]

I have shot a few times for money...does that mean I'm a pro. Not even close. Anyway, I've not charged once because it was a good friends wedding and I had never shot a wedding before.

To me it's like doing side jobs as a plumber which is my trade. I am a professional at that and have many years of experience so I charge for my services even if it is friends (not for family though). I do this for a couple reasons. One, this is my trade and I deserve to be compensated. Two, it helps to keep some away that may try to take advantage of you, "as a friend".

 

[funkyphotography]

I rest my case.

I wonder how many pros REALLY sit down and calculate what their hourly rate is in real life? I bet many would cry too.

Now Annie:
- why did it take the photographer friend to tell you the obvious?
- why did it take the customer to give you more?
- why did you not know what your market could bear?

These are not questions to make you feel bad, these are BASIC BUSINESS questions that any business person should have the answers to before the first client comes knocking on their door.

This is the very start, the core, the basics... of business.

I will say it once more... a photography business is all about making money, and a lot less about taking pictures. Not knowing this little fact is one of the biggest reasons 95% of all budding photo businesses are failing.

Let me prove it to you...
- how many crappy quality photographers are out there making a GOOD living?
- How many purportedly good photographers out there don't know the difference between manual and aperture mode, yet make 6 digit per year salaries?
- How many crappy wedding pics have you seen and you KNEW what the couple paid for that crap?

I am not saying all pros suck because that is simply NOT true, however, I will have to admit that judging from what little parts of all the various markets that I have seen, there are WAY MORE crappy photographers making it, than really impressive photographers making it. The ONLY reason they are making it, is because they are good business people, and sadly not because of their photographic skills.

When you find those rare people that have both photographic and business skills, ask them about their calendars... if you can find them, because they are the ones with the full calendars filled with well paying clientele GRATEFUL for the results.

Ummm, when terry sat me down and told me everything I was doing wrong (he had a list) it was a huge shock, he said to me "the problem is that you LOVE photography, its a passion you're not thinking about it as your business - it has to put food on the table for your kids" - yesss he went on for about half an hour!!! And even after he told me that, I STILL don't quote properly! I have to stick to what my website says!!!