What constitutes PROFESSIONAL????

[RMThompson]

Ok, on another thread, you'll see that I am building my website. On my website I put the phrase "professional photographer".

In essence I assume I am professional, even if I know I have a lot to learn, simply because in my mind I've sold pictures and taken pictures for money.

In 2007 I plan on purchasing a business license to make it "legal" but a recent discussion with a photographer I know said you aren't really professional until you join the "Professional photographers of America Guild".

I don't see how that can be true. By definition professional means "following an occupation as a means of livelihood or for gain" so if you've ever charged someone to take a picture, you should be considered PROFESSIONAL on some level.

(I don't mean this to say that my photographs are of a top notch level, I know I have much to learn and much equipment to buy in the next few years)

Now in some states, like mine, certain occupations require certification of study in your chosen field (for example: cosmetology) but i have yet to see ANYTHING for photography.

So what do you guys think?

 

[Big Mike]

I've heard this discussed before...from what I can tell...it's not black and white...there is not definitive definition of 'Professional Photographer'.

Some people will say that if you sell something, you are professional. Others will say that you need to earn the majority of your income from it to be professional. Still others will tell you that you need to be part of some organization (usually members of that organization will tell you that).

There are professions that do require some sort of licence or affiliation to practice. Doctors, lawyers, engineers etc. I'm a Certified Engineering Technologist...but I would still consider my self a professional if I wasn't a member of ASET, who gives me that designation.

I like to take a more general meaning of professional. IMO, to be a professional...someone must demonstrate a level of competency and conduct them selves in a 'professional' manor.

 

[RMThompson]

So should I put it on my site?

Or wait?

 

[Big Mike]

If you feel that you are competent enough to to the job you are advertising...and that you can conduct yourself in a professional way...then, IMO, you can call yourself a professional photographer...but be prepared to take some flak from people like your friend the photographer.

Or just avoid the issue and just call yourself a photographer. I don't think it will matter much to potential clients.

 

[Alex_B]

Ok, on another thread, you'll see that I am building my website. On my website I put the phrase "professional photographer".

In essence I assume I am professional, even if I know I have a lot to learn, simply because in my mind I've sold pictures and taken pictures for money.

by strict meaning of the word, professional means it is your profession, you earn money with it! nothing else.

HOWEVER, depending on the country you are in, certain professions require you to have a certain accredited education on the field or be member of a guild or whatever.

As far as I know, in Germany I am not allowed to call myself a photographer, as I do not have any official accredited education on the field. I can, however, call myself professional photo artist So it is the word photograper mich makes the difficulties

I do not know much about the legal situation in the US, but I would be careful about calling yourself a pro-photographer ... maybe the US-pros from this forum know an answer?

 

[Alex_B]

Or just avoid the issue and just call yourself a photographer. I don't think it will matter much to potential clients.

As far as i know, at least in Germany, one could not call oneself a photographer if that statement is related to a business (as it would be in this case) ... since then photographer refers to a profession.

 

[Christie Photo]

All that is necessary to be a professional photographer is to hang out a shingle (sign). There is no photography license.

You will need to register with the state as a retailer. This means you will be required to keep records, collect sales tax and pass it on to the state.

Pete

 

[Sw1tchFX]

Professional photographer means you shoot images for money. You don't need a degree for it, you don't need to go to school for it, you can just do it. It's not a profession alike a doctor or a lawyer where you need an education to do it.

 

[Alex_B]

Professional photographer means you shoot images for money. You don't need a degree for it, you don't need to go to school for it, you can just do it. It's not a profession alike a doctor or a lawyer where you need an education to do it.

ok, seems to be rather relaxed in the US.

it is different in other countries though

 

[RMThompson]

All that is necessary to be a professional photographer is to hang out a shingle (sign). There is no photography license.

You will need to register with the state as a retailer. This means you will be required to keep records, collect sales tax and pass it on to the state.

Pete

From what I can tell, unless I am selling my photos directly, if I am just selling my service, I only need an occupational license, NOT a retailer.

For now I am only selling the service of me taking the pictures and the post process work. I give my clients a cd with all my work on it and its up to them to do what they want!

Every client gets a free 8x10 gift from me!

 

[photogoddess]

From what I can tell, unless I am selling my photos directly, if I am just selling my service, I only need an occupational license, NOT a retailer.

For now I am only selling the service of me taking the pictures and the post process work. I give my clients a cd with all my work on it and its up to them to do what they want!

Every client gets a free 8x10 gift from me!

Depends on the tax regulations in your state (or country). In California, while taking photos is a service, because it results in tangible goods (prints, cds, etc) 100% of what you charge is subject to sales tax.

 

[craig]

I would leave the label professional off as well. Clients already know you are a pro that is why they are checking you out. To conduct your biz in a professional manner means that you need to comply with sales tax and the government. And follow the (at least) basic rules of commerce. PPA is a great organization. Keep in mind that they are an organization. I like to quote the great Groucho Marx "I would never belong to a church that would have me as a member"

 

[fmw]

I'll go with Craig. When I was a commercial photographer I operated a business that did photography. I also operated another business that did computer systems integration. I spent about 30% of my working time doing photography and about 70% doing computers. My computer business and my photo studio were in the same building separated by only a hundred yards or so.

I did commercial advertising for fortune 500 companies and had my images used in national ad campaigns and catalogs. I had a studio large enough to do automotive photography. I ran a profitable company that billed $thousands each month. I suppose that is professional enough. My business card simply had the name and address/phone of the photography company and my name. No title necessary. People reading the card would know instantly that I did photography.

I was a member of Nikon Professional Services which has membership requirements that you can get from them. No casual or amateur shooters allowed. I belonged to no photographic associations simply because I didn't want to. I had no formal photographic education. I was self taught over many years.

I still do commercial photography but I do it for my own business and don't bill myself for it. I consider myself an amateur photographer. Perhaps even an amateur commercial photographer. So while I have a lot of experience at photography and a proven history of being able to make images good enough to bill people for them and was once a professional photographer, I now earn nothing from photography so I am not a professional any longer.

A business license has nothing to do with it. My computer company sold computer equipment and collected and paid sales taxes. My photography business did not. It billed time, expenses and materials. I paid taxes on the materials when I bought them and included the total price I paid in the billings to clients. I had no retail license for that business. That business filed income tax returns but no sales tax returns.

I should mention that, because someone makes images for money, doesn't make them a good or bad photographer. Some of the best images are made by amateurs and some of the worst by professionals and vice versa.

The nutshell, I suppose, is that none of it really matters.

 

[RMThompson]

I've decided to take professional off, as part of this website (for now) is not to promote myself, but to have a place online to share my work, and discuss it with folks like you.