learning men/Updated OP

[Overread]

Thread re-opened for use NOTICE.

1) This thread is not a place to discuss the subject of homosexuality and femininity with regard to appearance/photography. If you want to raise that as a debate you are free to do so but take it outside this thread;

2) The purpose of an ignore list is to allow a user to ignore someone not to use it as some kind of beat stick to flash in someones face to annoy them whilst speaking to them. Anyone caught abusing the ignore list in such a manner is liable to be disciplined for such behaviour

 

[mmaria]

ok guys

I don't have enough of time today to reply to all of you, but I will reply to all of you when I can.

I came here just to tell a few things that I think can't wait.

First, I think I made a mistake because I didn't clarify some things in my op and it's completely understandable that the way I said those sentence led to some conclusions I didn't want to..

I SAID: "My main concern with shooting men was that I won't be able to produce anything "manly" enough. While I was shooting them, I was thinking "Oh well this isn't that difficult". Guys were just awesome, really. We had a good time together."
I SHOULD SAY: "My main concern with shooting men, before I went to shoot these two guys, was that I won't be able to produce anything "manly" enough. But when I met them, when I saw and felt them, I wasn't worried about that at all, because I decided that I'll just let them be who they are. and while I was shooting them, I was thinking "Oh well this isn't that difficult". Guys were just awesome, really. We had a good time together."

So before the shoot, I didn't know these guys. I saw a few pictures of them on social media, but never met them. I chose them because I was drawn to them for various reasons. Ognjen, the first one, wasn't that much of a surprise to me because I saw him once in a store some time ago, but Srdjan was a huge surprise because pictures I saw of him didn't do him a justice. He's really pretty and have a beautiful energy. They both have great personalities and because I didn't have any scenario in my head I just let them be who they are.

I'm aware of "men's poses" and "feminine poses" "head tilt this way and that way" etc. , I don't know everything but I do know a few things about posing and body language... but when someone acts the way they act and have a distinctive body language, I'm going to capture that because that is who is he/she/who ever. I want my portrait to be as natural and as believable as it can.
And tbh, in the process of looking for male models, I skipped many pretty "manly" male models and choose these two guys. Either I'm not ready for "manly, masculine, manly men" or I'm simply not interested in them... idk... we'll see.


"manly" wasn't suppose to be main theme of my thread. I wanted to know more about how did I do editing wise

 

[mmaria]

@DanOstergren just to tell you a huge thank you!
I've downloaded tiff file and I saw what you've done. It's great! I hope I'll figure out how to edit. What's your settings for the brush when dodging and burning?

I'll give you a detailed response later, because I need to go now... just wanted you to know that I'm really grateful for the thoughts and the edit. I hope I can replicate it.

I was trying to fix bags under his eyes but I couldn't do that entirely because I don't understand how to change their tones or what else..

 

[DanOstergren]

@DanOstergren just to tell you a huge thank you!
I've downloaded tiff file and I saw what you've done. It's great! I hope I'll figure out how to edit. What's your settings for the brush when dodging and burning?

I'll give you a detailed response later, because I need to go now... just wanted you to know that I'm really grateful for the thoughts and the edit. I hope I can replicate it.

I was trying to fix bags under his eyes but I couldn't do that entirely because I don't understand how to change their tones or what else..

To dodge and burn, I create a new layer above a background and background copy layer by clicking "Layer>New Layer" in the menu bar. Before exiting the dialogue box for creating a new layer, I set the layer color to "gray", the layer mode to "soft light", and check the box that says "Fill with soft light neutral color (50% gray). Once I create the layer, I duplicate it a few times and name each gray layer for their different purposes ("skin", "contour", "hair", "eyes", "arms", background", or whatever part of an image I may be selectively dodging or burning).

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These dodge and burn layers should be above your background/background copy layers, and below your adjustment layers and masks. These are the layers I dodge and burn on; because I'm dodging on these separate layers, I'm causing no damage to the actual image layer. Use the dodge tool, usually set to "Midtones" with the exposure usually set between 2% and 10% for cleaning up the skin and softening skin gradients. Use the dodge tool set to the "Highlights" range in order to sculpt the face by making the highlights a little brighter, and use the burn tool set to the "shadows" range in order to carve out facial features a bit. Use the dodge tool set to "highlights" in order to bring out detail in the highlights of the models hair, or their clothing, or their eyes. Just make sure that you are making these changes on separate layers, that way you can selectively control the amount of each different adjustment by adjusting the opacity of the different layers.

If you need to selectively change the color of a certain spot of skin or whatever else, create a Selective Color adjustment layer:

Click on the white square (the layer mask) that is attached to your new adjustment layer. This will show a dialogue box like this:

Click "Invert". This will turn the layer mask's color to black. Next, select the paint brush tool and set the color to white, the opacity of the brush to %15, and make sure that the brush has a feathered edge. Make sure you click on the layer mask on your Color Balance adjustment layer to make sure it's selected, and then paint over the spot on the image that needs correcting, in this case the green area under the model's chin.

After you do this, click the layer thumbnail on the left side of the layer to bring up the dialogue box that controls the effect of the adjustment layer:

This control panel should appear:

Use the sliders to manipulate the color tones. It should just barely be affecting the area that you painted over on the layer mask.

I used the same technique to correct certain areas of his hair:

Before hair color correction:
http://orig15.deviantart.net/bcd5/f..._30_at_6_55_11_am_by_danostergren-da0vgxm.png
After correction:
http://orig06.deviantart.net/6576/f..._30_at_6_55_01_am_by_danostergren-da0vgxu.png

I hope I explained this in a way that you can follow (actually watching someone do this makes it much easier to understand). You can use this same inverted layer mask technique with hue/saturation adjustment layers to selectively saturate and reduce saturation of different areas of the image; this is important to know because dodging and burning can sometimes saturate and desaturate the areas affected, and using two Hue/Saturation adjustment layers (one to increase saturation and one to decrease it) with an inverted layer mask is an easy way to selectively correct this. You can also use the inverted layer mask technique with a curves, exposure or levels adjustment layer in order to selectively manipulate the exposure in the selected areas of the image. It's an incredibly useful technique for retouching, but like any technique it needs to be practiced and refined.

Also, are you sharpening your portraits? If not, I can show you a great technique for that as well.

 

[tirediron]

Dan - that's a great explanation, and shows just how complex a seemingly simple operation such as 'Dodge/Burn' can be when done properly. I think many members of the forum (Read, "Me", I really don't care about anyone else! ) would benefit from some further tutorials on your processing techniques if/when you have the time and inclination to share them.

 

[Didereaux]

I'm confused. re thread locking. Is the term 'androgynous' banned?

 

[runnah]

No man can look manly without a fine crop of face foliage. It's science.

 

[tirediron]

I'm confused. re thread locking. Is the term 'androgynous' banned?

No, but there were some follow-on comments which have been removed.

 

[Derrel]

There's a really common saying about "Learning the rules" and also about ,"Knowing when to break them."

We apparently have a number of people who are simply not aware, not attuned to, some of the basics of the visual communication language that began in painting some five hundred years ago.

If one wants to learn, it's probably worthwhile to study the work of the millions of others who worked before, in the same medium that you are trying to learn. Being self-taught and not being tutored by somebody with decades' of experience is the new, internet-era way it seems. Stating that something "does not exist", or being "unaware" of something that has been around for five hundred years or so is perplexing in this, the so-called information age.

Masculine / Feminine Poses...: Studio and Lighting Technique Forum: Digital Photography Review

Posing and head tilts……the good, the bad and the ugly…

Guide To Posing Eyes and Head

Why do people often tilt their head to pose for pictures? - Quora

 

[Didereaux]

I'm confused. re thread locking. Is the term 'androgynous' banned?

No, but there were some follow-on comments which have been removed.

Ahhhh, okay, thought I had unknowingly infracted again.

 

[pixmedic]

No man can look manly without a fine crop of face foliage. It's science.

Agreed

 

[tirediron]

No man can look manly without a fine crop of face foliage. It's science.

Agreed

Except for those of us who have evolved past the point of requiring such prehistoric devices!

 

[DanOstergren]

Dan - that's a great explanation, and shows just how complex a seemingly simple operation such as 'Dodge/Burn' can be when done properly. I think many members of the forum (Read, "Me", I really don't care about anyone else! ) would benefit from some further tutorials on your processing techniques if/when you have the time and inclination to share them.

The techniques really aren't as complicated as they seem, and become very easy once you incorporate them into your workflow. Just make sure you have a graphic tablet.

I've been thinking a lot about making video tutorials, as well as actions or adjustment layer packs, it's just a matter of making the recording happen and trying to get past my own nerves about sharing more than just a few screenshots publicly. I have insecurities about a lot of my work and the idea of recording my retouching process and sharing it with others is a bit nerve wracking. Sharing the actual photos for some reason is less so. I'm sure soon enough I'll get over it.

 

[tirediron]

The techniques really aren't as complicated as they seem, and become very easy once you incorporate them into your workflow. Just make sure you have a graphic tablet...

True, but it's more about getting the idea. The problem [I find] with Photoshop is that there is so much capability, and so many ways to do things, it can sometimes become overwhelming. It often helps greatly to see how others have arrived at their result.

 

[pgriz]

To paraphrase John... There are many ways through the forest, but it's easier following a path.