exposure & shutter speed

[jclay]

I’ve just inherited a Ricoh 35 ZP, my first analogue camera, and I’m pretty clueless about the exposure & shutter speed settings. Can anyone point me towards a beginner’s guide to selecting the best settings depending on the light conditions?

From what I have found out so far, it seems that I should select the shutter speed to match the film I buy (I’ve been recommended to buy ISO 400, so my shutter speed would be the next one up – 500). And then the exposure setting depends on the amount of light – 16 for a sunny day, going down to 5.6 for overcast/indoors. Does that sound about right??

Like I said, I’m very new to this, so I’d really appreciate any links you can give me, or any other general tips about analogue photography!!! J

 

[Derrel]

Overcast would be around f/5.6 at a shutter speed that's the reciprocal of the film ISO, so f/5.6 at 1/100 second with an ISO 100 film under overcast skies would be about right. But overcast/indoors is a huge misnomer: "indoors" is typically much darker and dimmer than outdoor overcast! Indoors is more likely to be something like 1/8 second at f/2.8 with an ISO 100 film!

Best low-cost solution for a meterless camera? Procure a light metering app for your smart phone, and use the settings it suggests after you light meter the scenes youi want to photograph.

There are not many tips except: support the camera well, focus accurately, and pre-plan as many shots as will allow pre-planning

 

[480sparky39 38]

.............From what I have found out so far, it seems that I should select the shutter speed to match the film I buy (I’ve been recommended to buy ISO 400, so my shutter speed would be the next one up – 500).........

That's only a starting point. If you're shooting ISO 400 and set your shutter speed to 1/500 at f/16, you can then change the shutter speed & aperture to the following possibilities (depending on what you want the final image to look like):

1/1000 @ f/11
1/2000 @ f/8
1/4000 @ f/5.6
1/8000 @ f/4
1/250 @ f/22
1/125 @ f/32

 

[table1349]

http://www.cameramanuals.org/ricoh_pdf/ricoh_35_zf_st.pdf

Digital Photography Tutorials

 

[benhasajeep46 44]

You can probably find a light meter fairly cheep now a days. Though I have not looked for one in years. Reminds me, I should get mine out and make sure I didn't leave batteries in it. Though that camera does have a simple meter. "Electric Eye" in the manual, for adjusting the aperture.

With film and processing getting ever more expensive. You will want to wast as little as possible. Almost like going back to the old glass plate, and sheet film days. You could not just click away, and pick the one you like out of a 100 back then.

 

[KmH]

The lens aperture and shutter speed settings depend on your artistic goals for the photo.
Nine combinations of the triad of exposure settings - ISO (ASA), aperture and shutter speed - will produce the same exposure.
What varies with the 9 settings combos in the motion stopping capability and the depth of field.
Stopping or not stopping motion and depth of field are artistic considerations.
Camera Exposure: Aperture, ISO & Shutter Speed
Understanding Depth of Field in Photography

With film we can alter the ISO response by setting the ASA (ISO) setting on the camera to a value different from the ISO (ASA) rating of the film we are using.
To a degree we can also control the color response by changing the brand/type of film in the camera.

Further color and exposure control is possible during the film developing process and during printing, if prints are made.

 

[jclay]

Ok, I’m starting to get a better understanding of when to use a wide aperture & short exposure, and when to use a narrow aperture & long exposure (thanks to everyone above for all the links and explanations!). But I’m still confused about how this applies to my camera in practical terms.

If I use 400ISO film, my ‘default’ setting on a sunny day would be f16 at 1/500, right? But since those are the narrowest aperture and shortest exposure that my my camera (Ricoh 35ZF) offers, there is nowhere I can go from there… e.g. if I want to widen the aperture for shallow depth of field I can’t shorten the exposure any more. Is that just a limitation of the camera I have, or have I missed something? Does it mean that in practice if I want to go for a shallow depth of field or a long exposure, I’ll only really have that option on cloudier days?

And if so, is that a reason to maybe go for 200ISO film instead, to give me more freedom in terms of depth of field?

 

[john.margetts]

Ok, I’m starting to get a better understanding of when to use a wide aperture & short exposure, and when to use a narrow aperture & long exposure (thanks to everyone above for all the links and explanations!). But I’m still confused about how this applies to my camera in practical terms.

If I use 400ISO film, my ‘default’ setting on a sunny day would be f16 at 1/500, right? But since those are the narrowest aperture and shortest exposure that my my camera (Ricoh 35ZF) offers, there is nowhere I can go from there… e.g. if I want to widen the aperture for shallow depth of field I can’t shorten the exposure any more. Is that just a limitation of the camera I have, or have I missed something? Does it mean that in practice if I want to go for a shallow depth of field or a long exposure, I’ll only really have that option on cloudier days?

And if so, is that a reason to maybe go for 200ISO film instead, to give me more freedom in terms of depth of field?

Simply do not use 400 ISO film. I live in the light deprived north (UK, same latitude as Manitoba) and my standard film in the winter is 200 ISO and in the summer it's 100 ISO

Sent from my 8070 using Tapatalk

 

[TCampbell]

You may be getting confused regarding the "Sunny 16" rule which suggests that a correct exposure would occur in mid-day sun if you set the f-stop to f/16 and you set the shutter speed to the inverse of the ASA or ISO.

That's just a baseline used specifically because f/16 is the only f-stop at which the shutter speed is the simple inverse of the ASA or ISO. Basically the rule (a) works and (b) is very easy to remember. But this is just one way to combine the shutter speed and aperture setting and ASA or ISO to get the correct amount of light. Any combination of of ASA or ISO with aperture and shutter speed that gets the equivalent amount of light will ALSO work.

Suppose you use f/8 instead of f/16. f/8 is actually two stops brighter than f/16. Let's start with f/16 and work from there...

If you were to initial dial in the "Sunny 16" exposure with 400 ASA film then you'd be at f/16, 1/400th.

But there is a shutter speed caveat. You can't necessarily just dial in ANY shutter speed because that setting might not appear on your dial. The order of full shutter speeds starts with 1 full second and then each step up halves the time (at a few points there's a round-off to keep the math easy). So that means the order is: 1/1 (1 full second) then 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/15 (notice the slight adjustment because it's not 1/16), then 1/30, 1/60, then 1/125 (notice another adjustment because it's not 1/120) then 1/250, 1/500, 1/1000, etc.

So while 1/400 isn't on the dial (it is on a digital camera - they typically allow adjustments in 1/3rd stop increments instead of full stops or half-stops)... 1/500 is on the dial and that's the closest to 1/400. It's close-enough that the slightly faster shutter speed (1/4 of a stop) won't have a dramatic effect on your exposure and you can easily compensate for this when making prints.

Now to do this at f/8... you've opened up the aperture by a full 2 stops. Each 1 full stop doubles the amount of light... so if we double, then double again, the area increases enough that we actually collect four times more light. So we'll need to adjust the shutter speed to compensate by allowing the shutter to remain open 1/4th as long. This means instead of using 400 ASA with f/16 and 1/400 (and we had to use 1/500 because 1/400 isn't on the shutter speed dial) you'd use f/8 with 1/1600... and again... take whatever speed is nearest on the mode dial. And this might create a NEW problem... does your camera actually have a shutter speed that fast?

Many old cameras top-out at 1/500th... or maybe 1/1000th. I'm going to guess that your camera can't support 1/2000th and this will force you to use the higher f-stop.

But even if your camera did support the faster shutter speeds... the only f-stop at which the shutter speed is simply the inverse of the ASA is at f/16. Notice in the example above (the f/8 example) that the shutter speed is quadruple the ASA setting. That makes the rule harder to remember. f/16 is selected because it works for most any camera AND because the rule is easy to remember. But this just gets you to the base exposure... you can still trade shutter speed stops for aperture stops... or swap film to a different ASA rating which changes by stops of film sensitivity (although changing film isn't as convenient and most people won't unload a roll until they've shot the entire roll.)



Shutter speeds are doubling or halving the amount of light that can pass through simply by doubling or having the TIME the shutter is open.

Aperture values are doubling or halving the amount of light that can pass through by simply doubling or halving the geometric AREA of the aperture opening (it literally is the mathematical calculation of the area of a circle... remember area = π x r^2



You can think of an analogy such as filling a glass of water at the tap without over-flowing the glass. You can turn on the spigot to a slow trickle and wait a long time for the glass to fill... or you can crank open the spigot to full-blast and it'll get full much faster. Its your choice as long as you find a way to (a) fill the glass and (b) not over-fill it.

 

[qmr55]

You may be getting confused regarding the "Sunny 16" rule which suggests that a correct exposure would occur in mid-day sun if you set the f-stop to f/16 and you set the shutter speed to the inverse of the ASA or ISO.

That's just a baseline used specifically because f/16 is the only f-stop at which the shutter speed is the simple inverse of the ASA or ISO. Basically the rule (a) works and (b) is very easy to remember. But this is just one way to combine the shutter speed and aperture setting and ASA or ISO to get the correct amount of light. Any combination of of ASA or ISO with aperture and shutter speed that gets the equivalent amount of light will ALSO work.

Suppose you use f/8 instead of f/16. f/8 is actually two stops brighter than f/16. Let's start with f/16 and work from there...

If you were to initial dial in the "Sunny 16" exposure with 400 ASA film then you'd be at f/16, 1/400th.

But there is a shutter speed caveat. You can't necessarily just dial in ANY shutter speed because that setting might not appear on your dial. The order of full shutter speeds starts with 1 full second and then each step up halves the time (at a few points there's a round-off to keep the math easy). So that means the order is: 1/1 (1 full second) then 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/15 (notice the slight adjustment because it's not 1/16), then 1/30, 1/60, then 1/125 (notice another adjustment because it's not 1/120) then 1/250, 1/500, 1/1000, etc.

So while 1/400 isn't on the dial (it is on a digital camera - they typically allow adjustments in 1/3rd stop increments instead of full stops or half-stops)... 1/500 is on the dial and that's the closest to 1/400. It's close-enough that the slightly faster shutter speed (1/4 of a stop) won't have a dramatic effect on your exposure and you can easily compensate for this when making prints.

Now to do this at f/8... you've opened up the aperture by a full 2 stops. Each 1 full stop doubles the amount of light... so if we double, then double again, the area increases enough that we actually collect four times more light. So we'll need to adjust the shutter speed to compensate by allowing the shutter to remain open 1/4th as long. This means instead of using 400 ASA with f/16 and 1/400 (and we had to use 1/500 because 1/400 isn't on the shutter speed dial) you'd use f/8 with 1/1600... and again... take whatever speed is nearest on the mode dial. And this might create a NEW problem... does your camera actually have a shutter speed that fast?

Many old cameras top-out at 1/500th... or maybe 1/1000th. I'm going to guess that your camera can't support 1/2000th and this will force you to use the higher f-stop.

But even if your camera did support the faster shutter speeds... the only f-stop at which the shutter speed is simply the inverse of the ASA is at f/16. Notice in the example above (the f/8 example) that the shutter speed is quadruple the ASA setting. That makes the rule harder to remember. f/16 is selected because it works for most any camera AND because the rule is easy to remember. But this just gets you to the base exposure... you can still trade shutter speed stops for aperture stops... or swap film to a different ASA rating which changes by stops of film sensitivity (although changing film isn't as convenient and most people won't unload a roll until they've shot the entire roll.)



Shutter speeds are doubling or halving the amount of light that can pass through simply by doubling or having the TIME the shutter is open.

Aperture values are doubling or halving the amount of light that can pass through by simply doubling or halving the geometric AREA of the aperture opening (it literally is the mathematical calculation of the area of a circle... remember area = π x r^2



You can think of an analogy such as filling a glass of water at the tap without over-flowing the glass. You can turn on the spigot to a slow trickle and wait a long time for the glass to fill... or you can crank open the spigot to full-blast and it'll get full much faster. Its your choice as long as you find a way to (a) fill the glass and (b) not over-fill it.

That was an awesome write up!

 

[480sparky39 38]

That was an awesome write up!

It should be a sticky.

 

[vintagesnaps]

Does the camera have a working meter? I may have missed that, and if not, yeah get a meter. You'll need to use a meter to get a proper exposure.

The ISO is a system of standardized light sensitivity readings - it stands for International Organization for Standardization. I think... and I remember back to ASA (American instead of International) and have/use vintage cameras that only have ASA/DIN (which is the German equivalent and I definitely don't know offhand what those letters stand for!). You match the ISO camera setting on the camera to the 'box speed' (what ISO is given on the film box and cartridge).

I usually use 400 film if I'll be indoors, or outside on a dark cloudy day or late day/low light. You probably need 100 speed outdoors in decent light - that's why you were getting the readings you did, the 'faster' 400 film is more light sensitive, too much for a sunny or even overcast day. The 100 is 'slower speed' and less light sensitive so you should get better readings outdoors than you did and have some leeway to adjust aperture and shutter speed.

The meter should indicate if you're getting the proper amount of light for an exposure. I usually start out at a midrange aperture like f8, and the 'sync' shutter speed (in red on the shutter speed dial) of usually1/125. The sync speed refers to where you'd set it for flash, and I find that to be a good starting point. The shutter speed is a fraction of a second that tells you how long the shutter is open such as 1 1/25th of a second; the faster the shutter moves the less time it's open so lets in less light. It varies how 'slow' a shutter speed someone can use and keep the camera steady; I can do sync speed or faster but getting below that I have to brace myself to avoid movement blur.

I wouldn't worry about having a wider aperture (lens more open) to get a blurry background starting out (which seems to be quite a popular thing on the internet...). Probably better to generally learn how to use the camera and adjust settings for various lighting conditions. Even if the background is blurred you need to take it into consideration when you're choosing a vantage point and a background because you'll still get shapes and colors etc. that can make for a visually busy background.

This may be something to try when you've gotten the hang of using the camera so you can see how varying the settings changes pictures of the same thing. (Or you could find this in an older photo book.) Try 'bracketing' - taking pictures of the same scene/subject varying the settings by a stop each time - set the camera at what the meter indicates is a proper setting, say outdoors it would be f11 and 1/250. Take a picture, then adjust one stop, such as f16, take another picture, then set to f8, take that picture. Write down what you did, see how those three turn out, how does the field of vision change? Probably you'd have to let the lab know to 'not/don't adjust' so you can see the difference. (Even if they do adjust and it looks the same on prints/scans, I think you should be able to see on the negatives.) I bracket shots sometimes shooting B&W to make sure i don't get a negative that's too thin or too dense, or if the needle's fluctuating (maybe sun is in and out or it's breezy and I'm in the shade and leaves are moving causing the light to keep changing).

My first camera was a Ricoh, hope you enjoy using yours.

 

[jclay]

Great explanation!

I understand the sunny-16 as a rule of thumb for base exposure, and the idea of trading shutter speed stops for aperture stops. I guess I’m trying to get a better feel for how I can play around with different effects (e.g. to achieve more/less depth of field, or more/less blurred movement) while maintaining good exposure, since my shutter speed tops out at 1/500 and the lowest aperture is f/16.

But this just gets you to the base exposure... you can still trade shutter speed stops for aperture stops... or swap film to a different ASA rating which changes by stops of film sensitivity (although changing film isn't as convenient and most people won't unload a roll until they've shot the entire roll.)

Since I can’t change the film mid-roll, what about changing the ISO setting on my camera? Should that ISO setting always match the film I'm using, or is that another variable that I can use to balance the exposure of each photo? E.g. If I'm going for a large depth of field and a slow shutter speed, could I balance this out by changing the ISO setting to, say 200, instead of 400 to match the film?

 

[jclay]

Does the camera have a working meter? I may have missed that, and if not, yeah get a meter. You'll need to use a meter to get a proper exposure.

It has an exposure meter, but I'm having a hard time tracking down a battery for it. Whether it will work once I find a battery is another question!
What do you guys think of using light meter apps instead? How reliable are they?

Anyway, since I'm only just starting out, I guess it won't do any harm to have to figure things out for myself for a while, so I can get a better feel for how the theory works in practice.

 

[john.margetts]

But this just gets you to the base exposure... you can still trade shutter speed stops for aperture stops... or swap film to a different ASA rating which changes by stops of film sensitivity (although changing film isn't as convenient and most people won't unload a roll until they've shot the entire roll.)

Since I can’t change the film mid-roll, what about changing the ISO setting on my camera? Should that ISO setting always match the film I'm using, or is that another variable that I can use to balance the exposure of each photo? E.g. If I'm going for a large depth of field and a slow shutter speed, could I balance this out by changing the ISO setting to, say 200, instead of 400 to match the film?

It is not impossible to expose one roll of film at various ISO settings but that involves special development of the film. You need to stick to one ISO setting and, at least to start with, that should be the ISO rating on the film.



Sent from my 8070 using Tapatalk