Is there something wrong with my Canon 70-200?

Derrel · Nov 8, 2010

cfusionpm said:
MrLogic said:

I don't doubt you. The 7D's high ISO performance is not that great, so there's only so much you can do.

Click to expand...

I wouldn't exactly say that. It can't hold a candle to a full frame or 1.3, but I would hardly call it's ISO performance "not that great." Especially considering it out-performs (or at worst, is equal to) other crop sensors that have lower pixel density and larger sensor sizes. It's at the top of its class, even if that entire class sits well below the full frames.

</shameless defense>

Sorry Matty, but the BEST APS-C sensor is found in the Pentax K5, with an overall score of 82. Your beloved Canon 7D scores a pathetic 66. Yes, you read that right! YES, the BEST APS-C sensor is found in a Pentax. A camera that has an almost INCREDIBLE ability to recover from under-exposures as great as 10 f/stops, meaning an ISO 80 image can be shot at ISO 51,500, or ten f/stops,and with the right RAW converter, the image can be rescued.

On something as simple as a full three-stop underexposure, the new Pentax's sensor performance is simply incredible! A nearly-black image can be opened and quickly,and easily brought righty back to life.

I'm sorry Matt, but no, the 7D's sensor is nowhere even CLOSE to being state of the art in an APS-C, high-density sensor...the Pentax K5's score of 82 kicks the 7D's ass... 82 and 66 are world's apart.

The new Pentax sensor, made by Sony by the way, has an in-camera dynamic range that exceeds that of the Nikon D3x, which had been the absolute, total, overall leader in DR. The incredible dynamic range the new Sony 16.8 MP sensor has puts that in the 7D to shame...

I hate to bring facts into a discussion with a Canon fan of such extreme prominence, but seriously, no, I do not mean that the 7D is close to the Nikon D300s performance, as somebody attempted to say--my point was that the 7D's sensor performance is nowhere NEAR the top of the APS-C, high-density category, as cfcontusionPM stated in his post above...it is a nice body, with nice sub-systems, but its overall image quality, especially at higher ISO's, and its color depth, and its dynamic range,and its noise suppression characteristics are now bettered,significantly, by newer cameras.

Wanna SEE some real examples?
PENTAX though, takes the crown with its new K 5 and its sensor...the sensor and the electronics in the new Pentax are simply incredible. http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2010/11/dethrone.html

K5 Low ISO Noise ----- Not! - PentaxForums.com

How to recover a 10 stop underexposed K-5 image. [Page 1]: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

The new Pentax can easily recover from almost-black underexposures!!!! The read electronics on the new Pentax must be simply incredible!!!

JerrfyLube · Nov 8, 2010

Derrel said:
Sorry Matty, but the BEST APS-C sensor is found in the Pentax K5, with an overall score of 82. Your beloved Canon 7D scores a pathetic 66. Yes, you read that right! YES, the BEST APS-C sensor is found in a Pentax. A camera that has an almost INCREDIBLE ability to recover from under-exposures as great as 10 f/stops, meaning an ISO 80 image can be shot at ISO 51,500, or ten f/stops,and with the right RAW converter, the image can be rescued.

On something as simple as a full three-stop underexposure, the new Pentax's sensor performance is simply incredible! A nearly-black image can be opened and quickly,and easily brought righty back to life.

I'm sorry Matt, but no, the 7D's sensor is nowhere even CLOSE to being state of the art in an APS-C, high-density sensor...the Pentax K5's score of 82 kicks the 7D's ass... 82 and 66 are world's apart.

The new Pentax sensor, made by Sony by the way, has an in-camera dynamic range that exceeds that of the Nikon D3x, which had been the absolute, total, overall leader in DR. The incredible dynamic range the new Sony 16.8 MP sensor has puts that in the 7D to shame...

I hate to bring facts into a discussion with a Canon fan of such extreme prominence, but seriously, no, I do not mean that the 7D is close to the Nikon D300s performance, as somebody attempted to say--my point was that the 7D's sensor performance is nowhere NEAR the top of the APS-C, high-density category, as cfcontusionPM stated in his post above...it is a nice body, with nice sub-systems, but its overall image quality, especially at higher ISO's, and its color depth, and its dynamic range,and its noise suppression characteristics are now bettered,significantly, by newer cameras.

Wanna SEE some real examples?
PENTAX though, takes the crown with its new K 5 and its sensor...the sensor and the electronics in the new Pentax are simply incredible. The Online Photographer: DxOmark: Nikon D7000 Fails to Dethrone Pentax K-5

K5 Low ISO Noise ----- Not! - PentaxForums.com

How to recover a 10 stop underexposed K-5 image. [Page 1]: Pentax SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

The new Pentax can easily recover from almost-black underexposures!!!! The read electronics on the new Pentax must be simply incredible!!!

Not touching that cluster with a 10 foot pole...

Im done with this thread....unsubscribed.

Overread · Nov 8, 2010

I find so many of these DSLR scores ultimatly pointless to read. The pace of advance means that the next upper end camera body on the market is always performing better than the previous ones so the boundaries are always changing. A highscoring DSLR from 5 years ago (which is honestly not all that long) is now a lowscoring nothing compared to the new ones.
Lenses are a little better as they at least advance a little slower

That said the new pentax does appear to be pushing some new boundaries with its dynamic range! It will be interested to see how it deals with overexposure and also how Pentax market it - sadly whilst the new tech might be highly impressive unless Pentax really pull their socks up they just won't make a big impression on the market. That said it might at least push Canon and Nikon to use similar tech.

cfusionpm · Nov 8, 2010

Derrel said:
words

Did you wonder why I made my "missing the point" comment in the previous page? Because you still seem to be on a completely different tangent. I didn't think I would have had to spell it out for you, but since you keep assuming I'm some blind Canon fanboy, I guess I have to:

Let's break this down step by step:

- The original poster complained about softness in the image, making the assumption that the fault was with the lens. It's stated to be shot at 190mm, at f/2.8 and ISO 3200 with a 70-200 2.8 IS mkI on a 7D.
- Many people mentioned that the 2.8 IS mkI is relatively soft at the long end; especially at 2.8 (which is true)
- It was also mentioned that ISO 3200 plays a big role in the lack of sharpness (in addition to the poor lighting conditions, distance to subject, and viewing it at 100% on a computer screen)
- It's determined that the camera and conditions are more the limiting factors, rather than the lens.
- I try to illustrate that point by showing that the mkII is not much better in similar conditions.
- Using the common knowledge that the 7D is highly regarded by reviewers as one of the best APS-C cameras available (Well I guess until this Pentax that I'd never heard of was released a month ago...), I then say straight up that you're not going to get much better results without going to a 1.3 or full frame camera.
- The whole point being that the limit on quality is the APS-C sensor more than anything else; something you preach religiously at every opportunity. I guess it's just unbearable that you agree with me on anything, even if it's you're own position!

I suppose the K5 is a great camera. The links you provided didn't show any high ISO tests (odd...) but some quick googling showed me that it looks pretty good! It definitely draws noise a lot more pleasantly than my 7D at 6400. However, that's still more or less irrelevant to this thread, especially considering that the original poster seems already heavily invested into a Canon gear set. So unless you are somehow suggesting that he drop all his Canon gear and switch to Pentax, the K5 comment should have come and gone in a brief asterisk, not a tangential wall of text. Thanks for making these forums interesting, Derrel. :thumbup: