Lightroom vs Bridge/Photoshop Advantages/Disadvantages

[Ysarex]

Which is why if you move the file without using Lr's Library module, Lr no longer knows where the file is.

So moving a step further on this, if LR no longer knows where the file is, does that mean that the parametric processing completed on that image is lost?

Probably not but you do bring up another twist to all of this. If you import raw files into LR and convert to DNG (not recommended) then the parametric processing will be saved in the DNG file and can't get lost. If you keep your raw originals then LR and/or ACR will save a sidecar file with the extension .XMP to store the parametric processing instructions. Both Photoshop and LR know enough to move the .XMP along with the raw file when the user moves the raw file from inside Bridge or LR. So in fact does the Apple OS if I'm not mistaken. Windows unfortunately will leave the .XMP file behind unless you specifically move it along with the raw file.

What you bring up with this question is the proprietary nature of raw files and raw file processing. Once you process a raw file in LR or PS for that matter you can't open that file w/processing in say DXO, or Capture One. Nobody's raw converter is going to read the competitor's parametric processing instruction file. So when you select a raw converter to work with it's a marriage without option for divorce as far as processed images are concerned. This can create uncomfortable situations should a young, attractive new raw converter come along and tempt you. Or a new camera.

Joe

 

[smoke665]

If you keep your raw originals then LR and/or ACR will save a sidecar file with the extension .XMP to store the parametric processing instructions. Both Photoshop and LR know enough to move the .XMP along with the raw file when the user moves the raw file from inside Bridge or LR. So in fact does the Apple OS if I'm not mistaken. Windows unfortunately will leave the .XMP file behind unless you specifically move it along with the raw file.

Thank you Joe, this is something I've been searching for. So there is a sidecar created, but is that done automatically every time you make an adjustment, a manual save, or a preference setting within LR?

Interesting about Windows not moving the sidecar. I ran into a similar situation a couple of years ago with Pentax's utility Silkypix.

So when you select a raw converter to work with it's a marriage without option for divorce as far as processed images are concerned.

What!!!!! Wait!!!!!! Are you telling me that if I process a raw file with Adobe ACR, I can't open and reprocess with another software?? Crap!!! unless you duplicate every Raw file you could be tied to the monthly ransom plan forever.

 

[KmH]

What!!!!! Wait!!!!!! Are you telling me that if I process a raw file with Adobe ACR, I can't open and reprocess with another software?? Crap!!! unless you duplicate every Raw file you could be tied to the monthly ransom plan forever.

No.
But, each Raw converter application uses unique algorithms, so any files you edited in ACR will look somewhat different when first opened in every other non-ACR Raw converter.

 

[Ysarex]

If you keep your raw originals then LR and/or ACR will save a sidecar file with the extension .XMP to store the parametric processing instructions. Both Photoshop and LR know enough to move the .XMP along with the raw file when the user moves the raw file from inside Bridge or LR. So in fact does the Apple OS if I'm not mistaken. Windows unfortunately will leave the .XMP file behind unless you specifically move it along with the raw file.

Thank you Joe, this is something I've been searching for. So there is a sidecar created, but is that done automatically every time you make an adjustment, a manual save, or a preference setting within LR?

Yes. Any new change updates in the sidecar file.

Interesting about Windows not moving the sidecar. I ran into a similar situation a couple of years ago with Pentax's utility Silkypix.

So when you select a raw converter to work with it's a marriage without option for divorce as far as processed images are concerned.

What!!!!! Wait!!!!!! Are you telling me that if I process a raw file with Adobe ACR, I can't open and reprocess with another software?? Crap!!! unless you duplicate every Raw file you could be tied to the monthly ransom plan forever.

If you process a raw file using ACR then only ACR or LR will be able to re-open and further process the file reading the work already saved in the sidecar file. Another raw processor will still be able to open and process that same raw file but any work you did in ACR/LR will not be available to that other raw processor -- you'll start from scratch. That's what I mean by your raw processor choice is a marriage without option for divorce. If you have hours, days, weeks, months of work saved in Adobe you're not going to transfer that processing work to another software application. Your raw files can still be re-processed in another application but you won't want to remove the Adobe app from your system unless you're willing to lose that processing work.

Joe

 

[smoke665]

Your raw files can still be re-processed in another application

Ok, that's what I thought. I can live with that, I was afraid I missed something. I know you're supposed to save a pristine copy of the original raw files, but I don't always do what I'm supposed to in real life.

Now for anyone who wants to chime in, I get the feeling from this thread and others that there are many who use a 3rd party file manager. As I understand it LR gives you the ability to search tags that are within the sidecar, as opposed to searching on the file name. Am I correct so far? And, if you move a file outside LR then it no longer knows where the image is, and depending on what you use to move the file all information (tags and parametric processing) in the sidecar could be lost, So, how does one keep their files from becoming a jumbled mess using a 3rd party file management? Using both LR and a 3rd party simultaneously seems redundant but I don't see anther way.

 

[goooner]

I've only been using LR for about a year now, and I hardly touch PS. I have played around with a few of the NIK collection add ons, but that is it. It took me while to 'figure' out the best way to organize my pictures in LR, but using keywords really helps. The nice thing about LR is that you can search your photos in your collection even without having keywords, by using the meta data that is recorded by the camera.

I have folders with the date '2016', and then create sub folders in this year folder, 'birds balcony', holiday east Germany' etc. I then import my new files into these folders using LR, and give the photos key words. Works well for me.

 

[smoke665]

@goooner I do something similar though broken down further into Pictures>[major categories - IE Family, Travel, etc]>[subcategories-IE Kids, Grand kids, etc.]>[Individual names]>[year & month]>[ three files - Raw, Finished, working]. Currently using Bridge to transfer from card and rename as a batch operation.

Right now, I'm not sure how my current file organization will fit in with LR/Library.

 

[Desert Rose]

I've used capture 1 since I got my first phase 1 camera several years ago and haven't opened lr or ps since.
I have used other software but not adobe offerings I never really cared for them to be honest.

 

[goooner]

Well that should be easy enough. Go to root photo folder (the folder that contains all your sub-folders that contain your photos). And import this folder in a LR catalogue. Your folder tree will appear on the left in the library, just as it appears in your explorer.

 

[photo1x1.com]

If you are still looking for opinions: I have been using lightroom for years, but have just started to replace photoshop more and more using the awesome local adjustments in lightroom.

Regarding the XMP-file: I have to set that in the catalog settings, otherwise the info (all the settings) will only be stored in the catalog. You can do it in catalog settings - metadata - automatically write changes to XMP. Then there is a sidecar file saved with the RAW file as soon as you make your first changes to the image in lightroom. You can then even doubleclick on the RAW-File in finder, explorer or bridge and when photoshop opens ACR, it will miraculously remember the lightroom settings. So this is also a kind of backup for your lightroom catalog.

My main file management system is the good old finder (windows explorer). Every project has a folder called "YYYY-MM-projectName" so on the external harddrive I will qickly find the files, because they are easily sorted by date, and the project name is usually the clients name with additional info like portrait or familyshooting. That makes searching a breeze.

Bridge is just way too buggy for me. It is awfully slow, more often than not can´t even complete a batch rename process for a larger folder full of video files. Then I have to force the mac to close Bridge and restart the program, but then it doesn´t even remember which folder I opened last. So I again have to go to the folder which is really slow. That happens on several of our computers, so it is not just my machine. It may be a mac problem though, who knows.

I do create a new lightroom catalog for every project for two reasons: first when a project is finished, I push it to two external archive drives (one as a backup). Those drives are only connected to the computer, if I need them but are usually stored somewhere else (I think I could use lightroom to move the files, but then I would have several files missing when I unplug the harddrive). Second Lightroom gets slower if you have many, many images in your catalog. Adobe says no, but in fact it does.

I use lightroom for keywording and such. I used to use bridge, but as it was buggy, I stopped doing so. Also I hated that lightroom was asking me whether I want to use the metadata I changed in bridge, or the one that was stored in the lightroom catalog (maybe there is a setting for that, but I couldn´t find it). However, I found lightroom to be even more convenient for keywording, so I skip bridge all together.