Nature Lovers, Sign the Petition

[JacaRanda]

Is there no one but me who thinks Robert Mugabe is somehow involved? The government takes NOTHING? I'm not buying into that.

Wondering what government that does not take something. Pretty much a given. Just guessing

 

[robbins.photo]

A custodial sentence might be the best thing for him now; whilst what he has done is no worse than what other big game and endangered species hunters have done he's gained a lot of public lime-light in a bad way so getting into a nice safe cell might be a good thing for him.

Ok, not that I'm totally opposed to the voice of reason here, but frankly your ruining what could otherwise be a first rate lynching. Just saying.

Personally I hope that the backlash isn't focused on him at all; he's quite honestly small-fry. He's one man doing this and not even one organising; just taking advantage of existing ways into poaching. In my mind the ones in the lime-light should be the poachers themselves who arranged this hunt as they are the ones who were going to arrange the death of that lion and many others - the dentist was just the one who happened to be paying for this particular kill. IT could just as easily have been anyone of a number of other hunters.

Ok, have to agree with you there. Crap. Took me almost an hour to rig this hangman's noose too. Sigh.

Hopefully it gains enough attention in the public eye to do some good; though I'd be sceptical and wonder if the good done will last more than a month or two.000

I'm reminded of what I heard in India where many native people do elephant rides to see the tigers and how when they were away from their working areas for a few days doing another event there was a spike in poaching of tigers that they were unable to prevent and a myriad of new traps/snares and such that had to be removed. People don't really appreciate that its a kind of war-zone of tourist VS poacher. $50,000 is a lot in the USA, its even more in 3rd world countries so for a poacher its the kind of sum worth taking a big risk for. Even in teh west that's a near 2 years semi-decent income and one year very good income in one huge lump sum

Well in Zimbabwe their dollar is so undervalued that 60 grand us is something like 22 Million in their dollar. It's so bad a lot of locals don't even use the local currency.

I think the other thing a lot of people don't appreciate is that Zimbabwe is a war zone in more than one respect - and while I'm sure all the locals probably raised cain when they found out where the lion actually came from I'll be willing to bet that it didn't stop them from eating it first. Sad reality in that part of the world I'm afraid.

So yes, like you I do hope that something good comes out of all of this, but truthfully I'm not holding my breath. Africa is... well it's Africa. It's kind of hard to explain until you've lived there.

 

[AlanKlein]

The dentist is probably arranging to pay a fine (public and under the table) to make this all go away.

 

[floatingby]

Latest I've seen is that the 2 houses and clinic of the dentist are being stalked by activist, and his current whereabouts is unknown. If he didn't regret his action before, I'm sure he does now, he's at the center of a good old fashioned witch hunt.

 

[AlanKlein]

I doesn't make sense that after paying $50,000 for fees and licenses, this dentist would do the hunt illegally. Why? Lions and other big game are hunted in Zimbabwe and many other countries in Africa paying high fees and all done legally. It's more likely that if anything was done wrong, it was the guide who did it. Unfortunately, this dentist is now caught up in a political maelstrom. Zimbabwe for political reasons wants to prosecute to get the heat off of them. The American government should check into this and if it appears he did nothing wrong or just a minor infraction, they should not expedite him. Despite people's opposition to trophy hunting and what happened to this lion, the American government has a responsibility to protect its citizens from wonton prosecution in other countries. Arrangements should be made that at the most a fine be paid. Let the guides deal with Zimbabwe legal system since they appear to be the main culprits.

 

[Designer]

I doesn't make sense that after paying $50,000 for fees and licenses, this dentist would do the hunt illegally. Why? Lions and other big game are hunted in Zimbabwe and many other countries in Africa paying high fees and all done legally.

You answered your own question.

It is legal to hunt lions in Zimbabwe, as long as you pay for a hunting license.

If somebody would take my bet, I would bet that Robert Mugabe got the lion's share of the money.

 

[limr]

I doesn't make sense that after paying $50,000 for fees and licenses, this dentist would do the hunt illegally. Why? Lions and other big game are hunted in Zimbabwe and many other countries in Africa paying high fees and all done legally. It's more likely that if anything was done wrong, it was the guide who did it. Unfortunately, this dentist is now caught up in a political maelstrom. Zimbabwe for political reasons wants to prosecute to get the heat off of them. The American government should check into this and if it appears he did nothing wrong or just a minor infraction, they should not expedite him. Despite people's opposition to trophy hunting and what happened to this lion, the American government has a responsibility to protect its citizens from wonton prosecution in other countries. Arrangements should be made that at the most a fine be paid. Let the guides deal with Zimbabwe legal system since they appear to be the main culprits.

First of all, there were supposedly permits, but the permits were not for killing lions. They had permits for an area that did not have a lion quota. THey were apparently trying to bait a leopard, but then the lion showed up. At that point, a person might think, "I have permits to kill a leopard, but that's a lion, so maybe I shouldn't shoot it." And yet, he shot the lion anyway. Even if Palmer didn't realize the limitation of the permit when he first shot the lion with the bow, and even if he continued to not know over the course of the next 40 hours before they finally killed the lion, he certainly DID know that something was wrong when they found the dead lion with a tracking collar on. Then he at least watched (if didn't actively take part in) the attempt to destroy that collar so they wouldn't get caught. He might have not realized exactly at the moment when the hunt turned into an illegal one, but he had to have known by the end. How could he not? He clearly didn't care enough to do anything about the crime. This doesn't sound like someone with a clean conscience.

And he's also done this before. Walter Palmer Lied to the Feds About a Bear Hunt in 2006 Heavy.com

 

[tirediron]

We can speculate forever on this, but given the locale, it's highly unlikely that we will ever know the true facts of the case, save one: This is a scum-bag; the lowest form of life on the planet, who thinks that killing for the sake of killing is acceptable. All I'm going to say on the subject is: Karma; she's a <female dog>.

 

[robbins.photo]

the American government has a responsibility to protect its citizens from wonton prosecution in other countries.

Well, you apparently have way more faith in them than I do. Sort of reminds me of a quote from a movie:

"We spend 250 billion dollars a year on defense. And here we are. The fate of the planet is in the hands of a bunch of retards I wouldn't trust with a potato gun."

 

[NancyMoranG]

She :"honey, I don't think you should go.."
He : "stop worrying, what's the worst that could happen?"

 

[Overread]

Fashion - Food - Prestige - Medicine - Religious - Construction - Energy supply

We've a huge list of reasons why our society kills animals; sometimes on the small scale and sometimes on an insane scale. I think we must be careful that we do not highlight prestige as something so alien as the rest of our reasons that it becomes a witch-hunt upon it.

What it as issue here isn't trophy hunting in itself alone; what it is is the unlawful killing of an endangered animal which should have been under the protection of those who arranged the hunt.

We cannot forget that urban expansion, farming, conflict, food, etc.... are all additional reasons that animals, even those which are endangered, are killed for. In my view if we want to protect we MUST take a wider view. To niche it to just trophies allows many other groups to get away with things; sometimes on a FAR larger and more damaging scale.

 

[AlanKlein]

So hard to believe that someone would actually protect his guy. Blame the guides? Because of his urge to kill? WOW Alan, you are one strange man.

Look. I'm not a trophy hunter or a hunter at all. I have no interest in shooting Cecil or Bambi. However, you can't prosecute someone for legal actions done because you don't like the sport of hunting. What you're saying is that every hunter who kills for sport should go to jail. That's an extreme position. Change the laws in Zimbabwe if you think it's not right. If he violated the law, then that's what he should be prosecuted for. But if the guides were responsible, you can't send the hunter to jail. If I hire a limo driver, and he speeds, am I responsible? While this case is slightly different because he shot the animal, he appears to have relied on his guides to set up the proper procedures. The guides should suffer the brunt of the penalties. (The guide is currently out on bail of $1000). At maximum the hunter should be secondary and pay a fine.

 

[Designer]

We can wait from now till domesday for the so-called "news" media to do some actual reporting, but my money is still on Robert Mugabe, or his henchmen, and yet the animal lovers will never hear of it.

 

[limr]

But if the guides were responsible, you can't send the hunter to jail. If I hire a limo driver, and he speeds, am I responsible? While this case is slightly different because he shot the animal, he appears to have relied on his guides to set up the proper procedures. The guides should suffer the brunt of the penalties. (The guide is currently out on bail of $1000). At maximum the hunter should be secondary and pay a fine.

No, this case is a lot different.

Even if the hunter thought it was legal (and you can't convince me that he left that country believing he did something totally legal), he still participated in illegal activity. Ignorance of the law is not a defense. Yes, the guides were worse, but this guy is NOT just an innocent bystander. He DID do something wrong and should be held accountable. He wasn't just along for the ride.

 

[limr]

Man who studied Cecil the lion for 9 years talks impact