trying to go professional is harder then i thought...

azillian · Sep 10, 2013

Not only do i need to take incredible photos, i need to be aware of all the legalities to avoid getting sued, i need to make sure i get paid, and try my hardest not to lose my photos to the internet. I have some questions, but first i'll tell you about myself...

I'm 23, born and raised in Hollywood, i worked at my fathers Mercedes Benz repair and auto body shop down the street from my house for the majority of my life until photography became more then just a hobby. In 2012 i decided to get a part time internship at a production company that a friend of mine worked at. While i was there i got to be behind SLR's and learn a lot about the industry, as well as get experience on music video set's and so on. I got to save up and purchase some pretty cool gear while working at my fathers part time and i've been shooting since on my own since.

In the last year since i've had my first SLR, the Mark iii (i'm a go big or go home kind of guy), I've managed to tour Europe twice, work a job at an online boutique shooting models and editing photos, shot two music videos of my own, and i've shot quite a lot of stills, some of women, some of friends, and obviously some of the 13 countries i visited. It's safe to say that my year has been busy.... but i've got some issues.

I had to quit my job at LeJolie.com (the boutique i was working for) to go on my last trip to Europe, so I'm currently unemployed in the photography industry, and back to working part time at my fathers to survive (i'm so blessed to have that to fall back on), and i'm not complaining because i still have time to figure things out and make some money with my photography.

My website is currently just a tumblr blog, and this is where i upload a lot of my work, but i've only recently started doing this.

Am i taking the right approach?

Should I be using watermarks on the photos for my blog?

Can people technically just steal my photos right now?

I'm not very concerned about people stealing them (or should i be?), but if they do does it harm my chances of making money with these photos in the future?

I have pictures of 13 different countries, all hi res and beautiful, how the hell do i get these things seen more and create a bigger following??

What social medias are the most important?

What is the most important thing a profession does to separate them from an amateur?

Does anyone want to manage me as a photographer?? lol

The_Traveler · Sep 10, 2013

You are going to get a fair amount of advice here - some of it may be rather rude - so let me sum it up here.

Art photographers sell their pictures.
Commercial photographers sell their skills.

You don't know enough about an extremely competitive business with a shrinking market.

Ilovemycam · Sep 10, 2013

OP, either you can or you can't when it comes to making $ with your cam. I would tell you to give it your best shot and if you can make a living from your work great. If not, do photos as a love and not as a job. Sounds like you have had some success with your work. So build on it. You can always get a job and do photos as a part time job and see which direction to go in.

The sad truth with photography nowadays is this...everyone with a cell phone and a $50 Walmart ink jet printer is a photog. I've been refused tons of times by people not wanting free photos, free large size prints and free un-watermarked images because they tell me they don't want or need any more photos. And my photography is in 31 museums and rare book libraries around the world. So, even high grade, high powered photos get refused. I've even offered to make books of people for free and get refused.

With museums, I may get refused 94% of the time. even with offers of $8,000 to $10,000 of prints and hand printed artist's books...all offered for free. And my photography is excellent museum quality work. But that is the world of the photographer in 2013. In the 1970's before things got polluted with photos it was no problem getting accepted to museums. Nowadays it is a job just trying to uncover the hiding curator of photography that does not want any more solicitations.

So if you can make $ for your work...good for you! For 44 years I've always done it for love of freezing time and not for love of $. To do it as a job would ruin it for me. I will shoot something for free if I like it, but I wont shoot something for $ if I don't like it. Some days I am up at 6.30 working on my photos to ship to a museum or on a my latest book and still working on it at 1.30AM. Who the hell would want to do that for $...but I wil do it for free if I love doing something.

Good luck!

Overread · Sep 10, 2013

Thoughts:

1) If its on the net it can be stolen - you can right click protect, use flash/java and all other kinds of little tricks, but anyone who wants to steal can do so very easily and with minimal effort; the protections only serve to dissuade the casual user (who is most likely to use it as a background on their computer more than anything else).

2) Any watermark that doesn't smother the whole photo and obscure all the detail and display is easily removed with editing (and heck some people who steal won't even care if its on there or not). As a result the watermark is NOT a protective measure. What it is is advertising. If your image spreads around the net and your watermark is clear and not obtrusive then its spreading your name around.

3) Tumblr has blogging by friends - so people blog what they see on your blog and what their friends blog so it can very quickly end up that people are not looking at your stuff but just your stuff in the context of what their watches like on there. As a result your watermark is key to advertising and spreading your name there (as explained in point 2).

4) If you want to be "managed as a photographer" you want to hit hte local job listings and find yourself a job as an intern/assistant/second shooter with an established pro/company.

5) If you want a website to generate some income there are websites that are setup which will provide you with a gallery, store page and payment processing features as well as printing and shipping. They'll do all the legwork; but you've in turn got to do lots in advertising yourself if you want to have any sales (simply putting up a website is NOT enough in today's market). I'd drop the name of the popular one but the name of it utterly escapes me at present

runnah · Sep 10, 2013

In my profession which isn't photography, 90% of the time isn't spent on my craft. Time is spent on marketing, invoicing, taxes, maintenance etc...

I can't speak to photography but I imagine its the same.

imagemaker46 · Sep 10, 2013

It's such a competitive business to stay in, and harder to make a full time living at. The market is saturated with the camera owners that feel they are good enough to make a go of it, and as you found out, it's not easy. You sound like you've had some great opportunities, and unfortunately they don't always lead anywhere.

I'd keep working for your Dad and shooting as much as you can on the side, who knows maybe a door will open for you, but don't quit the day job.

sm4him · Sep 10, 2013

"Going Pro" is actually pretty easy: Get good gear, a business license and insurance; make yourself a FB page or advertise on Craigslist and, voilà! You're a Pro.

Being profitable, THAT's the tricky part.

Many of your questions relate to the marketing aspect of business. Sounds like it's time for you to start doing some research on running a small business. The Small Business Administration is a good place to start.

CCericola · Sep 10, 2013

People still make music videos???

Anyway. I've noticed the key to actually making money is to specialize. Decide what you want to photograph and go whole hog. Doing a little bit of this and a little bit of that makes you a Jack of all trades but a master of none. People that are paying mucho dinero for a photo of Paris don't want to buy it from the same guy that shoots boring catalogs. Decide what you want, go all in and build a reputation.

Luke345678 · Sep 10, 2013

I'm no pro but if you don't think you're quite ready then don't rush into it.

You don't want to stress yourself out too much while trying to become a professional. It might make you dislike photography even.

12sndsgood · Sep 10, 2013

since I opened my doors around 14 months ago I find I now spend 80% of my time learning business, marketing, social media, advertising. being a good photographer is only a small part of running a business, I'd say it's time to start learning the aspect of owning a company that seem to mater most.

runnah · Sep 10, 2013

12sndsgood said:
since I opened my doors around 14 months ago I find I now spend 80% of my time learning business, marketing, social media, advertising. being a good photographer is only a small part of running a business, I'd say it's time to start learning the aspect of owning a company that seem to mater most.

This.

Ever wonder why companies have people dedicated to things like marketing, accounting and contracts? Because that **** is hard and takes a lot of time.

Designer · Sep 10, 2013

azillian said:
Am i taking the right approach?

Apparently not.

azillian said:
Should I be using watermarks on the photos for my blog?

Only if it is a very nice watermark. IMO, most watermarks are not, and therefore detract from the image.

azillian said:
Can people technically just steal my photos right now?

Yes, if they're on the internet.

azillian said:
What is the most important thing a profession does to separate them from an amateur?

I would say a business-like attitude.

gsgary · Sep 10, 2013

If i was you i would learn everything i could about your dads business ready to take over the reins when he retires and just enjoy photography as a hobby

KmH · Sep 10, 2013

As far as a business-like attitude, to your credit you use appropriate punctuation and spelling.

But note that so far, just yours and 2 other post in the thread don't have all the appropriate capital letters. (I, instead of i. Mark III, instead of Mark iii)

A key to starting and maintaining a successful self-employed business is having a written business and marketing plan.

If you fail to plan, plan to fail.

Starting & Managing a Business | SBA.gov
Free Small Business Advice | How-to Resources | Tools | Templates | SCORE

As far as image theft, it is rampant on the Internet.

So, another part of your business plan research would include investigating and formalizing what you can do to provide as much copyright protection as possible:
Five Things You Can Do to Protect Your Online Images | Photo Attorney
Registering Your Copyrights Using the eCO System | NatureScapes.Net - The Resource for Nature Photographers
https://nppa.org/page/5617
Embedded Metadata Initiative
Help! I've Been Infringed! | Photo Attorney
U.S. Copyright Office - Copyright Law of the United States

Landscape and cityscape images sell best locally to the scene that is the image.
Something like 85% of all the photographs that sell have people in them, and most of those are bought by the people in the photos.

Many of the well known landscape and cityscape photographers make their living by selling landscape and cityscape photography seminars, instead of by selling prints.

pgriz · Sep 10, 2013

Any business is based on certain principles:
1) Find a need with enough demand (ie, clients willing to pay money)
2) Specialize to reduce the number of potential competitors.
3) Price your product/service to cover your production costs + overhead costs + risk margin + growth capital + profit margin.
4) Remember that overhead costs include: costs of operating a company, investment in equipment, training, and marketing, your salary, cost of borrowed money, and all the services you need to buy if you're not doing it all yourself.
5) Management of key resources (contacts, time, money, your health).
6) Minimization of risk (legal, physical, contractual).

Any business is a tool to make money. The trick is, you get to build the tool. The basic blueprints for doing that can be found in the list that Keith listed. Just as in photography, it's harder than it looks.