APS-C vs FF, but different than the usual questions.

lonewolfsx · Apr 4, 2012

Hey everyone, I've been fighting with myself a little bit recently, so I figured I'd ask here for some insightful advice. Anyway, I have some money saved up, and can sell some stuff once I commit to a new camera system (but I need the stuff for the time being). I'm going to go Nikon for sure as I have some friends who are there and to be honest, I'm out of the loop on trading and borrowing lenses. I used to shoot some wide-angle stuff, and still might in the future but this is usually travel related and mostly for myself and fun. Recently however, I've been shooting a lot more models/people/portraits and that's where my concentration and my pixel-perfectionist tendencies lie.

Normally people say the lens is much more important than the body (obviously, since quality lenses last a long time and bodies go in and out ever few years).
Anyway my question is... should I go for a high-end APS-C body (possibly the D7000, or more likely wait a bit and go for the "D400") and a pro-level lens like the Nikkor 24-70mm f/2.8?
Or should I go for something like the D800 (probably don't need 36 megapixels but hey, you only take each picture once so why not), and a good (but not "pro") lens such as the 50mm f/1.8 or f/1.4? (I've looked at the available FF zoom lenses and I have some reservations regarding border quality with those. The only lens that looked pretty good in this price range was a used Sigma 24-70 f/2.8 Macro [non-hsm])

Some background; I already own a 105mm f/2.8 micro, which is also a perfectly good portrait lens, probably even better on FF. I don't mind having a setup like the 50mm/105mm combo as I don't mind changing lenses a few times, and according to my lightroom data plot my most used focal lengths (corrected from crop to ff) is 50mm, 85mm (I'd use the 105 here), ~200mm or so from when I did football games (no longer relevant), and then the 20-28mm range. I know I'd lose the wide angle with the full frame camera budget but I'd consider something like the Sigma 12-24mm later. Plus if I went crop and the 24-70 I'd lose the wide angle as well so obviously the UWA area isn't super important to me right now.

So in short I'm asking... is the full frame advantage relatively better than high-end glass on a crop body?

additional note: I wonder how much that new tamron 24-70mm f/2.8 will cost/perform?

Derrel · Apr 4, 2012

The D400, or whatever it is named--MIGHT be a simply fantastic camera. The D300s is due for replacement. Thom Hogan thinks there's a chance the "D400" will be a full-frame body. I do too...the D800's price of $2999 is too high for most amateurs, and so, an economical entry to FF (FX in Nikon-speak) would be a great item in the lineup.

I cannot see through the D7000's viewfinder nearly as well as that in the D800. I vastly prefer FX to DX for almost every use. I would much rather shoot the D800 than the D7000, just for the better viewfinder AND the much larger image, with higher MP count. The D800 in APS-C crop mode is like a 16.2 megapixel camera...so it's like two cameras in one.

lonewolfsx · Apr 4, 2012

I don't think the D400 will be full frame, since the D700 came out at $2999 and left the huge price gap down to the D300. I'd expect the "D400" to be crop and APS-C flagship at around $1700-1800 like the D300 before it. Still, a full frame "budget" minded entry would be pretty sweet, I'd love to see that 16mp sensor from the D4 in something more affordable.

I definitely think using the full frame camera will be better (in terms of viewfinder, weatherproofing, physical controls for some things.. though I'm a little disappointed that they removed the switch on the back for the different AF modes, and they removed the AF-S/AF-C/MF switch so it's just AF/M now. too bad.). The D800 also is kind of like three cameras in one really, FF, 1.2x (close to the APS-H crop), and 1.5x (APS-C DX crop).

I'm kind of leaning towards the D800 and primes combo, I know the image quality will be fantastic even if I have to do a bit more walking around and such... we'll see.

Derrel · Apr 4, 2012

YES, I am VERY disappointed in the removal of the AF-area assignment switch...I guess they needed to dumb the AF system down somewhat. ANd the autofocus mode switch...another dumbing down...I agree with you on both of those outside controls--the new system controls are nowhere near as good as the older ones.

IgsEMT · Apr 4, 2012

D7000 is a great camera, no doubt about it, but if looking in the crop-frame, d300s is still a GREAT body. At least is my experiments and convos w/ others (when all else is the same - lighting, lens) d300s outdone 7000 (tested in prints).
Next is Fx/Dx - again its a about a flavor. I jumped on Fx train b/c needed higher ISO capabilities. Love my 700 but at the same time I wouldn't get rid of d300s, d90 d200 or d70. Other then useful backups and some sentimental value, they can still perform w/ in the their scope of limitations and provide me with adequate results.

lonewolfsx · Apr 4, 2012

IgsEMT said:
but at the same time I wouldn't get rid of d300s, d90 d200 or d70. Other then useful backups and some sentimental value, they can still perform.

haha yeah, maybe it's because my other hobby is guitars (and relic/vintage equipment), but I'll probably never sell my N6006 or Rebel Xti, even if just to keep them to look at. My N6006 looks almost new, but my rebel is totally beat and scuffed up, been through way more than any entry-level body should ever go through and still work, same with my Minolta 450si.

Also I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed the removal of the AF-C and AF-mode cycle switches. Especially since I'd expect to be flipping between 51-pt and the single center point decently often.

Also I didn't totally think of this, but I could probably go for the D700 body now that it is so reasonably priced, and a few decent lenses or flashes. Hmm... I want video but to be honest, probably wouldn't use it that much. I'll have to re-add the D700 to my list

To be honest though, nobody has really answered my question. Do the advantages of going full frame outweigh having "pro" lenses but a crop sensor camera?