Freelance Jobs for Minors = Illegal?

Rob · Feb 14, 2005

Much of the advice above has been said from the point of view of an adult.

Personally, I am going to disagree with mostly everyone and say that you should make peace with your school, progress your education in the normal manner and perfect your photography and artistic skills as an amateur. Any other advice is quite clearly irresponsible.

The school are not bluffing, institutions don't like wild-cards, maverics, or whatever name you wish to use. You are in a legally ambiguous status for working. Do not throw away your hard academic work so far just to make a point about a part-time hobby income.

If your parents support you and can attest to your ability and potential, then they will be best placed to advise you and to give you assistance. If not, you should wait until you are an academic adult.

Continue your schooling, and at 18 (or whenever your school finishes), consider doing a degree in photography. If it means so much to you, the odd $30 here and there is irrelevant. If you have the talent now, how much better will you be when you have a degree-level qualification and proper tuition?

This advice may not apply to you personally, but I didn't know what I wanted at 16/17/18, and any adult who advises you a course of action which limits or places at risk your academic career is a fool.

Rob

Artemis · Feb 14, 2005

robhesketh said:
Much of the advice above has been said from the point of view of an adult.

Personally, I am going to disagree with mostly everyone and say that you should make peace with your school, progress your education in the normal manner and perfect your photography and artistic skills as an amateur. Any other advice is quite clearly irresponsible.

The school are not bluffing, institutions don't like wild-cards, maverics, or whatever name you wish to use. You are in a legally ambiguous status for working. Do not throw away your hard academic work so far just to make a point about a part-time hobby income.

If your parents support you and can attest to your ability and potential, then they will be best placed to advise you and to give you assistance. If not, you should wait until you are an academic adult.

Continue your schooling, and at 18 (or whenever your school finishes), consider doing a degree in photography. If it means so much to you, the odd $30 here and there is irrelevant. If you have the talent now, how much better will you be when you have a degree-level qualification and proper tuition?

This advice may not apply to you personally, but I didn't know what I wanted at 16/17/18, and any adult who advises you a course of action which limits or places at risk your academic career is a fool.

Rob

I must say this is an incredibly good way at looking at it..and after reading It I think my prior advice was wrong, and I agree

Rob · Feb 14, 2005

Artemis said:
I must say this is an incredibly good way at looking at it..and after reading It I think my prior advice was wrong, and I agree

Thanks Artemis, having re-read what I wrote, it could appear a bit harsh, so I'm glad that someone has agreed with me without taking offence. It's so difficult to effectively communicate when you're not f-t-f!

R

Jeff Canes · Feb 14, 2005

Youre just looking at a few months before you turn 18?
Them Robheskeths subjection maybe the best.
But if this is going to cost you a lot of dollars for collage.
You may want to setup a real company

Shutterbug · Feb 14, 2005

robhesketh said:
Much of the advice above has been said from the point of view of an adult.

Personally, I am going to disagree with mostly everyone and say that you should make peace with your school, progress your education in the normal manner and perfect your photography and artistic skills as an amateur. Any other advice is quite clearly irresponsible.

The school are not bluffing, institutions don't like wild-cards, maverics, or whatever name you wish to use. You are in a legally ambiguous status for working. Do not throw away your hard academic work so far just to make a point about a part-time hobby income.

If your parents support you and can attest to your ability and potential, then they will be best placed to advise you and to give you assistance. If not, you should wait until you are an academic adult.

Continue your schooling, and at 18 (or whenever your school finishes), consider doing a degree in photography. If it means so much to you, the odd $30 here and there is irrelevant. If you have the talent now, how much better will you be when you have a degree-level qualification and proper tuition?

This advice may not apply to you personally, but I didn't know what I wanted at 16/17/18, and any adult who advises you a course of action which limits or places at risk your academic career is a fool.

Rob

First off, I make more than 30 bucks here and there. I get at least 5 jobs a month, and I average about 305$ a job. That's more than 1,200$ a month, if I don't have some un-coverable bills I have to pay.

Secondly, I really want to go to Brooks in Santa Barbara, and they charge 6,200$ a TERM. I really need to make whatever money I can so I can cut down my student loans. I don't want to be paying a bank back until I'm 30.

I just don't see how it's fair to make me stop doing something which isn't harmful to my education (Quite the contrary, given what the money is going to be used for), just because of a piece of paper.

And I got a question for you!!!! How did you get this far at 17? Im 16 and im trying to get at the stage your at...any help would be REALLY appreciated, as...gathering from this especially, its not easy to get this far at our age...and ive only really done minor free work.... Please help me!

I think I've explained this to you before

Simply put: Get your card, book, and butt out there and get whoever you can to look at your book. Do some free promo tiny-jobs if you have to if it'll help you get a foundation for a resume, and once you have those things, go through the yellow pages and put together a list of every phone number and company that could have anything to do with the type of photography you're interested in.

For me, that was every Small Business, Winery, Ad Agency, PR Office, Cosmetic Store, and Performing Arts studio within 50 miles. Then you just call every. single. one of them. Be as polite as you can, and most of all, if they say no, don't take it personally.

If you get a job, just do it well. The best way to get more jobs is to do your current one well and get a great review. Even if it's shooting something you really don't like, do it absolutly fantastic.

Your age is a good thing - It brings an element to the table that other photograhers don't have anymore. If your work is comparable to theirs, plus your age, you'll get offers pretty regularly. (You can even go as far as I did when I was 16 and call yourself "Boy Photographer", even though it's really lame.

)

Digital Matt · Feb 14, 2005

I really have to agree with you Shutterbug. I think it sounds like BS to me. I started playing music professionally in HS, when I was 14. Playing gigs several nights a week, often times staying out till 2am or later. My parents supported me fully, and drove me to gigs until I was 16 and could drive myself. I had been playing drums since age 3 and it was clear that I was destined to be a musician. My band director at school let me out of band commitments to play gigs, and he was very supportive.

I'm sorry, but they have no right to interfere with your life outside of school. If it was affecting your grades, that would be one thing, but even then, if you fail, you fail, and it takes care of itself. If you want to go on to study photography in college, there's no reason you shouldn't be taking as many gigs in photography and learning as much as you can.

That's my 2 cents. This country needs to support it's youth a little more and recognize talent at a young age, and nuture it. If I could have gone to a specialized high school and studied music, I would have. Kids are supposed to sit through second rate education in this country which stifles their creativity and teaches them to hate the educational system in general. I'm not talking about every school in the US obviously, but generalizing. My school was terrible, and turned me off to the educational process.

Artemis · Feb 14, 2005

Shutterbug said:
First off, I make more than 30 bucks here and there. I get at least 5 jobs a month, and I average about 305$ a job. That's more than 1,200$ a month, if I don't have some un-coverable bills I have to pay.

Secondly, I really want to go to Brooks in Santa Barbara, and they charge 6,200$ a TERM. I really need to make whatever money I can so I can cut down my student loans. I don't want to be paying a bank back until I'm 30.

I just don't see how it's fair to make me stop doing something which isn't harmful to my education (Quite the contrary, given what the money is going to be used for), just because of a piece of paper.

I think I've explained this to you before

Simply put: Get your card, book, and butt out there and get whoever you can to look at your book. Do some free promo tiny-jobs if you have to if it'll help you get a foundation for a resume, and once you have those things, go through the yellow pages and put together a list of every phone number and company that could have anything to do with the type of photography you're interested in.

For me, that was every Small Business, Winery, Ad Agency, PR Office, Cosmetic Store, and Performing Arts studio within 50 miles. Then you just call every. single. one of them. Be as polite as you can, and most of all, if they say no, don't take it personally.

If you get a job, just do it well. The best way to get more jobs is to do your current one well and get a great review. Even if it's shooting something you really don't like, do it absolutly fantastic.

Your age is a good thing - It brings an element to the table that other photograhers don't have anymore. If your work is comparable to theirs, plus your age, you'll get offers pretty regularly. (You can even go as far as I did when I was 16 and call yourself "Boy Photographer", even though it's really lame. )

Your an inspiration to me!

So...all the companies..I guess it sounds a brilliantly good idea...but wont I get a bad name for pestering people? and how do you keep going after the 95th no?

Artemis · Feb 14, 2005

By the way...do you have MSN or something...just curious...

Shutterbug · Feb 14, 2005

So...all the companies..I guess it sounds a brilliantly good idea...but wont I get a bad name for pestering people? and how do you keep going after the 95th no?

People have been doing random cold calls since Photography became a widely used form of Advertising.

Also, just don't take any rejections personally. Not every company needs a photographer, for whatever reason. Make a note that they said no and try them again in... lets say 6 months.

Here's a tip - When you call, don't say "I want a job". In fact, don't even HINT that you want employment. Just ask to speak with their PR person, and see if you can get an appointment to have him look at your portfolio. That is when you discuss jobs - He wouldn't agree to see your book if he didn't need a photographer

I find the business part to be the easier part (Although tedious). You'd be suprised how hard it can be delivering a shot on schedule when just one minor thing goes wrong.

rob1116 · Feb 14, 2005

The concept of a permit to work is completely foreign to me, (Canadian) other than requiring a Social Insurance Number, (collecting taxes, etc.), which I got when I had my first proper job at 13 or 14.

Truth be told, I think your situation shows incredible independant learning and obvious ambition. If anything, a story like this might land you a small scholarship, or at least be seen positively by admission authorities at a University around here.

Not sure about the system there, but in Canada, it's DEAD easy to setup an official, legal business for such sources of income. Sure you'd have to pay taxes, (on the stuff you claim, minus all the expense deductions you can legally make) but being a student you will get most, sometimes all of it back.

My brother worked damn near full time for the last two years of highschool and during the summers, and managed to save just over $20000 and still pulled mid-90s every term.

I don't know... I can't see how they can push this if your marks are in order.

Shutterbug · Feb 15, 2005

@Rob -

I already do pay taxes (Given I make more than 350$ a year), and all the financial jargon is straight too. Going over everything, I can't seem to find a single good reason why I shouldn't continue with my work, so I figure that I'll ask all my teachers, and if they will all sign something saying they'll support me, I'll just go ahead with it. School is there to give me an education (Even though it's second rate and most of it is total garbage) and as long as I'm meeting (and exceeding) their standards I should get to do whatever I want. After all, it's my free time

Thanks everyone.

Rob · Feb 15, 2005

It sounds like you know what you want, and where you're going! Good luck with everything and remember us when you're the next Lichfield or Bailey.

Rob

fadingaway1986 · Feb 15, 2005

Wow... 17 and a half? We can work here at 14 & 9 months. (and I was illegally working before that)

I honestly don't think the school can do much... Get your parents to write a nasty note. Make the school afraid of your parents... My mum always stood up for us when the teachers sent notes home... (Mum once wrote on a note telling her that I got a detention that the note was a waste of paper... and sent it back)

Yep... Schools were too afraid to mess with us...

We didn't threaten them - my mum just let them know who was in charge of her kids.

ahelg · Feb 15, 2005

In norway there are three age limits. When your 13 you can do door to door delivery, when your 16 you work longer hours and doing things like shelv staking, when your 18 you can legally to any job that comes to you.

rob1116 · Feb 15, 2005

Shutter: You obviously have a good head on your shoulders. Maybe I'm too optimistic, but in my limited experience, it is very difficult to get into legal trouble if you simply use good judgment and do what you know to be right.