Homeless Tony

[Black_Square]

Yeah, I left a layer switched on that was mucking up the eyes. I've since switched it off! I think the face is appropriately lit, for my tastes anyway ;-)

still looks like two circles around the eye sockets that the exposure was pumped up.

I'm not seeing that. Thanks.

 

[Dean_Gretsch]

The expressions you get from your subjects are always what grab my attention and make me really study the photo. Great photo.

 

[The_Traveler]

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

 

[Black_Square]

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

As I explained, given that Tony is homeless I'm not really sure what he would do with prints. No, I didn't pay him as the photo is not for commercial purposes.

 

[The_Traveler]

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

As I explained, given that Tony is homeless I'm not really sure what he would do with prints. No, I didn't pay him as the photo is not for commercial purposes.

If I were to ask someone to pose for me because they had a special look, I would automatically believe that there should be an exchange - their look for my money (or something of value.)
IMO, taking Tony's picture because he had a great look and not paying in some way is exploitative, whether or not he is aware of it.

for Stop Taking Pictures of Homeless People

Street photography is a tricky balance between being an artist and being a creep, and it's something that even the best shooters in the world struggle with. It's no secret that a lot of the time you'll get a better photo of an unusual or amazing thing if the subject is unaware. But homelessness isn't unusual or amazing. It's not a surreal moment in time that you can capture and use to illustrate that the world is a brain-splittingly cruel place. A dog in a backpack is odd, and a person living on the street is a reality for millions of people.

To be fair, the people who send in photo essays that casually feature these shots probably aren't trying to be assholes. At least I hope they're not. I assume they either think they're being edgy or poetic. But it's not at all edgy—it's lazy. You're not creating some sort of outsider art by taking a picture of someone less fortunate than you. You're at best a passive observer and at worst a predator. It's a way to shortcut your own experience by hijacking someone else's. A picture of a homeless person says one thing: "I am an asshole."​

You are using the subject's history and lived experience as reflected in his face for your own purposes.
IMO, this is homeless porn, whether it is a good picture or not.

 

[jpross123]

Im glad there are still people out there who are happy with what they have. Even if it is hardly anything. Great powerful image!

 

[pixmedic]

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

As I explained, given that Tony is homeless I'm not really sure what he would do with prints. No, I didn't pay him as the photo is not for commercial purposes.

If I were to ask someone to pose for me because they had a special look, I would automatically believe that there should be an exchange - their look for my money (or something of value.)
IMO, taking Tony's picture because he had a great look and not paying in some way is exploitative, whether or not he is aware of it.

for Stop Taking Pictures of Homeless People

Street photography is a tricky balance between being an artist and being a creep, and it's something that even the best shooters in the world struggle with. It's no secret that a lot of the time you'll get a better photo of an unusual or amazing thing if the subject is unaware. But homelessness isn't unusual or amazing. It's not a surreal moment in time that you can capture and use to illustrate that the world is a brain-splittingly cruel place. A dog in a backpack is odd, and a person living on the street is a reality for millions of people.

To be fair, the people who send in photo essays that casually feature these shots probably aren't trying to be assholes. At least I hope they're not. I assume they either think they're being edgy or poetic. But it's not at all edgy—it's lazy. You're not creating some sort of outsider art by taking a picture of someone less fortunate than you. You're at best a passive observer and at worst a predator. It's a way to shortcut your own experience by hijacking someone else's. A picture of a homeless person says one thing: "I am an asshole."​

You are using the subject's history and lived experience as reflected in his face for your own purposes.
IMO, this is homeless porn, whether it is a good picture or not.

so....
you stop and compensate all of the people you photograph in other countries?
seems you photograph them "because they had a special look", not unlike this photo.
you use the subjects history and lived experience in all of those pictures you post from the monks to the beggar kids without compensation, but your going to get on the OP here for taking a picture of a homeless guy that he already stated he compensated?
your link pretty much describes 80% of your own posts Lew.

 

[Black_Square]

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

As I explained, given that Tony is homeless I'm not really sure what he would do with prints. No, I didn't pay him as the photo is not for commercial purposes.

If I were to ask someone to pose for me because they had a special look, I would automatically believe that there should be an exchange - their look for my money (or something of value.)
IMO, taking Tony's picture because he had a great look and not paying in some way is exploitative, whether or not he is aware of it.

for Stop Taking Pictures of Homeless People

Street photography is a tricky balance between being an artist and being a creep, and it's something that even the best shooters in the world struggle with. It's no secret that a lot of the time you'll get a better photo of an unusual or amazing thing if the subject is unaware. But homelessness isn't unusual or amazing. It's not a surreal moment in time that you can capture and use to illustrate that the world is a brain-splittingly cruel place. A dog in a backpack is odd, and a person living on the street is a reality for millions of people.

To be fair, the people who send in photo essays that casually feature these shots probably aren't trying to be assholes. At least I hope they're not. I assume they either think they're being edgy or poetic. But it's not at all edgy—it's lazy. You're not creating some sort of outsider art by taking a picture of someone less fortunate than you. You're at best a passive observer and at worst a predator. It's a way to shortcut your own experience by hijacking someone else's. A picture of a homeless person says one thing: "I am an asshole."​

You are using the subject's history and lived experience as reflected in his face for your own purposes.
IMO, this is homeless porn, whether it is a good picture or not.

I find your comment rude and ill informed. The quotation you use relates to situations where the subject is unaware of the fact that they are being photographed, probably because the photographer is using a long lens. This shot was taken with an 85mm - no hiding at a disance. Instead I take time to engage with these people and build their trust, whereas the majority of passers by just ignore them.

As I said in my first response, I gave Tony a sandwich and a coffee, but you probably missed that due to your lofty position on that ivory tower. You should also be aware that my intention with these photographs is to hold an exhibition in conjunction with a local homeless charity to raise awareness of the issue of homelessness - all not for profit.

And you suggest I'm an asshole. I'll leave others to form their own opinion as to who that title belongs to.

 

[The_Traveler]

I didn't suggest you were anything. I said that I thought that this kind of photography was exploitative.
People have opinions and calling them rude because they express them is just trying to diminish the opinion without a response.

I will reply to Pixmedic when he makes it clear that he is answering as a person rather than a moderator.

 

[Black_Square]

I didn't suggest you were anything. I said that I thought that this kind of photography was exploitative.
People have opinions and calling them rude because they express them is just trying to diminish the opinion without a response.

I will reply to Pixmedic when he makes it clear that he is answering as a person rather than a moderator.

You came to the wrong conclusion that I had not compensated Tony for the photo, despite me stating earlier that I bought him a sandwich and a coffee (which I do everytime I see him). Because you wrongly thought I hadn't compensated him, you suggested that I was being 'exploitative'. You then continued to miss the point, by posting a quotation that is critical of photographers who take photos of homeless people when they are unaware, which is clearly something I did not do. This quotation then continues by stating that such photographers 'are at best a passive observer and at worst a predator' - by referencing this, you are suggesting that these characterisations apply to me, which is plain wrong and something that I take offence at.

Whilst you're entitled to your opinion, the way you have arrived at it is completely wrong. A bigger man would acknowledge that, but clearly not you. At least I can take comfort from the fact that anybody else reading this thread will see, that at best you're an idiot and at worst just rude.

I shall not dignify you with any further response on this matter, unless of course you apologise.

 

[The_Traveler]

I hadn't, until a few minutes ago, read the small line buried in a long reply where you said you had given him sandwich and coffee but only read the single response

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

Was this a TFP (time for prints) or did you pay him?

As I explained, given that Tony is homeless I'm not really sure what he would do with prints. No, I didn't pay him as the photo is not for commercial purposes.

and was about to say something but found you chose to call me names and expect me to apologize for having an opinion that differs radically from yours.

Not going to happen now.

 

[Overread]

And that's enough - take it to private messages if either of you wishes to continue this discussion further.

Lew - TPF does not have any ban nor restriction on street photography of any individuals. I would greatly appreciate if you would in future refrain from taking a hostile tone in such future threads. As ALWAYS if you have an issue with an individuals actions use the REPORT feature.

If you wish to change policy then raise an appropriate thread in the feedback section and state your case. As moderators/admin we do listen to users and do our best to adjust policy/actions to best fit the site within the boundaries set out by the admin (we are also open to changing those where possible- for example the restoration of the NSFW gallery).

 

[smoke665]

@Black_Square getting away from the drama, I really like the look you achieve with your images. Do you mind if I ask a couple questions. First is this all natural light, modifiers, etc.? Second, I've been watching some Youtube videos on, dramatic processing using layers of gray scale conversions. I'm not sure if this is the same type of technique you use, but I suspect it's similar. Any suggestions or tips on the processing?

 

[vintagesnaps]

Wonderfully done portrait. Nice work on your website too Matthew.

And I thought in the first page of the thread that it was said it was done as 'Time For...' coffee and a sandwich/lunch... as well as knowing and having interacted with the man.


I realize Lew that this is an issue that you feel strongly about but the conclusion seems to have been based on not realizing the purpose and way the portrait was done, etc. I'm sure there are people out there with cameras doing street photography in a less than considerate way but in this case it seems like it was done with respect; I think that just got missed.

 

[Black_Square]

Im glad there are still people out there who are happy with what they have. Even if it is hardly anything. Great powerful image!

It really is interesting meeting somebody who has made a conscious decision to move away from the material world and still be happy.

And that's enough - take it to private messages if either of you wishes to continue this discussion further.

Lew - TPF does not have any ban nor restriction on street photography of any individuals. I would greatly appreciate if you would in future refrain from taking a hostile tone in such future threads. As ALWAYS if you have an issue with an individuals actions use the REPORT feature.

If you wish to change policy then raise an appropriate thread in the feedback section and state your case. As moderators/admin we do listen to users and do our best to adjust policy/actions to best fit the site within the boundaries set out by the admin (we are also open to changing those where possible- for example the restoration of the NSFW gallery).

Thank you for stepping in.

@Black_Square getting away from the drama, I really like the look you achieve with your images. Do you mind if I ask a couple questions. First is this all natural light, modifiers, etc.? Second, I've been watching some Youtube videos on, dramatic processing using layers of gray scale conversions. I'm not sure if this is the same type of technique you use, but I suspect it's similar. Any suggestions or tips on the processing?

Apologise for the drama! I used a reflector when taking the shot just to get some light into the eyes. A lot of the tonal range is from the camera which had a high dynamic range (d810) which does makes a difference. I'm not familiar with gray scale conversions. Sounds interesting though.

Wonderfully done portrait. Nice work on your website too Matthew.

And I thought in the first page of the thread that it was said it was done as 'Time For...' coffee and a sandwich/lunch... as well as knowing and having interacted with the man.


I realize Lew that this is an issue that you feel strongly about but the conclusion seems to have been based on not realizing the purpose and way the portrait was done, etc. I'm sure there are people out there with cameras doing street photography in a less than considerate way but in this case it seems like it was done with respect; I think that just got missed.

Im pleased you like my website. Also, thanks for recognising my approach to Street photography. Despite what others think, I do have huge respect for my subjects.