Just a thought...Not sure if this is the place for this...

[Southerngal]

Im not sure if this is the place for this or not, so her goes it.......I have noticed through reading many threads that many people often give there opinion/critique whether they are new to photography or been doing it for years. I usually look at the work of those that give an opinion/critique....always curious of their work. I have noticed that their work is either really good and that they most likely know what they are talking about, that their work is on "about" the same level of the work that they are criticizing, or their work is awful and they have no room to offer up an opinion....much less advice.

That said, I generally try not to say too much about someones work, especially if I dont care for it. I love photography and have always taken pics, but I have no technical training. I have just been reading my butt off and asking many questions. I dont feel comfortable pointing out some of the problems I find in works of others when my work is far from perfect.....Is this just me?

Im not trying to gripe....I just dont like stepping on the toes of other photographers whose work has helped me learn so much.

 

[Digital Matt]

If someone's photos (in your opinion) are awful, then their opinion is invalid?

 

[Jon, The Elder]

Im not trying to gripe....I just dont like stepping on the toes of other photographers whose work has helped me learn so much.

Very diplomatic attitude.

 

[Hertz van Rental]

If someone's photos (in your opinion) are awful, then their opinion is invalid?

I think you mean 'of no value'.
Validity and value mean different things and are often confused - particularly in photographic discussions

Sorry. Just in the mood for some light pedantry

 

[Big Mike]

I can't draw worth a lick...but I could certainly offer up an opinion about a drawing. I think the same holds true for photography or any art. An opinion is just that...an opinion. :er:

The advantage of a community like this, is that there usually are some people who have plenty of experience and or technical knowledge...and they can help people to understand what is going on with their image. But even the most knowledgeable person will have a personal opinion...that is just as valid (or valuable?) as a person with little experience.

It comes down to what the person (posting the photo) is asking. If they are just posting a photo and saying 'look at this'...then it's hard to offer anything more than an opinion...because we have no idea if they accomplished what they set out to do. We can offer up an opinion...but that may be useless for the learning process of the poster.

 

[Sw1tchFX]

I'll take as many opinions as I can get. Good or bad.

 

[Garbz]

It doesn't matter how good or bad someone is. You can't please everyone. I don't critique works that I am not interested in. Just works that I like but see little problems, or problems to me anyway.

Classic example is the harsh lighting and blown highlights. In my experience it doesn't matter how nice a high key shot is someone will point them out.

Even if you don't like someone's work, they offer a different set of eyes and different thoughts about the photo. I have often found myself so engrossed in one area in a photograph that I have completely missed something else. Regardless of what I think of another person if they offer their critique I will examine the facts they present with no regard to who they are or the work I do, and then neutrally pass my own judgement as to if they are "right" or "wrong".

 

[neea]

Just because they give their advice does not mean you have to take it.

For me, I listen to all point and try to understand their point of view. If I disagree then I move onto the next persons advice.

You don't have to be married to offer great marriage advice and you dont have to be a professional photographer to offer great advice or opinions on photographs.

 

[Iron Flatline]

I just posted elswhere that I am frustrated by the lack of creative interaction with the people in my life - they see my images, but they have no comment. Whatsoever.

As such I seek that kind of conversation here. ANY comments or critique is better than none. Anyone's point is valid, because it gets you thinking about your own photography. Don't give lighting advice if you don't know how to light a scene, but feel free to comment creatively. Look, a forum like this isn't only about learning from other people's comments, it's also learning HOW TO comment. Yes, some people lack manners, and some comments lose nuance when written instead of spoken and accompanied by gestures and facial expressions... but you can still comment. And some of us need to grow a slightly thicker skin.

Check out Vazaar, we do a lot of C&C work there.

 

[Jon, The Elder]

Look, a forum like this isn't only about learning from other people's comments, it's also learning HOW TO comment.

No truer words were ever spoken !

I fall into this pit every so often.

 

[Southerngal]

I guess its just me...I dont mind C&C and I have learned so much from it, but I truly can't stand it when someone comments on the quality of my image....maybe that it is blown out or blurry for example....and then I view his/her images and they are terrible. I take the comment/advice and leave it. I was only wondering if this bothered others. I will definitely feel free to leave more comments now. I usually steer clear b/c I dont feel that I have any room to speak up

 

[abraxas]

... and they are terrible. I take the comment/advice and leave it. I was only wondering if this bothered others. I will definitely feel free to leave more comments now.
... speak up

:thumbup:

 

[Iron Flatline]

I can recognize a technical short-coming without knowing how to actually avoid it myself.

I accept criticism from people who's work is worse than mine - it's still better than my friends' or family's work, who don't think about photography at all.

No, I don't like some criticism either. I had a bunch of high-key shots, but even some very skilled photographers thought they were simply blown out.

 

[glaston]

Even if you don't like someone's work, they offer a different set of eyes and different thoughts about the photo. I have often found myself so engrossed in one area in a photograph that I have completely missed something else. Regardless of what I think of another person if they offer their critique I will examine the facts they present with no regard to who they are or the work I do, and then neutrally pass my own judgement as to if they are "right" or "wrong".

This is exactly the way I see it also.
When giving critique there are different areas to comment on.
There's the content, which in many cases is effected by composition mainly.
Composition is not that difficult to get right for most people. Some people are compositionally challenged though, and might be a genius when it comes to depth and exposure.
In that case, another educated opinion about the composition is good, regardless of that persons work.
Then you have the technical aspects, which seem to be the hard part for most people. At the same time, many people are good with the tech part, but lack in other areas. So good critique of the tech part can do wonders for someone.
I've found that when I work an image of any sort, after a little while I start to only see what I think is wrong with it. Not what's good.
In that case, another opinion is what I need.
Sometimes getting critique from someone who isn't coming from another artistic viewpoint can be of great use.
They're coming from a POV of what they would expect to see in the shot.
Not from a technical POV.
Since after all, many people viewing your work aren't gonna be photographers themselves, but they've most likely seen alot of images in their life and can pick out something that doesn't seem right even if they don't have insight into the problem.
They also represent what the average person sees when they view your work. So it's important for a photographer to know that so they can learn from it.
==================================

I can recognize a technical short-coming without knowing how to actually avoid it myself.

Exactly! I'm the same way, I can identify a flaw and offer a theory of what caused it, even if I can't see how to avoid it.
If you get 10 people to critique your work, all non-photographers, there will still be some things that are common among them that they pick out as potential flaws.
So that might in some cases tell you that it's something that most people are gonna see right off the bat, and it would be best to take care of it.
This seems to be something that happens to alot of people who are new to digital editing. They add some intense FX elements in their image and focus on it, then they're offended when someone doesn't like it or suggests to do it differently.
That's something that layman will notice, as it's "in your face".
Most non-photographers aren't gonna see problems in DOF unless it's highly pronounced.
Same goes for blown out highlights or loss of detail in shadows.
They might notice color problems pretty easily though.
That being said, many photographers might quickly and easily disregard that critique because of the source.
Which IMO, could be a disservice in some cases.
===============================
The "fanboy" critique.
When people offer up large amounts of positive critique. Like "that's great I love it", or "wow, that's excellent" or "you rock man". When the majority of critique is like that, it defeats the purpose of critique entirely. They aren't even really giving critique, just praise and admiration.
Some people eat that up to the extent that it's all their looking for. They aren't interested in real critique. Most people who give fanboy critique really don't have anything else to offer, because they only know they like the work, many times not even knowing exactly what they like about it.

Many people don't like to get critique, they get defensive or hurt by it in some cases.
Being able to take constructive criticism is something that any artist of any sort is gonna have to get used to. It's an extremely important aspect of the creative process.
If you can't take critique, then you really aren't ready to be showing your work in an official capacity yet. Some people when asked to give critique of any sort, do a terrible injustice to the artist by sugar coating the critique, or only saying what they like and not what they think is wrong or could use more work.
It doesn't help the artist much for people to say only good things.
It might help your confidence.
It should be done in moderation though.

 

[The_Traveler]

This is exactly the way ===============================
The "fanboy" critique.
When people offer up large amounts of positive critique. Like "that's great I love it", or "wow, that's excellent" or "you rock man". When the majority of critique is like that, it defeats the purpose of critique entirely. They aren't even really giving critique, just praise and admiration.
Some people eat that up to the extent that it's all their looking for. They aren't interested in real critique. Most people who give fanboy critique really don't have anything else to offer, because they only know they like the work, many times not even knowing exactly what they like about it.

Many people don't like to get critique, they get defensive or hurt by it in some cases.
Being able to take constructive criticism is something that any artist of any sort is gonna have to get used to. It's an extremely important aspect of the creative process.
If you can't take critique, then you really aren't ready to be showing your work in an official capacity yet. Some people when asked to give critique of any sort, do a terrible injustice to the artist by sugar coating the critique, or only saying what they like and not what they think is wrong or could use more work.
It doesn't help the artist much for people to say only good things.
It might help your confidence.
It should be done in moderation though.

I didn't want to take up space by quoting this entire post but I think the post is one of the best collections of truisms about critique I have read.

Especially the two paras above.

Hurrah for Glaston.