My first 2 weddings!

[jamesdorsey89]

Well for starters I just want to say hi because I am new to the forum! I picked up photography as a hobby about 2 years ago and really only got serious about it for the past year. I have done most of my work for my family with some of it being paid. I just enjoy taking photos so that people can hopefully enjoy them. Before the wedding I had only taken pictures at baby showers and other low pressure events. Then I got my first wedding gig. This was for an aunt of my cousin in-law. I felt pretty good in my ability to provide good photos for the price of $500. Well, she laughed and thought that was way to much! I couldn't believe it because I thought it was a fair price. So we settled on $200.. For one, it then meant that there would be hardly any pressure on me and second, it was my first wedding.

The whole wedding was rushed and completely unorganized! Despite all of the hectic mess, I was able to get some shots and adapt to it. I got through the ceremony and pictures outside and then the nausea kicked in... I had taken Vicodin the night before and morning of to help with the pain from my two herniated discs. They had made me ill despite not having any problems with them weeks before. So long story short, I didn't make it to the reception.. It was not a huge deal to the couple because it was the third wedding for both of them! I was so embarrassed and felt horrible and wanted to only take half of the money they had paid me, but they insisted that they still pay the full amount because they were happy with what I did provide them. So below are a few of my favorites from the day. The rest can be seen here

#1


#2


#3


#4


#5


Then there was my second wedding that was only a month after my first! I learned a lot during the first one and also learned how unprepared I felt and knew I needed to change that. I also had another cushion for this wedding because I was pretty sure they were only going to pay for my lens rental and then a tip on top of that. So I was not expecting much and was doing them a favor because they were my brothers friends and did not have a lot of money to spend.

Learning from my last mistake, I did some more research to find some more tips and advice. Even though I still had a lot to learn, I felt better prepared for the second wedding than I did for my first. Although this one was also a little rushed, I was able to get the shots I needed. For this wedding, I did not take the pain meds for two reasons, first because of my last experience and second because I ran out and the doctor did not supply me with more. So I took ibuprofen to help me get through the day. I rested the best I could two days prior to make sure I could make it through the day. Boy was it a long day! Started at 9:30am and left the reception around 11:30pm! I know this is normal for a lot of you, but it was a long day for me! By the end of it, I could barely sit in the car on the way home because I was in so much pain! I don't think my butt touched the seat the whole ride home!

So as far as how the wedding went, I felt much better about this one than the last. I employed a tactic that I read about the night before and that was putting a speedlight in the corner of the dance floor as a secondary light. I was pretty happy with some of the results that I got from it when it worked! I quickly found the limitations of the CLS system! I didn't think it would be a problem because I have used the system quite a bit before in different scenarios. I could only get it to go off when the commander was pointing straight at the remote and even then, sometimes it would not fire. It was probably from there not being any nearby walls for the light to bounce around and get to the remote flash. Even so, I was able to make it work and get some good shots, but will invest in radio's for my next wedding! Despite the tremendous back pain at the end of the day and the few days after, I had a blast and look forward to the next! Below are some of my favorites and the rest can be seen here!

I would appreciate any advice, tips, criticism, or anything else that any of you would have! I still have a lot to learn and figure out. I hope you enjoy!

Thank you,
Jim

#6


#7


#8


#9


#10

 

[JoshuaSimPhotography]

I like the third one in the first set and the second one in the second. They show the most emotion to me IMO. And I'm not so crazy about the slant or the glare in some

 

[binga63]

Can't give tips .... can only give what I like and one thing that stands out...I like 8972.... and 7201... would have liked the one with the Doberman but you cut off its feet .. anything else I will leave to the pros.. good luck

 

[jamesdorsey89]

I like the third one in the first set and the second one in the second. They show the most emotion to me IMO. And I'm not so crazy about the slant or the glare in some

So you didn't like how I actually showed the speedlight in the pictures? Was it the amount of glare, or just the glare at all?

Can't give tips .... can only give what I like and one thing that stands out...I like 8972.... and 7201... would have liked the one with the Doberman but you cut off its feet .. anything else I will leave to the pros.. good luck

Didn't notice that at the time... I was rushing because everyone was really hot and tired of pictures even though we had not taken that many. I do need to slow down a little bit and take some more time composing shots to make sure everything is in the frame, or certain things aren't.

Thank you both for your input!

 

[tirediron]

The technical aspects of these aren't bad; certainly I've seen much worse from the beginning wedding photographers, HOWEVER the composition and subject matter really leaves a lot to be desired in most cases. (For future reference please embed your images vertically and number them)

(Working L->R, top to bottom). #1: What's the point? Lots of sky, lots of grass, very little building. If this building or field is significant, make it the focus. 2: Why all the wasted space? No one cares what the ceiling looks like, nore the foreground. GET CLOSE!!! 3: Nice, but we need to see her left shoulder in the shot. 4: Angles and vignettes; nothing says "I'm new to this" like them! 5: Cute, but sort out the exposure of the background. I think this one needs to stay in colour. 6: I have NO idea what the subject is here, or what I'm looking at. 7: Right idea, sort out your exposure. 8: Odd angle, badly cropped dress (No matter how much the bride likes Fido, she's probably going to like her dress more) and severely under-exposed foreground. 9: Would have worked if the window exposure had been correct. Learn how to balance flash and ambient light. 10: This technique works sometimes when using the sun. It NEVER works using an indoor light.

If you have a condition that makes long days difficult, you really need to reconsider shooting weddings. You've been lucky; you've done two small affairs, having to run out on one and have suffered no consequences. Trust me, your luck will not hold forever. If you are going to keep doing this, get your contracts, licensing and insurance sorted, and talk to your doctor about medication that will not prevent you from doing your job.

Just my $00.02 worth - your mileage may vary.

~John

 

[jamesdorsey89]

The technical aspects of these aren't bad; certainly I've seen much worse from the beginning wedding photographers, HOWEVER the composition and subject matter really leaves a lot to be desired in most cases. (For future reference please embed your images vertically and number them)

(Working L->R, top to bottom). #1: What's the point? Lots of sky, lots of grass, very little building. If this building or field is significant, make it the focus. 2: Why all the wasted space? No one cares what the ceiling looks like, nore the foreground. GET CLOSE!!! 3: Nice, but we need to see her left shoulder in the shot. 4: Angles and vignettes; nothing says "I'm new to this" like them! 5: Cute, but sort out the exposure of the background. I think this one needs to stay in colour. 6: I have NO idea what the subject is here, or what I'm looking at. 7: Right idea, sort out your exposure. 8: Odd angle, badly cropped dress (No matter how much the bride likes Fido, she's probably going to like her dress more) and severely under-exposed foreground. 9: Would have worked if the window exposure had been correct. Learn how to balance flash and ambient light. 10: This technique works sometimes when using the sun. It NEVER works using an indoor light.

If you have a condition that makes long days difficult, you really need to reconsider shooting weddings. You've been lucky; you've done two small affairs, having to run out on one and have suffered no consequences. Trust me, your luck will not hold forever. If you are going to keep doing this, get your contracts, licensing and insurance sorted, and talk to your doctor about medication that will not prevent you from doing your job.

Just my $00.02 worth - your mileage may vary.

~John

First, I just want to say thank you very much for taking the time to evaluate each picture. You bring up a lot of good things that I can learn from. You are right about the vignettes.... I know I way overused the effect.

As far as contracts and such goes, I have yet to seriously sit down and draft a contract. This has been a hobby/small business for me. I am currently finishing up my last month of college to become a mechanical engineer. So, I have not put to much thought into the business side because it is not my main focus. I keep meaning to sit down and get the business more inline, but it gets overshadowed by many other things.

As far as my back goes, I hope it gets healed soon. I will be in some rough shape when I get older. I just hope the fact that I am 22 will help me recover sooner than later!

Thanks again for critiquing my photos. Your comments will be used the next time I am taking pictures.

 

[jamesbjenkins]

Nice images for a beginner. I won't offer C&C because John hit it on the head, and I'm not a fan to repeating the same advice.

What I will say is that you darn well better get the business side of your little photography gig in order before you accept another paid client. Way too many people get themselves a nice camera, spend varying amount of time with it and hear lots of nice things from friends and family, and think they're ready for business. You mention that in your first wedding, you thought $500 was a fair price, and your client disagreed. How did you settle on $500? It sounded like a nice round number? If you were better prepared, you could have explained to your client why your $500 price was a great value.

Here's a short list of questions for you to think about yourself, you don't necessarily need to address them here. I'm writing this as someone who was in a very similar place about 3 years ago, and I really wish I'd have had a place like this forum to help me avoid a lot of the clueless mistakes I made starting out. I'd probably be a lot further along than I am now:

- Do you have a formal business plan IN WRITING?
- What is your cost of doing business (CODB)? (include EVERYTHING: insurance, equipment maintenance, gas, food, new gear, etc.)
- What is your cost of goods sold (COGS)? (i.e. how much do your prints, CDs, etc. cost you)
- Do you have backups of EVERYTHING? (cameras, lenses, batteries, SD/CF cards, etc. etc. etc.)
- Do you have a license for your business?
- Do you collect sales tax? (may be NA depending on your state)
- Do you have a liability insurance policy for your business?
- Do you have a well-written and attorney-reviewed contract?
- What will you do if someone sues you?

If you answers to any of those questions are "NO" or "I don't know", then you need to stop accepting clients right now and get yourself in gear. The absolute bare minimum is that you secure a liability policy for your business that includes an "errors & omissions" section, and that you IMMEDIATELY get yourself an ironclad contract. I'd also strongly recommend that you apply for an LLC for your "business", that way you and your family will be protected should the proverbial chit ever hit the fan.

Being a professional photographer isn't as simple as "getting serious" for a year and then starting to shoot for paying clients.

I'm sure you don't want to hear any of this, but I really hope you don't ignore me and the others who tell you the same thing on this forum. If you're not prepared, EVERY client you take could ruin your entire life.

 

[o hey tyler]

Hi James, I will do my best to critique your photos and not to offend. I have offended people who posted in the professional gallery in the past (as novice shooters), thankfully your images are pretty good for only shooting for 2 years.

Here it goes:

1. Not really much going on in this photo. It's a building with a large amount of tree cover. I can't say it really does much for me, and there's some slight posterization around the cloud in the upper right.

2. I would have liked to see you get a little closer on this shot. I try to be up close and personal when the bride and groom are kissing. I don't have the one of this couple in the church on the web, but this was during a formal session after the ceremony: http://i.minus.com/ibp54aYoPCUyjR.jpg You were at f/5, 1/80s at 18mm, so you could have zoomed in some without your lens stopping down to f/5.6.

3. Not really much going on in this image either. The girl is looking away from the photo, and basically all you see is her hair. If this shot were a bit wider to capture her running or playing, it would have been better IMO.

4. Angles really don't work for this image. You were at 38mm, I would have liked to see this shot with your kit lens fully extended to 105mm at f/8. Also, the vignette is pretty harsh and unnecessary. The only vignette I ever use is created naturally by the lens.

5. Nice capture, but extremely contrasty. Have you tried lightening the green channel to decrease the moodiness of the image? It looks too dark and dramatic to be a wedding.

6. You have an 85mm f/1.4 for this photo. I use that quite a bit on a full frame camera. Try shooting one stop down from wide open (f/2) for noticeably sharper images. The head on the right is a major detracting element from this otherwise classic image.

7. Not bad exposure, but why are you behind them? Weddings are about capturing moments and expressions, you need to be capturing their faces, and how they interact with each other. Out of the 10 photos you posted, 3 of them have faces that you can see the emotion in. Here's an example of what I do to capture faces: http://i.minus.com/iba0HXv9yTYxjV.jpg If you're the primary photographer, shoot first, ask questions later. The last time I was in a church shooting a wedding, I went up into "the forbidden zone" which is the "sanctuary" in a Catholic Church. The way that the B&G were positioned, that was the ONLY way I could get a photo of their faces. After I had taken a few frames, the preist, pastor (or whatever. I'm an atheist so I don't keep up on these things) told me not to go in the sanctuary. So I didn't, and all I was able to get were side profile shots of the B&G, which frankly I was not happy with. So I used images that I got before he told me where the forbidden zone was, and they were very happy with those. If I had asked where I could take photos, I never would have got any images of the B&G during the ceremony.

8. Not bad, but dappled sunlight is not where you want to be shooting. Especially something with such tonal variety as a brides dress and a grooms's tux. Try to keep them in shade for even lighting when you can.

9. Probably the most interesting shot of the bunch. I like the color pallet and the framing. Nice shot. One thing I would do differently is expose more for the interior. It wouldn't bother me if the outdoors were totally blown, but that's just a personal opinion. http://i.minus.com/ibqox13wlDQ5Ei.jpg I shot that knowing that the bride was going to be entering in front of an open door to the outside. I had my camera set to manual in order to not botch the exposure by the camera wanting to expose for the highlights.

10. I like this shot, you captured a nice moment. I don't like the flare, and the tilt. But otherwise good work.

Hope some of this helped James. You seem eager to learn and absorb critique. I don't normally put this much time and effort into critiquing images, but you remind me a lot of myself. I shot my first wedding at 22 years of age.

Take care.

 

[jamesbjenkins]

I keep meaning to sit down and get the business more inline, but it gets overshadowed by many other things.

The business side of the photography is INFINITELY more important than the photography itself if you're not properly prepared. Does it matter if your speedlights aren't firing properly if you're forced to defend yourself in court because someone wasn't happy and you didn't have a contract and liability insurance policy to protect yourself?

Does is matter that you don't know how to do certain things if the IRS or state comptroller comes along and asks why you haven't paid taxes on your photography revenue?

You're about to get an engineering degree, so I'm going to conclude that you're intelligent enough to understand what a monumental and avoidable amount of risk you're accepting by letting these issues "get overshadowed by other things."

The people here giving you advice want you to be successful. Hopefully, you'll apply the advice IMMEDIATELY.

 

[jamesdorsey89]

Thank you all so much for the effort you have put into helping me succeed. I have been so busy lately with finishing my thesis and school work that I haven't had time to reply. I don't want you guys to think I was scared away!

I can't agree more with everything you guys have said. I have decided to put everything on hold until I can take the time to better plan my business. I understand the risks involved and I see that I have gotten lucky so far. My very first wedding could have been a disaster if she would have sued me because I did not make it to the second half of the wedding. I don't want to move forward without a concrete business plan. Right now I do not have a list of set prices. I would like to have different packages for every type of photography that I do. There are just so many things that I do not have organized that need to be.

I have a friend here at school that has taken many business classes and has even set up a mock business plan. I am going to get with him to help me out with that. Also, my fiance's boss has a lot of experience with contracts, so he should be helpful. I really have taken to heart what you guys have said. I have definitely felt like I was a mess at times and had no direction. I think if I get the business side setup, I will feel like I have some sense of direction.

I just want to say thank you again! I hope to see you around the forum.

Jim