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which macro lens do i buy?

Personally I would buy a setup to reverse your lens if you are a beginner, give you a better idea of DOF and focus without breaking the bank! Just an option as this is what I'm doing! :)

Given the OP is dealing with live spiders (venomous ones no doubt), lens reversal may not give the working distance necessary.
 
Just checked with my Tamron mounted on a Canon T1i. Mind you, the Tamron has its front element deeply recessed, so the measurements were from the front of the len mount, and not the lens itself. At 1:1 full extension, distance from front of lens to eyepiece is 8 1/4" (210mm) and distance from front of lens mount to subject is around 80mm so you're pretty intimate with your subject. Which is why people who shoot things that can bite or sting tend to to to macro lenses in the 180mm focal length. I'd an acquaintance who has put extension tubes on a 200mm telephoto and got his macro that way (yes, it works fine). If you're really concerned about being close to the critters, you can always put the camera in Live-view mode and be at least a couple of feet away from the subject. It you tether it to a laptop, you've got even more distance, but now the setup is becoming a bit unwieldy for field use.
 
Poisonous spiders? Forget the 90mm. Go onto ebay and find yourself a second hand Sigma 150mm f2.8 macro or better 180mm f2.8 macro lens. With macro photography the amount of magnification that you get is always the same for a true macro lens. Thus because the magnification (at the closest point of focus) is the same the frame you get is also the same.

A close up photo of a 2p coin with a 35mm macro will give you the same frame as one taken with a 180mm macro lens. The differences though will be that the 180mm will give you the closest focus from further away, whilst also giving you much more blurred background areas (actual depth of field remains the same, although with some compositions the reduced blurring of a very short focal length macro lens can give the illusion of a slightly greater depth of field).

The Macro lenses on the market are all pretty much top rate, even new versions make only small advances in the image quality. They are very high end lenses with regard to optics so you can be much more free to choose based on features, focal length and budget. The Sigma 150 and 180mm macro lenses have always been popular with insect photographers for the increased working distance* and the increased blurring of background areas.
Nikon also has a very good 200mm macro lens if you can get hold of one for your budget. 180mm can be a little bit more tricky handheld but I know quite a few who shoot with it handheld without any problems at all.

The bonus of the sigma (I'm not sure about the Nikon someone will have to chime in for them) is that the Sigma 150mm and 180mm will take Sigma teleconverters, which can give you a bit more working distance and also a bit more magnification at the closest focusing point. I've nearly always used a 1.4TC on my 150mm macro just for that little bit of extra magnification. A 2*TC makes things a little more tricky (you're working with double the magnification handheld - so that is harder, doable but harder) but gives you a 2:1 magnification to play with - great for very tiny insects (personally I prefer a shorter focal length for higher magnifications as you can get in close and lean in something as you shoot - longer focal lengths are more tricky handheld as motions get far more amplified - thus a tripod helps a lot more).



Lighting wise I would strongly suggest starting with a simple setup - a Speedlite design flash coupled with a softbox (a lumiquest softbox works well or anything of similar size). With the 150mm and 180mm you can even have the flash mounted to the camera with the softbox attached and get good lighting over the subject without much trouble.

Tripod wise if you're going to use it keep in mind 2 things:
1) Get a manfrotto junior geared head - pricey and heavy, but a wonder for macro work. It's a slower head to use, but it lets you adjust the angle of each axis with very fine and precise measurements, something that is very hard to do with any other kind of tripod head. It also doesn't have droop which can be a common problem (esp with ballheads - unless you shell out for a top of the range one)

2) Slow - tripod work is slow macro shooting. You'll want to be out early or using a lure of some kind (eg food) so that he insects are either very torpid or distracted as you shoot so that they are less likely to spook and move. Trying to chase active insects in the middle of a hot day with a tripod generally won't work.



*working distance is from the front of the lens to the subject - as opposed to min focusing distance which is from the sensor to the subject
 
Good input Overread but I don't think any of that will fit within the OP's budget.

The only thing I can suggest is the Adaptall Tamron SP 90mm f/2.5 + SP BBAR MC 2x teleconverter. The BBAR is designed specifically for the 90mm gets you more working distance (180mm focal length), decent IQ, and 1:1 magnification at around 6 inches of working distance. At 1:2.5 its just a little less than 2 feet working distance. I have the lens in front of me but I don't have anything to measure. The BBAR can be a little hard to find but its not that expensive and the 90mm f/2.5 is also inexpensive. I use it with a good ring light... needs a lot of light due to the teleconverter and DOF you will be working with. Don't forget to budget in the appropriate Adaptall mount ($25USD).
 
Second hand Sigma 150mm should run around £350-400 ish I'm not as sure on the 180mm but there was never too much difference in price on them when they were new (though second hand there might be differences). I'm not sure about the 200mm Nikon or how much it might run second hand.

That should leave enough for a lumiquest softbox and speedlite flash (I'm not as up to date on these options for nikon).
 
Working distance is going to be key In my fInal decIsIon here guys. I didn't realize I would need to be so close with the 90mm.
Again I'm not unaccustomed to spiders but 6 inches from one of the most poisonous things on the planet is a little too close for comfort. And that's for me and the spider!! 2 feet however is do-able. The tamron adaptall BBAR looks like a plan usayit. Relatively inexpensive, and you say IQ is still good?

overread. There are no 150 or 180 macro lenses under 6-700 on eBay or any of the s/h papers/gumtree etc here at the moment but I'll keep checking thru the week. Might even have a second hand one at the shop but I wouldn't hold my breath.

One other thing to ask u guys. It has been mentioned that these make good prime lenses aswell or Is thIs bullplop? My prime now is a Nikon afs dx 35mm f1.8. It's not too big or heavy to carry with me but if the macro would do the same job it'll no longer be required. I only ask as I could sell it or trade it in to maybe get closer to the 150mm end of the price scale. Or would I be better keeping it?

And again thanks for the info. I'm learning at an exponential rate here:D
 
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I don't have access to my image library (at work) and don't really have good samples of 90+BBAR online at the moment but here are some samples that I posted on the TPF in the past:

Panasonic G1 + Kmount adapter + 90mm Tamron Macro + 1:1 teleconverter on a tripod. Sorry don't recall what magnification it was set at..... I think I still had it at 1:1.
2691d1265557591-bored-playing-g1-p1020367.jpg


2692d1265557857-bored-playing-g1-p1020370.jpg


Pentax/Samsung GX-1L.... 90mm no teleconverter with ring flash. It was about 3 feet away so I know I wasn't set at 1:2 (max of 90mm)... probably more like 1:5 magnification.

2026d1227057846-blossom-reflecting-pool-sg1l6856.jpg



In regards to your other question, these macro lenses also make good portrait lenses. The 90mm is sharp enough and has smooth bokeh:

Pentax/Samsung GX1L.. 90mm. No flash wide open on a tripod.

305600505.jpg




There is a reason why Tamron continued this macro till today... improving on it by adding 1:1 (no teleconverter required) and autofocus. I agree with Overread.... since these are poisonous spiders, ideally you want a LOOONG macro for working distance. He gave some good (or better) options if you can mange to fund them. I haven't really shot spiders but the old Tamron 90mm + BBAR might just be enough. Of course.... for me, my setup was intended to be low budget since I'm not really that invested in macro. I just do it once in a while.
 
All I have to say is, don't do lens reversal if you aren't comfortable being mere inches from the subject :)
 
Macro lenses are generally good prime lenses, however they have one general weakness. Do to them having very fine and precise control of focus in their close focusing distances, their longer focusing is more crude. This means that, in practice, a very tiny turn of the focus wheel results in a big shift to the focus (at more normal shooting distances). This can make manual focusing or correction more tricky and means that you're more reliant on AF (which on macro lenses is good ,but generally slower than regular prime lenses).

Also remember that a 35mm will give you a very different view to a 90mm or 150mm macro lens. You'll have a much more "zoomed in" angle of view, good for outdoors but could be more tricky for say portraits and stuff indoors.



One other thing to consider is, if you're worried about the poison, using a longer telephoto lens and cropping in a bit. There are a few good zooms which, with a teleconveter added, can give you a respectable amount of magnification. Though it won't be anywhere near as much as on a macro lens:

eg
5006514264_672963ac30.jpg

Of course that is something to keep in mind for the future as you're unlikely to be able to get a good telephoto setup like that into your budget as well (the only other option would be renting).
 
ok so heres what i got.

DSC_0895.jpg


carbon manfrotto tripod which is ultra light so i can carry it with me.
kenko 2x teleconverter s/h
tamron 90mm new
vivitar macro ring flash.

all in £612.

now all i need to do is figure out how to work it lol.

Thanks for all the help guys.
 
been playing around trying out things for hours now and here's the results..

6 inches from lens to subject, no tele converter.

DSC_0944.jpg

DSC_0916.jpg


1 foot from subject with teleconverter.

DSC_0922.jpg

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4 feet without,

DSC_0907.jpg


8 feet with it once more.

DSC_0917.jpg


the pictures do get darker when you add the tc but none of these used the flash, and the dof does get thinner but i'm looking into something called image stacking.

I''ll pick up a set of focus rails soon too once funds allow.

Im well happy with all of this exept maybe the flash, which doesnt work if AF is on for some reason. tbh it seems easier to manually focus anyway. the tamron af is slow.

all in all im pretty pleased with it, thanks, BTW
 
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