am i wrong?

[limr]

Wellllll, not for nothing but....if the school is doing this to make money, I'm not sure how that's entirely a bad thing. Most schools are generally underfunded and maybe the bake sales just ain't cutting it anymore. It's time to get creative.

They are also vast disparities in how well schools are funded. Some are severely lacking in resources while others have more funding than they can handle, thanks to school taxes being linked to property values. So allowing underfunded districts to compete with the wealthy abundantly-funded districts is also not entirely a bad thing. They are finding a way to let students use the same equipment that better-situated students do. Leveling the playing field and all. Otherwise, by the time they get to college, some students would be at more of a disadvantage than they already are.

I don't know the funding situation of the district in question here, nor do I understand completely the reasons for the terms of the contract. But I know I'd have read that sucker carefully before signing it or have consulted it before spending money on my own iPad.

 

[Overread]

As Tired said the school might not pay for them at retail price; in fact they might even get them donated via some education initiative (either national, state, regional or heck someone might just know someone at a local store/Apple rep and get it via an education donation or significant discount - units might be reconditioned or such too).

Ergo the school has many ways in which it might not cost them a huge sum of money. There's also the fact that even without that cost it still doesn't mean that they don't want to earn from them - if anything that means the $25 is even more important as its going toward offsetting part of a much larger cost.

Edit - note I said earn not profit

 

[bribrius]

Generally speaking Schools look to earn money where they can and they likely earn from this setup. Thus they don't want to encourage parents to buy their own iPads for their kids because suddenly the school loses out on the income they get.

I think you are talking out of your....HAT on this one....

The cheapest iPad 4 price I can find is $299.95. A typical American primary school in many districts has 34 students per class. That is $10,200 per year for one single classroom of iPad 4 units at 34 x $300. The ANNUAL rental fee is $25 for an iPad 4--a BARGAIN for nine months of use!

The kids are getting the use of a $300 tablet (at base-model price!) that costs 12 times the yearly rental fee.I really do not see much money being earned by the school on this affordable an arrangement.

As far as kids using those new-fangled computer-type devices in school today...by crikey, it's smacks of modernism, and 21st century progress...in MY DAY we had slates and chalk!!! This is almost as bad as the transition from whale oil lamps to that infernal 'legtriciddy stuff.

Yes, but the school district, IF they pay for them at all does not pay retail.

well they have the replacement cost listed at $589. so, that is what they bill you after the first breakage (which is 50 dollars guessing they have some one time warranty plan). I think i listed that above somewhere. Keep in mind the kids are getting these passed out used at this point. They might have been new once but most of them aren't now. so it could have a ebay price of scratch and dent 200 value but you still get billed the full 589

 

[pixmedic]

Generally speaking Schools look to earn money where they can and they likely earn from this setup. Thus they don't want to encourage parents to buy their own iPads for their kids because suddenly the school loses out on the income they get.

I think you are talking out of your....HAT on this one....

The cheapest iPad 4 price I can find is $299.95. A typical American primary school in many districts has 34 students per class. That is $10,200 per year for one single classroom of iPad 4 units at 34 x $300. The ANNUAL rental fee is $25 for an iPad 4--a BARGAIN for nine months of use!

The kids are getting the use of a $300 tablet (at base-model price!) that costs 12 times the yearly rental fee.I really do not see much money being earned by the school on this affordable an arrangement.

As far as kids using those new-fangled computer-type devices in school today...by crikey, it's smacks of modernism, and 21st century progress...in MY DAY we had slates and chalk!!! This is almost as bad as the transition from whale oil lamps to that infernal 'legtriciddy stuff.

Yes, but the school district, IF they pay for them at all does not pay retail.

well they have the replacement cost listed at $589. so, that is what they bill you after the first breakage (which is 50 dollars guessing they have some one time warranty plan). I think i listed that above somewhere. Keep in mind the kids are getting these passed out use at this point. They might have been new once but most of them aren't now. so it could have a ebay price of scratch and dent 200 value but you still get billed the full 589

well, im sure that the school doesn't have an unlimited supply of these things, so after the first $50 breakage, (assuming that's a warranty fix) they have to be able to replace them. maybe they don't get replacements at a discount. maybe there's software on there that costs the school money that has to be accounted for. maybe its state subsidized and the school doesn't actually get to keep any of the money if there's any left over from year to year.
As horribly funded as our public schools are down here, I don't begrudge the schools any opportunity they can get to put a little extra money in their coffers.

My advice would be to get an Otterbox (or other good case) for it and teach your kid how to properly handle and keep track of it. I would gladly pay $25 a year for my kid to get an ipad.

 

[bribrius]

You are being penny-wise and pound foolish. A $25 a school year iPad rental is dirt-cheap. It might even help a kid learn how to take care of electronics and treat them properly. No outside electronics in schools is a very common new regulation at schools, and has been for several years now. Since you're so good and so prolific at giving smug advice, I'll just say this: figure it out, Dad. Take a bit of responsibility to LEARN what your kid's schooling involves, and stop acting as if the issue is the school's doing. You made you own bed, now fix the problem, so your kid doesn't suffer for your foolishness and lack of involvement. Stop being such a cheapskate. $25 a year rental for a device that costs what, eight times that much? You bought electronics that were unneeded, and you're rationalizing a bad, dumb purchasing decision that you made when you decided to pay your own money for school electronics. Fix the issue. Stop passing the buck. YOU screwed this up. YOU, not the school. So...make it right, and spare us the whining. This is the **exact** tenor,type, and kind of advice you love to dish out here on TPF almost weekly, so...some of your own kind of advice right back at you.

If you need to know "why" outside electronics are banned, do five seconds' worth of research.

There really isn't anything to fix. I paid the 25 for the year, i paid the 50 warranty claim. They are more than willing to issue out another ipad. Just at this point i didn't want them to and decided i really just didnt want the deal with the contract and the entire thing. Really nothing to fix though. If i call the school and just say go ahead and give her another (used) ipad they will. I think i am going to have to everything is on ipads now. kids school work will suffer if i don't. Teachers barely even teach. Testing this week they have to actually print her tests and make special time for her to take them. As she has no ipad right now. Homework, special assignments so they can be in writing. School work, try to find something to print out. Everything is on the ipads. I probably have to let them give her another one.

 

[bribrius]

As Tired said the school might not pay for them at retail price; in fact they might even get them donated via some education initiative (either national, state, regional or heck someone might just know someone at a local store/Apple rep and get it via an education donation or significant discount - units might be reconditioned or such too).

Ergo the school has many ways in which it might not cost them a huge sum of money. There's also the fact that even without that cost it still doesn't mean that they don't want to earn from them - if anything that means the $25 is even more important as its going toward offsetting part of a much larger cost.

Edit - note I said earn not profit

From what i gather most of the money for these came from federal and state grant money. I can't say that is where it still comes from for replacements or how that works i don't know. Just the initial purchase was primarily federal and state grant money. They told me that.

Wellllll, not for nothing but....if the school is doing this to make money, I'm not sure how that's entirely a bad thing. Most schools are generally underfunded and maybe the bake sales just ain't cutting it anymore. It's time to get creative.

They are also vast disparities in how well schools are funded. Some are severely lacking in resources while others have more funding than they can handle, thanks to school taxes being linked to property values. So allowing underfunded districts to compete with the wealthy abundantly-funded districts is also not entirely a bad thing. They are finding a way to let students use the same equipment that better-situated students do. Leveling the playing field and all. Otherwise, by the time they get to college, some students would be at more of a disadvantage than they already are.

I don't know the funding situation of the district in question here, nor do I understand completely the reasons for the terms of the contract. But I know I'd have read that sucker carefully before signing it or have consulted it before spending money on my own iPad.

Really here nor there as far as i am concerned i just care about the contract, cost, and ownership of the ipad. Why i posted the thread, as i tend to have tunnel vision on things and not look at everyone elses point of view.
Far as the cost of the ipads originally, see above. Think most of the funding comes from elsewhere. I don't consider ipads really a improvement. It might have actually saved the local districts here money. As they shift that cost to grants. If you think of what they cut though. When we were in school we had paper, implements, hard cover text books. Yeah, that is pretty much all gone. i was shocked a few years back when my kids had just cheap paperback textbooks. Then those disappeared and it seemed the districts around here were crying for ipads. But if you think of the trade off of the cost of hard cover text books, all the paper, all the time involved in dealing with that paper it might be a cost savings.

Also what i recall of school we had at the most 16-20 in a class. some maybe even only 12 for some classes. Now they have 22-35 kids per class or some crazy number. Depending on what town or state we lived in at the time, what district, the kids per class changed but I dont ever remember having THAT many kids per class. My siblings went to private school, i grew up in mostly public school. So have some idea of going through the public school system. I can't say for sure, but i am guessing it might be a "cheaper" education than we had. Or at least cheaper in what actually makes it out of the money spent down to the actual students. If they want to save money they can cut the payrolls of the superintendents and principles in all these districts and get rid of the unionized teachers. Probably where most of the money goes is the "overhead". But you knew i would say that.

 

[limr]

Really here nor there as far as i am concerned i just care about the contract, cost, and ownership of the ipad. Why i posted the thread, as i tend to have tunnel vision on things and not look at everyone elses point of view.
Far as the cost of the ipads originally, see above. Think most of the funding comes from elsewhere.

I was talking about funding for the school itself, not funding for the iPads, and I was also replying to a point someone had just made about the school making money. I know you only care about the contract.

 

[pixmedic]

As Tired said the school might not pay for them at retail price; in fact they might even get them donated via some education initiative (either national, state, regional or heck someone might just know someone at a local store/Apple rep and get it via an education donation or significant discount - units might be reconditioned or such too).

Ergo the school has many ways in which it might not cost them a huge sum of money. There's also the fact that even without that cost it still doesn't mean that they don't want to earn from them - if anything that means the $25 is even more important as its going toward offsetting part of a much larger cost.

Edit - note I said earn not profit

From what i gather most of the money for these came from federal and state grant money. I can't say that is where it still comes from for replacements or how that works i don't know. Just the initial purchase was primarily federal and state grant money. They told me that.

Wellllll, not for nothing but....if the school is doing this to make money, I'm not sure how that's entirely a bad thing. Most schools are generally underfunded and maybe the bake sales just ain't cutting it anymore. It's time to get creative.

They are also vast disparities in how well schools are funded. Some are severely lacking in resources while others have more funding than they can handle, thanks to school taxes being linked to property values. So allowing underfunded districts to compete with the wealthy abundantly-funded districts is also not entirely a bad thing. They are finding a way to let students use the same equipment that better-situated students do. Leveling the playing field and all. Otherwise, by the time they get to college, some students would be at more of a disadvantage than they already are.

I don't know the funding situation of the district in question here, nor do I understand completely the reasons for the terms of the contract. But I know I'd have read that sucker carefully before signing it or have consulted it before spending money on my own iPad.

Really here nor there as far as i am concerned i just care about the contract, cost, and ownership of the ipad. Why i posted the thread, as i tend to have tunnel vision on things and not look at everyone elses point of view.
Far as the cost of the ipads originally, see above. Think most of the funding comes from elsewhere. I don't consider ipads really a improvement. It might have actually saved the local districts here money. As they shift that cost to grants. If you think of what they cut though. When we were in school we had paper, implements, hard cover text books. Yeah, that is pretty much all gone. i was shocked a few years back when my kids had just cheap paperback textbooks. Then those disappeared and it seemed the districts around here were crying for ipads. But if you think of the trade off of the cost of hard cover text books, all the paper, all the time involved in dealing with that paper it might be a cost savings.

Also what i recall of school we had at the most 16-20 in a class. some maybe even only 12 for some classes. Now they have 22-35 kids per class or some crazy number. Depending on what town or state we lived in at the time, what district, the kids per class changed but I dont ever remember having THAT many kids per class. My siblings went to private school, i grew up in mostly public school. So have some idea of going through the public school system. I can't say for sure, but i am guessing it might be a "cheaper" education than we had. Or at least cheaper in what actually makes it out of the money spent down to the actual students. If they want to save money they can cut the payrolls of the superintendents and principles in all these districts and get rid of the unionized teachers. Probably where most of the money goes is the "overhead". But you knew i would say that.

Get rid of the unionized teachers?
I don't know about other states, but teachers in Florida are getting a UFC style beatdown on their wages and benefits. Classes are bigger than ever, parents are relying on teachers to "raise" their kids more and more, and school funding is getting smaller and smaller.

And the taxpayer's here?
You would think schools would a good cause for a penny hike on taxes, but noooo.
Oh, they will pay to fix roads, highway and median landscaping....
Downtown artwork....
And a new stadium? Hell yea!
But shell out a little money to improve our children's school's? @#&$ the schools.

 

[bribrius]

As Tired said the school might not pay for them at retail price; in fact they might even get them donated via some education initiative (either national, state, regional or heck someone might just know someone at a local store/Apple rep and get it via an education donation or significant discount - units might be reconditioned or such too).

Ergo the school has many ways in which it might not cost them a huge sum of money. There's also the fact that even without that cost it still doesn't mean that they don't want to earn from them - if anything that means the $25 is even more important as its going toward offsetting part of a much larger cost.

Edit - note I said earn not profit

From what i gather most of the money for these came from federal and state grant money. I can't say that is where it still comes from for replacements or how that works i don't know. Just the initial purchase was primarily federal and state grant money. They told me that.

Wellllll, not for nothing but....if the school is doing this to make money, I'm not sure how that's entirely a bad thing. Most schools are generally underfunded and maybe the bake sales just ain't cutting it anymore. It's time to get creative.

They are also vast disparities in how well schools are funded. Some are severely lacking in resources while others have more funding than they can handle, thanks to school taxes being linked to property values. So allowing underfunded districts to compete with the wealthy abundantly-funded districts is also not entirely a bad thing. They are finding a way to let students use the same equipment that better-situated students do. Leveling the playing field and all. Otherwise, by the time they get to college, some students would be at more of a disadvantage than they already are.

I don't know the funding situation of the district in question here, nor do I understand completely the reasons for the terms of the contract. But I know I'd have read that sucker carefully before signing it or have consulted it before spending money on my own iPad.

Really here nor there as far as i am concerned i just care about the contract, cost, and ownership of the ipad. Why i posted the thread, as i tend to have tunnel vision on things and not look at everyone elses point of view.
Far as the cost of the ipads originally, see above. Think most of the funding comes from elsewhere. I don't consider ipads really a improvement. It might have actually saved the local districts here money. As they shift that cost to grants. If you think of what they cut though. When we were in school we had paper, implements, hard cover text books. Yeah, that is pretty much all gone. i was shocked a few years back when my kids had just cheap paperback textbooks. Then those disappeared and it seemed the districts around here were crying for ipads. But if you think of the trade off of the cost of hard cover text books, all the paper, all the time involved in dealing with that paper it might be a cost savings.

Also what i recall of school we had at the most 16-20 in a class. some maybe even only 12 for some classes. Now they have 22-35 kids per class or some crazy number. Depending on what town or state we lived in at the time, what district, the kids per class changed but I dont ever remember having THAT many kids per class. My siblings went to private school, i grew up in mostly public school. So have some idea of going through the public school system. I can't say for sure, but i am guessing it might be a "cheaper" education than we had. Or at least cheaper in what actually makes it out of the money spent down to the actual students. If they want to save money they can cut the payrolls of the superintendents and principles in all these districts and get rid of the unionized teachers. Probably where most of the money goes is the "overhead". But you knew i would say that.

Get rid of the unionized teachers?
I don't know about other states, but teachers in Florida are getting a UFC style beatdown on their wages and benefits. Classes are bigger than ever, parents are relying on teachers to "raise" their kids more and more, and school funding is getting smaller and smaller.

And the taxpayer's here?
You would think schools would a good cause for a penny hike on taxes, but noooo.
Oh, they will pay to fix roads, highway and median landscaping....
Downtown artwork....
And a new stadium? Hell yea!
But shell out a little money to improve our children's school's? @#&$ the schools.

Problem with unionized teachers is you can't easily get rid of a bad teacher. And overhead. Throwing money at a defunct system doesn't really improve it. At some point, like healthcare, we might have to just accept we aren't getting much for our education dollar. Too much red tape, overhead, bureaucracy, something.

American Schools vs. the World Expensive Unequal Bad at Math The Atlantic

 

[bribrius]

and . Not to mention. A lot of the u.s. teachers just suck. Where as some of the rest of the world recruits from the top percent to be teachers, our top percent go into business or corporate. A lot of our teachers come from the middle to bottom percent. So basically, not quite the dumbest of the dumb but hardly the smartest or high achieving. Then they get into a union job, and they are safe and gain tenure. Where they probably never should have been allowed in education to start with.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/18/opinion/why-students-do-better-overseas.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

 

[gsgary]

Bloody hell I can't believe this does Apple own the school

 

[runnah]

1. Schools have deal with apple to get stuff at little to no cost to the school.
2. Bringing unsupported devices onto a secure network poses security and liability risks.
3. its good to get kids learning technology because it is the way of the world. No different than woodshop, home ec or typing class.
4. The education system is in trouble because of the teacher's union keeping under performing people employed. All the good ones go into private education.

 

[bribrius]

Bloody hell I can't believe this does Apple own the school

the school isn't giving in. Furthest i managed to get is "we understand your concerns, and will address it with the school board for next year. But this is out of our control". And they really don't seem to want to discuss it with me any further.

 

[pixmedic]

Bloody hell I can't believe this does Apple own the school

the school isn't giving in. Furthest i managed to get is "we understand your concerns, and will address it with the school board for next year. But this is out of our control". And they really don't seem to want to discuss it with me any further.

Maybe it really is out of their control.
No point in debating it into next year if they can't implement any sort of solution without going through the school board

 

[gsgary]

Bloody hell I can't believe this does Apple own the school

the school isn't giving in. Furthest i managed to get is "we understand your concerns, and will address it with the school board for next year. But this is out of our control". And they really don't seem to want to discuss it with me any further.

If my kid were still at school age they wouldn't be going to that school