Another "legal" question

[supercool2]

Wheremmy kids go to school, part of the paperwork they make all the parents sign is permission to photograph your child (for whatever purposes, like dchool, advertising, etc, etc.. ) There is also "picture day" when a local private photographer takes all the kids photos. We dont get any option to opt out of that or are made to sign anything for thst. Its not only for year book but for the photographer to make money selling his own package deals, to the parents. I had always assumed that the form we sign at beginning of the year giving permission to let our kids get their pictures taken, also covered the photographer coming on "picture day" . I know what I'm saying probably doesnt have to do with the OP question, but I wanted to share that info on what I know as the parent who signed my kids up for school yet another year (I have two in the same school) that my opinion, based on that would make me feel that model releases are not needed for doing any kind of pictures on school property, because the parents would have already signed something for the school,when they enrolled their kids. (Or opted out if given the chance) . I wasn't paying attention to the post to see what state/country this is. And I dont know the laws, but I hope that helps a little. If not,then just ignore my post lol . I tried lol

 

[texkam]

Yes, I remember always signing a beginning of the school year form regarding using images and other work for promotional use. I signed after adding "not for profit" to it.

 

[table1349]

Copyright and model releases are separate, not related, legal issues.

You're right - I was confusing the two concepts. I thought there was something about this I hadn't thought through.

OP. Seriously, go with the legal advise available to you, not here on a photo forum. They call it the Practice of Law for a reason and Lawyers practice at it a lot more than most photographers.

I believe you will find that I addressed this in my last paragraph.

And Yet you still decided to ask a bunch of photographers about the law.

 

[vintagesnaps]

I've been a teacher and parent permission had to be obtained to allow any photos to be taken of students and used for any purpose. Parents made the choice if they wanted to give permission or not - they might decline, possibly to protect their child's privacy (this could be the case where there are custody issues, foster care/adoption, etc.).

I think many school rules and regs vary state to state - I'm not sure if releases were needed for yearbook photos but students did not have to have get school pictures taken. I know in my area releases are obtained for student athletes by youth sports leagues and organizations (not necessarily connected to the school).

I don't know if posting students' photos on a website would be editorial use, but it doesn't seem like retail or commercial use. You could look at resources on ASMP's site but I don't know if they cover info. related to photos of students under 18 in schools.

 

[rlemert]

OP. Seriously, go with the legal advise available to you, not here on a photo forum. They call it the Practice of Law for a reason and Lawyers practice at it a lot more than most photographers.

I believe you will find that I addressed this in my last paragraph.

And Yet you still decided to ask a bunch of photographers about the law.

Have you considered the possibility that, by doing so, I might come across factors that I hadn't thought of that would allow me to have a more complete and effective communication with a lawyer?

 

[nycphotography]

And Yet you still decided to ask a bunch of photographers about the law.

Of course no photographer could possibly have any experience with the law as it pertains to photography. Doh indeed.

 

[table1349]

And Yet you still decided to ask a bunch of photographers about the law.

Of course no photographer could possibly have any experience with the law as it pertains to photography. Doh indeed.

So tell me, when you make the wrong choice and end up in court who are YOU going to have represent you? A photographer or a lawyer?

Most of the time a photographer has experince with the law it is because they are now in court. Defendants usually make bad lawyers. If they made good lawyers we wouldn't call them defendants.

Never eat at a place called mom's,
Never play cards with a man called pops,
And never take legal advise from someone who has nothing on the line for giving you bad advise.

 

[nycphotography]

Are you a lawyer? Because you really come off like a lawyer who's all butt hurt because the internet makes basic information available to everyone and now you don't get to charge someone $300 for a 5 minute answer to a basic question. Geez.

Wanna know something crazy? For a while there, I cancelled my homeowners insurance on a property I own. zomg. What if lightning had struck it?
And for 3 years I cancelled my medical insurance. zomg. What if I got cancer?
And when I was a kid, I rode my bike w/o a helmet. zomg. It's a miracle I'm alive at all.

Wanna know something else? NOTHING HAPPENED. Not surprising since 99.999% of the time, nothing ever does.

Of course, I should probably have paid a lawyer to tell me not to cancel my insurance. Then I could have paid for him AND the insurance,rather than investing that money in a business I was building at the time. Yep, I sure would be better off avoiding all that risk and staying a wage slave forever.

Tell ya what.... you live your live your way... and let everyone else live their lives their way. Deal?

PS. Never listen to anyone who says never.

 

[Gavjenks]

And never take legal advise from someone who has nothing on the line for giving you bad advise.

FWIW the pro bono student types probably don't have anything on the line either for giving bad advice. It's not their area of career specialty because they don't have a career yet. So they're operating outside their specialty, and unless you can prove that they just flat out lied to you or made random stuff up, or pretended to hit the books and didn't, or made some grievous error of common sense judgment for a person in their position, you will not be able to sue them for malpractice if they tell you you don't need a model release and then you get sued by a parent and lose.

I'm not even sure you can sue a student for malpractice anyway no matter WHAT they do, since they haven't passed the bar.

Thus, it makes perfect sense to reinforce the advice with a different opinions from other angles. That would also be true even for a bona fide intellectual property lawyer, unless perhaps he/she happened to already specialize in photography.

 

[manicmike]

Hey I got a question: A friend of mine has been experiencing fever (100 F or greater), cough, nasal secretions, fatigue, headache, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Any idea what he may have??? He thought about seeing a doctor, but I told him the best place to get diagnosed was on a photography forum.

OP. Seriously, go with the legal advise available to you, not here on a photo forum. They call it the Practice of Law for a reason and Lawyers practice at it a lot more than most photographers.

Your friend has herpes.

 

[nycphotography]

Hey I got a question: A friend of mine has been experiencing fever (100 F or greater), cough, nasal secretions, fatigue, headache, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Any idea what he may have??? He thought about seeing a doctor, but I told him the best place to get diagnosed was on a photography forum.

OP. Seriously, go with the legal advise available to you, not here on a photo forum. They call it the Practice of Law for a reason and Lawyers practice at it a lot more than most photographers.

Your "friend" has herpes.

FIFY.

 

[table1349]

And never take legal advise from someone who has nothing on the line for giving you bad advise.

FWIW the pro bono student types probably don't have anything on the line either for giving bad advice. It's not their area of career specialty because they don't have a career yet. So they're operating outside their specialty, and unless you can prove that they just flat out lied to you or made random stuff up, or pretended to hit the books and didn't, or made some grievous error of common sense judgment for a person in their position, you will not be able to sue them for malpractice if they tell you you don't need a model release and then you get sued by a parent and lose.

I'm not even sure you can sue a student for malpractice anyway no matter WHAT they do, since they haven't passed the bar.

Thus, it makes perfect sense to reinforce the advice with a different opinions from other angles. That would also be true even for a bona fide intellectual property lawyer, unless perhaps he/she happened to already specialize in photography.

From the NCCU School of Law: Please Note: The NCCU Law Pro Bono Program and NCCU Law Students cannot represent or give legal advice directly to members of the public. NCCU Law Students may only work under the supervision of a licensed attorney at an organization or project approved by the Program.
There is a dog in this fight: Pro Bono Program « NCCU School of Law

 

[table1349]

Hey I got a question: A friend of mine has been experiencing fever (100 F or greater), cough, nasal secretions, fatigue, headache, nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea. Any idea what he may have??? He thought about seeing a doctor, but I told him the best place to get diagnosed was on a photography forum.

OP. Seriously, go with the legal advise available to you, not here on a photo forum. They call it the Practice of Law for a reason and Lawyers practice at it a lot more than most photographers.

Your friend has herpes.

Nope, good try though. Those are the symptoms of Swine Flu.

 

[table1349]

Are you a lawyer? Because you really come off like a lawyer who's all butt hurt because the internet makes basic information available to everyone and now you don't get to charge someone $300 for a 5 minute answer to a basic question. Geez.

Wanna know something crazy? For a while there, I cancelled my homeowners insurance on a property I own. zomg. What if lightning had struck it?
And for 3 years I cancelled my medical insurance. zomg. What if I got cancer?
And when I was a kid, I rode my bike w/o a helmet. zomg. It's a miracle I'm alive at all.

Wanna know something else? NOTHING HAPPENED. Not surprising since 99.999% of the time, nothing ever does.

Of course, I should probably have paid a lawyer to tell me not to cancel my insurance. Then I could have paid for him AND the insurance,rather than investing that money in a business I was building at the time. Yep, I sure would be better off avoiding all that risk and staying a wage slave forever.

Tell ya what.... you live your live your way... and let everyone else live their lives their way. Deal?

PS. Never listen to anyone who says never.

Nope not a lawyer. I have spent the past 30 + years dealing with and unfortunately sending a lot of business to lawyers, both criminal and civil. Personally I love these folks in court that think they know the law or take the advise of someone else that has no real experience with the practice of law and decide to either act as their own counsel or who go against their counsel's advise. We call them self convicted. In thirty years I have yet to see one of them truly understand what they are trying to argue as their perceived point of law nor have I seen one win. I have seen a few that did a real nice job of digging their own grave. That is real common. Not so common is to see them shovel the dirt on top of themselves and plant their own head stone. J.T.F.F. when that happens. Even their lawyers laugh at them when it is all over.

Want to hear something even crazier. I don't give a Rats @$$ what you did to or about you as an individual. Could care less. A school program and a school district isn't an individual and there is no reason for a program or a district to risk taking an unnecessary hit over something that is probably pretty simple.

As for your post script, Since you see that as good advise, and since you are advising to NEVER listen to someone who says never I shall quite listening to you.

 

[nycphotography]

It's all good as I quit listening to you some ways back. Trying to explain floating point to a binary kinda guy is way below my pay grade.