ARGH! Please help with aspect ratios and printing!

[allthingsapple]

My Canon T2i has an aspect ratio of 3:2 (and I am assuming this is not adjustable). I am using Photoshop Elements and printing on 8.5 X 11 paper. My borders are totally screwed up (inconsistent, uneven, too large--1 inch in some cases, 1/2 inch other times, etc).....I talked to someone at Epson who said that if my images were originally shot with a 5:4 aspect ratio, my prints would have better, more even (and smaller) borders using 8.5 X 11 paper.

Question: Is there a way to resize my images in Elements (I think it might have something to do with resetting the canvas size???) that will produce prints with better, smaller, and more even borders?

Please help-------before I throw camera, printer, and paper out the window.............

 

[PASM]

8.5x11=17:22. 2:3=6x9 or 8x12. Take the longest pixel edge (height) divide by 22, then multiply by 17. That's your printable width in pixels. How you scale it physically, for printing is up to you.

 

[Big Mike]

The basic facts are that your camera shoots at a 3:2 ratio...just like every other DSLR camera, just like 35mm film....and many print/paper sizes don't match that ratio. So your not encountering a new problem, people have been cropping their photos to get the print size they want, since the dawn of photography.

There are a few different ways to get image size that you want. The first one is to use the crop tool in Elements. You should be able to enter the height & width that you want. Then when you drag the crop tool over the image, it will be constrained to the size/ratio that you entered.

Another way to do it, would be to create a new canvas that is the size (and resolution) that you want. Then open the image, select all and copy. Go back to your new canvas and paste the image into it. (or do a drag & drop). Then you can move the image around and resize if needed, until you get the crop that you want. If you don't want white borders on the edges, you will have to crop part of the image off...that's just how it goes.

Of course, you could stretch the image to fit...but that will also distort the image, which you probably don't want.

 

[allthingsapple]

The basic facts are that your camera shoots at a 3:2 ratio...just like every other DSLR camera, just like 35mm film....and many print/paper sizes don't match that ratio. So your not encountering a new problem, people have been cropping their photos to get the print size they want, since the dawn of photography.

There are a few different ways to get image size that you want. The first one is to use the crop tool in Elements. You should be able to enter the height & width that you want. Then when you drag the crop tool over the image, it will be constrained to the size/ratio that you entered.

Another way to do it, would be to create a new canvas that is the size (and resolution) that you want. Then open the image, select all and copy. Go back to your new canvas and paste the image into it. (or do a drag & drop). Then you can move the image around and resize if needed, until you get the crop that you want. If you don't want white borders on the edges, you will have to crop part of the image off...that's just how it goes.

Of course, you could stretch the image to fit...but that will also distort the image, which you probably don't want.

So, if I am printing on 8.5 by 11 paper, and I'd ideally like to have a 1/4 or 1/2 inch border evenly on all sides, what would I make the new canvas size and what would I set the resolution to for a nice quality print? Sorry, math was never my forte.........

 

[allthingsapple]

8.5x11=17:22. 2:3=6x9 or 8x12. Take the longest pixel edge (height) divide by 22, then multiply by 17. That's your printable width in pixels. How you scale it physically, for printing is up to you.

PASM--I feel like you have very good info here, but with all apologies, I cannot make any sense of it. Is it possible for you to re-say this on a beginner level? My main question is what I posed back to PASM (above). Of course, maybe you're answering this and I just don't see it. Sorry for being such a dunce about this.............

 

[PASM]

8.5x11 with a 1/2 inch border = 8x10.5 printable area. At 300 dpi you will require an image that is 2400x3150 pixels (centered). At 150 dpi you can do it with 1200x1575 pixels.

Mike's advice is the key once you have calculated your available pixel width.

1.take your longest edge (2:3 that's your height if its portrait or or width 3:2 if its landscape format)

2. divide this number by 22. Then mulitply that number by 17. that's your other dimension worked out.

3. Create a new blank doc in PS that's that size in pixels.

4. Select your picture, copy it and paste it onto this new, blank (sized for 17:22) doc.

5. move it around to compose the image within this format as you wish.


Post the actual size in pixels of this doc and I can give you the maximum DPI for printing onto 8.5x11 with a 1/2" border. Without knowing it it's impossible to say print at 300dpi or 150 etc.

 

[Big Mike]

So, if I am printing on 8.5 by 11 paper, and I'd ideally like to have a 1/4 or 1/2 inch border evenly on all sides, what would I make the new canvas size and what would I set the resolution to for a nice quality print? Sorry, math was never my forte......

With a 1/2 inch border on all sides, you image area is 7.5" x 10". The common print resolution is 300 pixels per inch.

So in Elements (if it's like Photoshop), click on the crop tool. Then you should be able to enter a size and resolution. Put in 7.5 x 10 and 300 PPI. Then crop the image how you see fit.

Then print it and choose the option to centre the image on the paper.

 

[PASM]

(Windows)
Start > Programmes > Accessories > Calculator

 

[PASM]

Oops my bad. Thanks Mike. I'm off to bed. Too late for this

 

[allthingsapple]

8.5x11 with a 1/2 inch border = 8x10.5 printable area. At 300 dpi you will require an image that is 2400x3150 pixels (centered). At 150 dpi you can do it with 1200x1575 pixels.

Mike's advice is the key once you have calculated your available pixel width.

1.take your longest edge (2:3 that's your height if its portrait or or width 3:2 if its landscape format)

2. divide this number by 22. Then mulitply that number by 17. that's your other dimension worked out.

3. Create a new blank doc in PS that's that size in pixels.

4. Select your picture, copy it and paste it onto this new, blank (sized for 17:22) doc.

5. move it around to compose the image within this format as you wish.


Post the actual size in pixels of this doc and I can give you the maximum DPI for printing onto 8.5x11 with a 1/2" border. Without knowing it it's impossible to say print at 300dpi or 150 etc.

1. When you say take my longest edge, do you mean of the original image? If so, my original image has a width of 3456 pixels and a height of 5184 pixels.............now I divide 5184 by 22? Then multiply by 17? So, I get 235.6 and 4005????

2. Probably not right, but I created a new blank doc using your last post info of 2400 X 3150 pixels. Then I dragged my original image onto it, but the image that moved was huge once it got there......I'm too unfamiliar with Elements to know how to move the image onto the document and have everything be the correct size relative to each other (new blank doc to dragged image). I think I need a drink.........

 

[PASM]

3456x5184 yep that's 3:2

So 5186 divided by 22 = 235.64

235.64 multiplied by 17 = 4006

So an image 3456x4006 is 17:22 ratio which fits exactly a paper 8.5x11" or scaled proportionately within its margins.

 

[PASM]

To print that image file 7.5" x 10" (i.e with a 1/2" border surround) you will need to scale resize the image file down to 2250x3000 pixels to output at 300dpi

Image Size Calculator/Convertor (image sizing calculator)


So.. paste and arrange your image so it's cropped to fit a new/blank doc of 3456x4006. Then resize this to 2250x3000. Print it at 300dpi, centered onto an 8.5"x11" paper. Voila!

 

[allthingsapple]

UGH! I'm just not getting this. I think what I am realizing is that if I want to print my original photo with even 1/4 inch borders all the way around on an 8.5X11 piece of photo paper, it just ain't gonna work......in order to do what I want to do, I'm gonna have to crop it some way and then I lose part of the original image.

So what do other people do whose camera shoots a 3:2 aspect ratio? Crop/resize every image post processing to fit evenly on the paper? Use different sized paper? Avoid printing all together? Deliberately shoot a bigger image than you intend to print in order to allow for loss through cropping/resizing?

I REALLY appreciate your patience and effort...truly! Trust me---it's not you, it's me.....but eventually I will figure this out............I was just trying to get some prints together for some critique this weekend and thought they would look better with all nice and even borders.........

Make mine a double martini!!

 

[PASM]

I'm gonna have to crop it some way and then I lose part of the original image.

Yes..and no. You can print a 2:3 image onto a non 2:3 paper. Just means you'll have different borders top and bottom, compared to the sides. A 2H pencil, a ruler and a craft knife..you can trim it also.

So what do other people do whose camera shoots a 3:2 aspect ratio? Crop/resize every image post processing to fit evenly on the paper? Use different sized paper? Avoid printing all together? Deliberately shoot a bigger image than you intend to print in order to allow for loss through cropping/resizing?

Yes.. 5x7 isn't too much of a compromise though..or use a larger paper and have a slightly bigger border beneath than above. There are 3:2 photopaper sizes too. 10x15cm, 18x27cm, 20x30cm.


anyway..enjoy your Martini..chin chin!

 

[Big Mike]

in order to do what I want to do, I'm gonna have to crop it some way and then I lose part of the original image.

Yes

So what do other people do whose camera shoots a 3:2 aspect ratio? Crop/resize every image post processing to fit evenly on the paper? Use different sized paper? Avoid printing all together? Deliberately shoot a bigger image than you intend to print in order to allow for loss through cropping/resizing?

As I mentioned above...35mm film is also a 2:3 ratio. So probably 95% of photos taken in the 70s, 80s, 90s....was all 3:2....and yes people still made 8x10 prints, 5x7 prints etc.

So yes, when you want to print at a different size/ratio, you will have to crop your image...meaning that you will loose some of your image. That's the way it's always been.

And yes, some of use eventually do figure it out that if we want to make different sized prints, we leave a bit of extra 'space' in our photos to allow for that.