Black and white conversion question

[charlie76]

I assume, like me, most of you began your love of the photographic arts with black and white...I won't go into the mushy philosophical reasons why because we all have our own. But I''m sure we can all appreciate the honesty that only black and white can portray....quite an amazing thing!!

I have a question about greyscale conversion software. I have been coverting with photoshop for years, but folks on here lead me to believe that programs like Silver FX Pro, etc, etc, are "superior"...or can do a better job. Is there any algorithmic benefit to using a non-photoshop software to covert? That is, do other programs maintain the integrity of the image??? Basically....are there any benefits to using these specialized softwares...I see google makes Silver FX Pro????

Any insight would be great. Thanks folks.

 

[480sparky]

It's hard for any software to 'maintain the integrity of the image' when there's no way for it to know what you want the image to look like. Some images are best with soft, gentle gradations in tones. Other have great impact with a harsh, gritty look. It all depends on you.

That said, I prefer the c2g function in GIMP.

 

[charlie76]

Thanks Sparky

 

[Rick58]

I've heard some say Silver Efex is the best thing since sliced bread. Others claim it gives a forced, pretentious look. Maybe somewhere in between. Maybe it's all in the hands of the skilled operator.
I do my conversions in Paintshop pro 5. I aim to produce a "film look" and try to not go over the top with my processing. For my use, I think it does a pretty good job.

 

[PixelRabbit]

Hey Charlie I use Silver Efex for my conversions. I don't like post work much, it needs to go fast and easy or I lose my interest fast. I like it because as Sparky said, some want to be soft, some crisp, some grainy etc... And the presets give me a great jumping off point.

 

[table1349]

Try this and see if it helps before you go spending a bunch of money: Advanced Photoshop Tutorial: Converting to Black and White - photo.net

 

[DSRay]

I assume, like me, most of you began your love of the photographic arts with black and white...I won't go into the mushy philosophical reasons why because we all have our own. But I''m sure we can all appreciate the honesty that only black and white can portray....quite an amazing thing!!

Actually, I take exception to this statement. The reason I, and a lot of others, began our love of photography with black and white is because it was the only medium that was reasonably accessible in regards to cost and chemical processes. I'm sure I shot miles of 35mm Tri-X while I worked on my photography degree but at the same time I was second shooting weddings in color with my department head. Since the clients paid the lab fees, it was economical.

I shot thousands of sheets of 4x5 black and white while learning how to use a view camera because it was cheap but I don't recall any assignment shot in anything other than 'chrome.

Even Ansel Adams started shooting in color as early as 1948 (four years before I was born) and he marveled at color's potential. His biggest problem with color was processing and the stability of the negative, not the fact that it was color.

With the advent of digital photography the color barrier has disappeared entirely and you can not actually photograph in black and white, it needs to be converted to black and white. So how can it be that black and white is more honest than color when it is derived from color? Even if you still shoot black and white film it is technically only a representation of our visual reality and highly manipulated one at that in the case of the zone system.

Modern popular photography actually dates from 1901 with the release of Kodak's Brownie camera, 113 years ago, not much of a history but long enough to establish an almost fanatical paradigm. Digital photography, still in its infancy, will challenge and change that paradigm.

 

[KmH]

The world is not B&W, so B&W an honesty are not synonymous.

Digital camera image sensors cannot see nor record color.
The color of a digital photo has to be interpolated and that interpolation is most often based on a pattern of red, blue, and green colored pixel size squares placed in front the image sensor.
The 'color' of light that hit each pixel is interpolated by a software algorithm that compares the luminosity and pattern of those red, blue, and green colored pixel size squares of some number of pixels adjacent to the pixel whose color is being interpolated.

Back in late 1980's as my then girl friend Robin, her 10 year old son Max, and I were doing our weekly watching old B&W movies on Sunday morning TV, Max asked a valid question based on his understanding of things, "When did the world change to color".

At any rate I do B&W conversions using ACR (Camera Raw/LR), Photoshop's B&W Adjustment layer, Nik and several other B&W conversion software applications.

 

[charlie76]

Thanks to everyone for the feedback. Interesting how discussing black and white and color imagery quickly can develop into a photo-philosophical discussion.

I glanced at the photoshop link...it looks great!! I'll finish it when I have a few minutes. Basically...I think there is no real advantage to using non-photoshop conversion software. In short, anything a specialized black and white software can do...Photoshop can do. At least that's my take.

 

[Ysarex]

Calvin: Dad, how come old photographs are always black and white? Didn't they have color film back then?
Dad: Sure they did. In fact, those old photographs are in color. It's just the world was black and white then.
Calvin: Really?
Dad: Yep. The world didn't turn color until sometime in the 1930s, and it was pretty grainy color for a while, too.
Calvin: That's really weird.
Dad: Well, truth is stranger than fiction.
Calvin: But then why are old paintings in color?! If their world was black and white, wouldn't artists have painted it that way?
Dad: Not necessarily. A lot of great artists were insane.
Calvin: But... but how could they have painted in color anyway? Wouldn't their paints have been shades of gray back then?
Dad: Of course, but they turned colors like everything else did in the '30s.
Calvin: So why didn't old black and white photos turn color too?
Dad: Because they were color pictures of black and white, remember?
--Bill Watterson