d70s vs d80

[NateS]

I have the D70s and I honestly love it. I would never think it necessary to upgrade to a D80 and it's an excellent camera all around and easy to handle/learn. I expect it to be every bit as good as what I need until I someday upgrade to a D300 in a year or two.

 

[dataz722]

Also, is it true that with a firmware update and the d70 basiclly become the same as the d70s or are there other things not included in the firmware?

 

[manaheim]

My experience is relativly low. Years ago I used to use my grandmothers old 35MM SLR. It was about 15 years old at that point and that was probably close to 10 years ago. I took some decent pictures with that.

I have a fair amount of knowledge for someone with my experience. Not alot and I do have ALOT that I still need to learn.

I plan on mostly doing action photos and landscape/wildlife.

Any advice on anything will be great.

Ok. Well, eeeeeeeeeveryone on the forum except me will recommend you save your money for some good glass, because you'll have that forever, yadda yadda...

There's nothing necessarily wrong with that perspective but there are some things to consider.

1. If you buy a DX lens, are you SURE you'll never wind up with a full-frame camera, thus rendering the DX lens much less useful?
2. Do you know enough about what kind of shooting you like to do that you will have invested your money wisely enough to keep you happy for a while? (for example, what if you spend all your money on a 70-200, only to realize that what you really want is a wide angle?)
3. Do you have enough of an eye to really tell the difference between "good" and "bad" glass? Keeping in mind that even "good" glass has issues.

Generally, I recommend people start out with a single flexible "ok quality" lens. My favorite is the 18-135 (for Nikon). It's pretty inexpensive (like $150 at most I believe), has decent optics and has a nice flexible range to allow you to do everything from shoot some decent landscapes to take some pictures at parties and from across the street in the city.

Then, after you shoot with that for a while and one day you go "DAMN! What is that weird color effect on that picture!?" or you go "DAMN! I need a wider lens!" then you go out and invest some money on some killer glass. You'll be far more aware of your actual needs and far more likely to truly be able to appreciate the quality of what you are buying.

Plus, what have you "wasted" at that point? $150? Whoop-de-doo. not to mention, you'll likely still use that lens a lot. I have some specialized glass that I use in key situations, and it's all really good stuff, but by and large I still use my piece of crap 28-100, because it works quite decently and is flexible enough to be the primary lens I keep on the camera.

In fact, I have every intention of replacing that one with an 18-135 just to give me a bit more range, and that's with full knowledge and understanding of the 18-135 limitations.

The flip side of this is the cameras...

The D40/50/60 are ANNOYINGLY limited. 3 focus points? No focus motor? Constantly trying to hold your hand because it thinks yer too much of a noob to handle the basics, etc. Yuck.

Do they work? Yes. Do they absolutely tick me off when trying to use them? Big time. My mother has the D60 (against my recommendations... I told her to go D80), and every time she calls to complain about something that didn't work the way she wanted, it has been because of a fundamental limitation of the lesser camera that she owns.

Yeah, no question you're going to cycle through the bodies more frequently than some good glass, but a lesser body is going to make you cycle through it a lot faster, and you also run the risk of just getting completely annoyed at the thing altogether. Not good when you are trying to learn.

That's my opinion... and as I said, it's not a popular one. YMMV.

 

[Parkerman]

^ Dude, no one said anything about the D40/50/60. Also, the D50 has an internal AF, and 5 focus points.

He wants to know D70 vs D80.. keep it to that.

to the OP, here's a side by side if you wanna check them out.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/compare_post.asp?method=sidebyside&cameras=nikon_d70s%2Cnikon_d80&show=all

 

[manaheim]

^ Dude, no one said anything about the D40/50/60. Also, the D50 has an internal AF, and 5 focus points.

He wants to know D70 vs D80.. keep it to that.

to the OP, here's a side by side if you wanna check them out.

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/compare_post.asp?method=sidebyside&cameras=nikon_d70s%2Cnikon_d80&show=all

He didn't ask about a D90 either, but you suggested that.

I also didn't ask for your governance of my posts, so please feel free to not offer that either.

EDIT: BTW, (for the benefit of the OP) Sorry about the D40-60 comment. I actually got my wires crossed and thought I was talking about that... I WAS discussing it in another thread. Still, I think the info is handy if you decide to start considering the other sub-bodies, and it is a logical thing to do, so I left it in tact. Parkerman's comment was correct, I got us off on a tangent... I just thought his remark to be about it was less than neighborly.

EDIT ctd: I actually didn't know the 50 had 5 points. That's wacky. I made the assumption that it only had 3 since the 60 and 40 do. Nikon's numbering and product design behavior outside of the main bodies really makes your head spin sometimes.

 

[dataz722]

Thank you. That was really alot of help!

Ok. Well, eeeeeeeeeveryone on the forum except me will recommend you save your money for some good glass, because you'll have that forever, yadda yadda...

There's nothing necessarily wrong with that perspective but there are some things to consider.

1. If you buy a DX lens, are you SURE you'll never wind up with a full-frame camera, thus rendering the DX lens much less useful?
2. Do you know enough about what kind of shooting you like to do that you will have invested your money wisely enough to keep you happy for a while? (for example, what if you spend all your money on a 70-200, only to realize that what you really want is a wide angle?)
3. Do you have enough of an eye to really tell the difference between "good" and "bad" glass? Keeping in mind that even "good" glass has issues.

1) I know some but not nearly as much as I need to and this is especially true when it comes to lenses. So I really dont know what a DX lens is and what the difference is and also a full frame camera vs a normal camera... so sorry but i really cant answer that. But if someone wouldnt mind explaining it to me a little more it would be greatly appreciated.

2) I think I do know what I will mainly be shooting. I really have no interest in portrates or anything like that. I really like action shots and would probably be doing that primarily and I think I would probably need a decent zoom as opposed to something more wide.

3) Plain and simple.... NO I really do not at all.


Also, I have been considering three different things.

1) The D80 new with the 15-135 ED $999.99
2) The D80 new with 18-55 VR, 55-200 G, cheap little bag, and a DVD... which is also $999.99
3) A used D70/D70s which would probably run me 300-400 then 1 or 2 decent lenses.

My only thing with this is that typically I dont have a problem buying things used but with this I am a little aprehensive. Also if I get the D80 new I can get the extended warranty will will cover anything that could happen to it, and I will get free cleanings. Also another thing I REALLY like about the extended warranty is that if in 3 years when the D80 has been discontinued and mine broke they would actually give me a brand new one of the current equivalent.

I think once all is said and done I will probably be paying about the same no matter which route I take but if I take the D70 I would have my choice in lenses and I MIGHT be more happy with those for longer but as manaheim said above I really might not be.


I guess from here I need to decide which lenses I would get if I got the D70 and price those out.

Is there anything else I am over looking or anyting else I should consider?

 

[dataz722]

Another thing, albeit minor... but how does the battery life of the two compare?

 

[Parkerman]

He didn't ask about a D90 either, but you suggested that.

It will be replacing the D80 though, so it has relevance.

 

[dataz722]

Thank you for all the advise so far and hopefully alot more to come but can you guys please quit arguing.

It was an honest mistake by manaheim and I saw it but just ignored it. So parker can you please just let it go. Thank you.

 

[Parkerman]

Thank you for all the advise so far and hopefully alot more to come but can you guys please quit arguing.

It was an honest mistake by manaheim and I saw it but just ignored it. So parker can you please just let it go. Thank you.

What you need to do is figure out what you want as far as lenses go. No one can tell you that, its something you gotta figure out on your own once you buy a camera. You may learn that you like telephoto over macro... or maybe you end up liking wide angle shots, that is all up to you.

I personally don't like the D80, I don't think its worth it at all. I had looked into getting one, I shoot with the D40, but.. It really didn't offer much more for the price. I've heard alot of people not care much for the D80, but i hear alot of good about the D70, probably because it can be had for cheaper and is just as good of a camera. Remember.. Megapixels do not matter.

 

[Ed.]

The D70 has Compact Flash Cards not SD.

Correct.

On my last trip i shot everything in RAW (NEF) on a 4 gig compact flash card.

another 4 and 1 gig in the bag.

and i streched about 720 shots off of it.


the D70 is an excellent camera, I bought my current on in Jan 08 for 500, it was a almost never used backup, in prestine condition with all extra's (no lens). I would reccomend trying to find one with a low shutter accuation count.

the only 2 things i would have liked to have on this cam (bigger LCD) NEED!

and possibly better noise handleing at higher ISO, but we all want that out of cheaper DSLR's. (Duh!)

 

[dataz722]

Ok, as of right now I am leaning more towards a lens with a decent zoom and a decent macro lens. As I said above I know very little about lenses and wouldnt know a good one from a bad one. I know the lower the f speed the better and that with nikon I want to look for ED glass (and even those I dont know but believe to be true) but thats about it. So with that would anyone be able to point me in the right direction of a decent zoom lens and maybe a macro as well but hopefully under the $400 range.

 

[K_Pugh]

I've had a D70 and i now have a D80. I prefer the D80 by quite a lot actually.

More megapixels a gimmick? granted 6mp may be all you really need for adequate sized prints but the extra 4mp will give you more options with PP, cropping, printing etc.

The D80 is around 3FPS and in RAW you only get 3 shots off before you run out of buffer so it starts to slow.. if i remember the D70 is 5FPS and seems to be able to get off more shots before slowing.

The D80 i think just feels better - button are similarly laid out but have the edge i think.

The Auto-ISO feature on the D80 is really handy, too.

Did the D70 have a battery grip? i don't think it did have when i had mine.. having the advantage of a vertical grip and extra battery really helps, plus it makes it a lot bulkier so don't worry about a small camera (being the D80)..

I find the sensor/metering of the D80 to be much better, more manageable and slightly less prone to overexposure.. perhaps it's just me?

The noise levels in higher ISO's is better with the D80, i hardly ever use noise reduction in PP, whereas in the D70 i almost always had to.

Just a few observations/opinions of mine having owned both.. hope it helps.

 

[Samriel]

Really? The 18-70 kit lens gets a really good name and I'd heard Tamron felt kinda cheaply constructed.

Tamrons tend to be cheaply constructed (a lot of plastic), but it doesn't apply to all of their lenses. You'll find many people in love with their Tamron 17-50mm f2.8, and for a reason. It is a good lens for a decent price.
The Nikon 18-70mm is of course also a good lens (especially for a kit lens), and you'll have to decide if you prefer the extra f-stop of the Tamron, or the extra reach and slightly lower price of the 18-70mm.

 

[manaheim]

What you need to do is figure out what you want as far as lenses go. No one can tell you that, its something you gotta figure out on your own once you buy a camera. You may learn that you like telephoto over macro... or maybe you end up liking wide angle shots, that is all up to you.

This is why I recommend that 18-135... this early on you may not know, but this lens gives you a bit of play while you figure it out.

I personally don't like the D80, I don't think its worth it at all. I had looked into getting one, I shoot with the D40, but.. It really didn't offer much more for the price. I've heard alot of people not care much for the D80, but i hear alot of good about the D70, probably because it can be had for cheaper and is just as good of a camera. Remember.. Megapixels do not matter.

Really? I've never heard a soul complain about the D80 unless they were someone who had a D200 or D300. The D80 is really the best Nikon camera you can get in the sub-body lineup. Would I want one? No, not really... but I have a D300. Would I buy one if I couldn't swing a 200 or 300? Sure. It's a great camera.

"Megapixels don't matter" is overgeneralizing things a bit. It's not like having extra megapixels is going to make your images better, and you can most certainly blow up even a 6MP image to really big sizes and be very pleased with the results...

However... if you have more MP, you have more room to crop and still have a "big" image to work from, and certainly, if you have more dots, you have more information... more information means when you blow that picture up you will have less noticable pixelation.

This is, of course, keeping in mind that people do crazy stuff like print billboards from 3MP images and stuff. The further away you stand, the less you can see them BIG DOTS.

So yeah, MP does matter, but it's not going to kill anyone to have a camera with less under most circumstances.

Correct.

On my last trip i shot everything in RAW (NEF) on a 4 gig compact flash card.

another 4 and 1 gig in the bag.

and i streched about 720 shots off of it.

You just reminded me... I fired up the D100 I have with the 1 gig card and in JPEG fine it gets 300+ pictures. (and it always reports less than it gets in practice by 10-20% or so) That means for a 2 gig card on a D70 you would get 600+ easily. RAW is 102 on the 1 gig, so 200+ on the 2 gig.

Whee, it's fun turning on my D100. I love this old thing. :hug::


the D70 is an excellent camera, I bought my current on in Jan 08 for 500, it was a almost never used backup, in prestine condition with all extra's (no lens). I would reccomend trying to find one with a low shutter accuation count.

the only 2 things i would have liked to have on this cam (bigger LCD) NEED!

and possibly better noise handleing at higher ISO, but we all want that out of cheaper DSLR's. (Duh!)[/quote]

I think the D70S has a larger LCD than the D70. Not that you would go out and buy one, but someone buying one fresh should definitely lean towards the D70S over the straight D70.