Focus wildlife

[Timppa]

little addition to the active D lighting,
This only effects in JPEG (right?). I shoot mostly in JPEG+RAW, and then select what I would like to tweak or just keep in jpeg.
My main goal overtime is actually to go more away from the RAW (opposite of most people?), and trying to get better results with JPEG, because I want to spend more time in the field and less on the computer.
But first things first, the reason of this topic, getting the focus right

 

[ac12]

I see a possible flaw in U2
With spot metering, you need to put the metering spot on the bird.
If the bird is in the top right quarter of the frame, were is the spot meter; on the bird in the top right, or in the center of the frame were the bird isn't ?
I do not know, as I have not plotted the meter pattern on my camera, with an off center focus point. I suspect spot is in the center of the frame, and does not follow the AF, but I may be totally wrong. I would have to do a test plot to determine this.

If you look in the manual I believe with the D7100 the spot meter will follow the focus point. Check it out, don't quote a Canon user. lol

Not a Canon user.
I just had not absorbed everything in my Nikon manual. I have to go back and read it every other month or so, and look for stuff that I had missed before. My senior citizen head, does not absorb stuff like it used to.

I just looked at the manual for my D7200. It gets more complicated, in the IF section.

Spot: Camera meters circle centered on current focus point, making it possible to meter off-center subjects (if non-CPU lens is used or if auto-area AF is in effect, camera will meter center focus point)​

So if you select D9, D21, D51, or 3D, you should be OK.​

 

[Timppa]

I see a possible flaw in U2
With spot metering, you need to put the metering spot on the bird.
If the bird is in the top right quarter of the frame, were is the spot meter; on the bird in the top right, or in the center of the frame were the bird isn't ?
I do not know, as I have not plotted the meter pattern on my camera, with an off center focus point. I suspect spot is in the center of the frame, and does not follow the AF, but I may be totally wrong. I would have to do a test plot to determine this.

If you look in the manual I believe with the D7100 the spot meter will follow the focus point. Check it out, don't quote a Canon user. lol

Not a Canon user.
I just had not absorbed everything in my Nikon manual. I have to go back and read it every other month or so, and look for stuff that I had missed before. My senior citizen head, does not absorb stuff like it used to.

I just looked at the manual for my D7200. It gets more complicated, in the IF section.

Spot: Camera meters circle centered on current focus point, making it possible to meter off-center subjects (if non-CPU lens is used or if auto-area AF is in effect, camera will meter center focus point)​

So if you select D9, D21, D51, or 3D, you should be OK.​

more complicated? It sounds more clear!

 

[ac12]

I see a possible flaw in U2
With spot metering, you need to put the metering spot on the bird.
If the bird is in the top right quarter of the frame, were is the spot meter; on the bird in the top right, or in the center of the frame were the bird isn't ?
I do not know, as I have not plotted the meter pattern on my camera, with an off center focus point. I suspect spot is in the center of the frame, and does not follow the AF, but I may be totally wrong. I would have to do a test plot to determine this.

If you look in the manual I believe with the D7100 the spot meter will follow the focus point. Check it out, don't quote a Canon user. lol

Not a Canon user.
I just had not absorbed everything in my Nikon manual. I have to go back and read it every other month or so, and look for stuff that I had missed before. My senior citizen head, does not absorb stuff like it used to.

I just looked at the manual for my D7200. It gets more complicated, in the IF section.

Spot: Camera meters circle centered on current focus point, making it possible to meter off-center subjects (if non-CPU lens is used or if auto-area AF is in effect, camera will meter center focus point)​

So if you select D9, D21, D51, or 3D, you should be OK.​

more complicated? It sounds more clear!

What I meant is that the IFs mean I have to remember an exception to an already complicated camera.

BTW, I strongly suggest that you test the spot meter function on YOUR camera.
It did not seem to work as I thought it would when I used it. I hope mine is not faulty.

 

[Timppa]

so, yesterday evening I went testing with these settings.
I noticed that, when it comes to focusing, I am having a lot less issues! more pictures I had good focus then before.
However, when the bird came suddenly flying closer towards me, I struggled to keep it in focus and missed some shots. I believe the error is probably on my side, I just need more practice.

BUT, when it comes to getting the exposure right, its not so great yet.
ok, the scenery was a bit tricky, lower light hitting the trees, some in shadow, some bright of the sun. the lake and the sky were bright. So I did not expect to get the exposure perfect every time, but I seem to miss it often.

When it comes to birds on land,
first settings I used are matrix +0.3 EV.
This actually seemed to work the best, if I kept the EV at 0, then I found it was a bit under exposed.
When a bird in flight landed and I forgot to change my settings, I was still in spot mode, all the exposures were bad.
center weighted meting I did not test with birds on land.

BIF,
started off with spot + 0.3 EV.
for me, this was the worst thing ever... (funfact: the word 'worst', means 'sausage' in dutch)
I never seem to get anything good, I was following the bird, If I aimed correctly, spot right on the bird, the bird and the sky are fully blown up. If i was next to the bird, on the sky, the scene was dark, very very dark...
I should have kept it on the bird and put EV-0.3 perhaps? I tried, same results, felt like it didn't do anything.

Alright, I switched to center weighted measuring.
This was the option I used a lot in the past, but again, the results were mixed. I always kept the bird in the center so this metering would work best and I was practicing anyway, but I soon discarded this option.

I went to matrix meting, now here is got a bit more interesting! If the BIF was in front of trees or the lake, it seemed to do alright, it needed the +0.3 EV, but mostly, ok pictures, not always spot on, but I was more pleased.
But as soon I go into the sky, it all blew up again or all dark, and that actually surprised me, because if it is measuring the scene and it has mostly sky, wouldn't it be generally all dark pictures? Technically when the bird goes there I should just crank up the EV to +1 or even +2. didn't to the trick, at all. confused me!

Then i started looking into the back button on the camera 'AE-L AF-L'.
one of the options is AE-lock (hold).
I kind of liked that, you focus on a area where the bird is, get a good exposure and then lock it in, and start grabbing pictures right?
So i checked the manual,
It says the same like it says on my camera:
*Exposure locks when theA AE-L/AF-L button is pressed, and remains locked until the button is pressed a second time or the standby timer expires*
How long is the standby timer? I found out you can adjust it in your settings! yay!
how do I know if its locked or not? no idea...
Then I noticed at another place in the manual, that this also doesn't work good with matrix meting, only with spot and center weighted...

Anyway, here is my conclusion of my test shots, feel free to comment on it, and on my way of working.
I changed the BIF setting to matrix meting and lowered aperture from 11 to 9

Here are some pictures that came out alright yesterday;
just slightly edited or not at all, and cropped. (btw, if someone could help with the name of that bird of prey, would be a great help )

Hiunjärvi

Hiunjärvi

Hiunjärvi

Hiunjärvi

Hiunjärvi

 

[Overread]

A quick thought - subjects moving toward or away from the camera is basically one of the most challenging things for AF systems to work with. Fast moving subjects coming toward the camera put even top end cameras at their limits and thus its going to highlight any mistake in user control and use even more. Even so with good control and settings and light don't be shocked if some shots coming toward you fail.

 

[ZombiesniperJr]

Bird of prey looks like a Marsh harrier.

 

[Timppa]

A quick thought - subjects moving toward or away from the camera is basically one of the most challenging things for AF systems to work with. Fast moving subjects coming toward the camera put even top end cameras at their limits and thus its going to highlight any mistake in user control and use even more. Even so with good control and settings and light don't be shocked if some shots coming toward you fail.

Ok, good to know it is not just all me , but I am up to the challenge ^^

Bird of prey looks like a Marsh harrier.

Thanks!

 

[birdbonkers84]

Hey,

I used to have the Nikon D7100 either with the Tamron 150-600mm (G1) or my Nikon AF-S 300mm f/4 D lens.

When I shot with the Nikon D7100 with my Tamron I would normally photograph birds in flight either at f/6.3 or f/8, mainly due to f/8 being the Tamron's sweet sport for sharpness, but with my Nikon AF-S 300mm f/4 D it's pretty much at maximum sharpness at f/5.6.

My settings with the D7100 would be, back button focusing (I would suggest you look it up as it is very helpful).
I would shoot in Aperture Priority mode (f6.3 or f/8 on the Tamron)
Set to Auto ISO with the minimum shutter speed set to 1/2000 for BIFs.
I would use AF-C with single point

I did find when I had my D7100 that when it came to focusing on small birds in trees or on a fence it did struggle to lock focus from a distance. Would hunt for focus a lot.

For BiFs its just practice, lots and lots of practicing panning and tracking. When I'm photographing seabirds I watch their flight patterns, which makes it a lot easier to track them through your viewfinder.

The D7100 + Tamron was a weighty set-up for hand held, especially holding it for long periods of time, if you're finding it's getting heavy them I would maybe look into a monopod or gimbal as you'll certainly miss a lot of shots if your arms are getting tired.

Hope this helps.

 

[Timppa]

Alright, A small update:

In the meantime I have upgraded to a D7500 camera
So far I am really happy with it! A lot more then the D7100 I was using.
I actually lowered my speed for birds in rest to a minimum of 1/200. And I can take good pictures a lot better, because the D7500 has 8fps and awesome buffer! ( D7100 has horrible buffer).
So out of every burst, I get some good sharp ones. I really see this as an impossible thing on the D7100.
Also, I have taken sharp pictures (1 or 2 out of 8-10 burst) at 1/60 of a second... at 500mm!
I also have a grp (group) focus now, It seems to work better somehow.
And I have not done BIF yet, but I really want to try with the 3d tracking, I read good reviews that it is a lot more improved since my old model.

 

[MSnowy]

1 or 2 out of 8-10 isn’t bad if you’ve shooting 1/60 at 500 handheld

 

[Overread]

1 or 2 out of 8-10 isn’t bad if you’ve shooting 1/60 at 500 handheld

Fully agreed, esp as at 1/60sec you're also heavily reliant on the subject remaining perfectly still as well. A fast burst can let you catch those few rare moments when bird and lens are perfectly still enough to get a sharp shot.

Whilst its not "ideal" its certainly a practical approach to shooting in challenging/low light situations where you might not have any more aperture to open up and when you don't want to crank the ISO up super high.

 

[Timppa]

1 or 2 out of 8-10 isn’t bad if you’ve shooting 1/60 at 500 handheld

exactly :O, and it also means 1 or 2 pictures every second because of the 8fps.
I also had a sharp one at 1/40, but I was pushing it.
The 1/60th pic was a woodpecker in a darker forest.

This is a big crop of it, the bird was so far xD

Black woodpecker

This was at 1/40

Teijo National Park

 

[Timppa]

Fully agreed, esp as at 1/60sec you're also heavily reliant on the subject remaining perfectly still as well. A fast burst can let you catch those few rare moments when bird and lens are perfectly still enough to get a sharp shot.

True, and 6fps on a d7100 with basically no buffer is just not enough for this kind of action.
the 8fps and awesome buffer on D7500 is really hitting the sweet spot
I can imagine how great the D500 is with 10fps!

Whilst its not "ideal" its certainly a practical approach to shooting in challenging/low light situations where you might not have any more aperture to open up and when you don't want to crank the ISO up super high.

I put the limit mostly at 3200 ISO, on a dx camera the noise gets up high fast.

 

[greybeard]

I've had my best luck with BIF with my D7500 set to Shutter priority 1/1000, Auto ISO. I have a Tamron 150-600 and I also have a Nikon 300 f/4. I like using Shutter priority because Manual at times the ISO can't go low enough for f/4-1/1000 sec. and I end up over exposing. The Tamron has more reach but, the 300 f/4 is sharper and focuses faster and with the 1.4 teleconverter has plenty of reach.