HDR photography101, 201, 401 + Why does canon hate Auto Exposure Bracketing?

[Arch]

Well, i think you're right when you say it comes down to your personal taste and view of HDR photography, imo i don't really like the resulting image he takes at 8.55, for me photography has always been about capturing light... the differences between light and dark, the contrast if you like, when viewing an image and the way the light falls, is what makes an image. I find his example here way too much of the same tonal range which reduces the drama of the image considerably.

He seems good at what he does tho, im not knocking it, its just the first thing i noticed when watching this video is that he is not using any filters on his lens. This is the reason i knew he would be shooting multipul exposures, if you have a bare lens in a contrasty scene you have little other choice.

I would personally give my right arm to be in his location but with a series of ND and ND Grad filters.

 

[Cheex]

OP, amen.


I fully agree with you and enjoyed your post. If Mark iii doesn't include AEB up to at least 9 shots I'm going Nikon and never looking back. I got to play with a d700 the other day and absolutely loved it... It made me regret every penny I've put into my canon lenses. No more spinning the dial, no more deleting extra exposures when I get back for PP and most importantly, no more missing the shot.


I've spent a lot of time researching and learning HDR. It's the whole reason I'm still into photography. I go out and expect to capture what I see with my $1000 camera... I remember coming home from my first trip with my SLR and being extremely disappointed because the pictures looked nothing like what I had seen. The truth is that in many scenarios, cameras are unable to capture the scene as seen. HDR has been the perfect tool to overcome the fact that cameras do not work like the human eye. [attempting to bash me about not understanding the exposure triangle here would be to miss the point that cameras do not work like the human eye.]


The people who have mentioned that the purpose of bracketing is to help capture the correct exposure are correct but also very stuck. Tools like EB can evolve and take on new functionality. To deny the user the ability to take advantage of these tools is a crippling blow to not only our creative desires but also to the development of the field as a whole...


I don't want to defend or sell HDR photography any more than I have to any of the darkroom heroes here lurking the boards. The most important fact I want to bring to the table is that HDR photography is enjoyable to me, the op and thousands of other enthusiasts. I mean it. I really enjoy HDR photography! I just want Canon to help facilitate my enjoyment by allowing me to access features other similar products offer. Canon can go on and think it is "simply a passing fad" or "a low priority" but for many of us it will only mean then they will lose business.

 

[manaheim]

[edit]

Ugh... I really can't believe this but somehow you got under my skin and so I have to reply to this where I really should just laugh and move on.

I was trying not to credential myself, but fine... I've been a photographer for about 10 years, about 8 years professionally. I use and sell HDRs as part of my portfolio... both professionally and artistically, though it is not something I do frequently because it is not necessary in most circumstances for what either I or my customers need.

I have rather pointedly researched this AEB thing, much like everything in photography I have learned. That is through speaking with quite a few professionals, and even speaking with a couple photography professors. Oh and yes, I googled. However, I consider google to be a little less authoritative than seasoned professionals, since the internet is full of all kinds of people doing some fairly crazy things.

Oh... and I also researched it in my own camera manuals.

Bracketing
The D100 offers three types of bracketing: exposure bracketing, flash bracketing,
and white balance bracketing. In exposure bracketing, the camera
varies exposure compensation with each shot, while in the case of flash bracketing,flash exposure compensation (flash level; 102) is varied with each shot. In both cases, only one photograph is produced each time the shutterrelease button is pressed. Several shots (from two to three) are therefore required to complete the bracketing sequence. Exposure compensation and flash bracketing are recommended in situations in which you find it difficult to set exposure and yet do not have time to check the results and adjust settings with each shot.
In white balance bracketing, the camera creates multiple images each time the shutter is released, each with a different white balance adjustment (50). Only one shot is required to complete the bracketing sequence. White balance bracketing is recommended when shooting under mixed lighting or when you want to experiment with different white balance settings. White balance bracketing is not available at image qualities of NEF (Raw) or Comp. NEF (Raw).

The D300 manual said the same thing, as did the D3 manual. I suppose Canon might say something different, but I'm not going to go download it.

AEB was not intended for HDR. It was created to allow you to take a few shots quickly to ensure you had the right exposure of the scene in question. It's a CYA feature.

Can it be used for HDR? Sure. However, the really good photographers I know poo-poo it because it takes control out of their hands, and generally I find that better photographers used automated features less. I poo-poo it for the same reason. It just doesn't buy me anything, and in some cases it doesn't work as well as if I do it by hand.

Think of it this way... you can use a screwdriver to bang in a nail, but that doesn't mean it was intended for that purpose. Or more appropriately, in this case... you can use a ROCK to bang in a nail...

Do you have cause to be displeased at Canon for limiting something you use? I suppose so. I can't outright say you're wrong, because hey... maybe that rock you are using is very effective, or fits your hand a bit better than a hammer... and hey... Van Gogh was considered a hack in his time. Maybe you're the next one. Who knows. However, your position that they are gimping serious HDR photographers everywhere is an opinion like everyone else's, and as an experienced photographer I can tell you that your opinion is not widely shared with folks who I have found to be successful in this space.

 

[480sparky]

Well, as we can all see, Rotinamod is the Supreme Photographer in the entire universe, and the rest of us are just mindless dopeheads who can't keep up with his superior intellect.

Please don't tell him the sky is blue..... he'll dismiss the suggestion and the rantings of a lunatic who doesn't have the sense to tip your head back and open your eyes.

 

[GeorgieGirl]

Include me among the faction that thinks Canon ought to include a larger bracketing range in their next edition; its quite a convenience feature. I happen to like power windows and power seats in my vehicles. Will the car run without those features and get me where I want to go, of course. Does it make me a better driver if I have or don't have them? Of course not.

Is it need to have. No
Is it nice to have. Yes.

This much ire over a desire for a simple convenience feature on a camera??? I mean really...

 

[SlickSalmon]

Include me among the faction that thinks Canon ought to include a larger bracketing range in their next edition; its quite a convenience feature. I happen to like power windows and power seats in my vehicles. Will the car run without those features and get me where I want to go, of course. Does it make me a better driver if I have or don't have them? Of course not.

Is it need to have. No
Is it nice to have. Yes.

This much ire over a desire for a simple convenience feature on a camera??? I mean really...

Bravo!

 

[Bynx]

Include me among the faction that thinks Canon ought to include a larger bracketing range in their next edition; its quite a convenience feature. I happen to like power windows and power seats in my vehicles. Will the car run without those features and get me where I want to go, of course. Does it make me a better driver if I have or don't have them? Of course not.

Is it need to have. No
Is it nice to have. Yes.

This much ire over a desire for a simple convenience feature on a camera??? I mean really...

Isnt this what the whole thread is about? Ditto the Bravo.

 

[Compaq]

Clever word play, "Dominator".

Keep your opinion, but you've met some people who disagree with you - and some who agrees with you. Sure, it could be nice. But as Manaheim pointed out, a tool that fits your hand nicely, perhaps won't fit everyone else's.

Seriously, dude, what's up with the attitude?

 

[Majeed Badizadegan]

I mentioned the Nikon D7000 in my OP, that it was a shame that it only does 3 AEB. Hell, if it met my needs I would already own it, for all it's other great features. 3 AEB sadly was a deal-killer for me. I found this article highly relevant to the topic at hand, and for those in doubt, another professional insistent on the merit and utility of AEB: High Dynamic Range Imaging » Blog Archive » Nikon D7000 HDR

 

[Bynx]

This is another method to do HDR shooting with the D7000...

As D7000 owners know, bracketing is limited to three frames. Three frames spaced 2EV apart is probably adequate for most scenes, but sometimes you need more. I would like to share my method of shooting 5- and 9-frame brackets. This method makes use of User modes U1 and U2.

 After the initial setup (explained below), WHICH YOU ONLY DO ONCE, shooting an HDR is simple. You only need to make three quick adjustments to your camera before shooting:
(1) set the Mode to A
(2) set the Release mode to CH
(3) set Bracketing to 3F in 1.0 EV increments.



To set up U1 and U2 for a 9-frame bracket spaced 1 EV apart (YOU ONLY DO THIS ONCE):


* Set mode dial to A (Aperture priority)

* Set Shutter release mode = CH (continuous high speed)

* Custom setting e6 -> Bracketing order = Under, Meter, Over

* ISO = Auto

* Bracketing = 3F in 1.0 EV increments

* turn the Exposure comp dial to -3 EV

* Setup Menu -> Save user settings -> U1

* turn the Exposure comp dial to +3EV

* Setup Menu -> Save user settings -> U2


You are done setting up U1 and U2. Be sure to set Exposure comp dial back to 0 EV, set bracketing to 0F, and set the Shutter release mode to whatever you normally keep it at.



Now say you stumble on a scene that calls for HDR. 

(1) Set the Mode to A

(2) set Bracketing to 3F in 1.0 EV increments

(3) set the release mode to CH.


Now press the shutter release button three times:


(1) once with Mode dial set to U1

(2) once with Mode dial set to A

(3) once with Mode dial set to U2


This creates nine exposures in the following order (relative to normal exposure):


-4EV -3EV -2EV -1EV 0EV +1EV +2EV +3EV +4EV


After shooting, review the histograms and possibly select a subset of the nine shots, deleting others.


The procedure is similar for setting up a 5-frame bracket, and is easy to figure out once you understand the 9-frame setup.

 

[Majeed Badizadegan]

This is another method to do HDR shooting with the D7000...

As D7000 owners know, bracketing is limited to three frames. Three frames spaced 2EV apart is probably adequate for most scenes, but sometimes you need more. I would like to share my method of shooting 5- and 9-frame brackets. This method makes use of User modes U1 and U2.

 After the initial setup (explained below), WHICH YOU ONLY DO ONCE, shooting an HDR is simple. You only need to make three quick adjustments to your camera before shooting:
(1) set the Mode to A
(2) set the Release mode to CH
(3) set Bracketing to 3F in 1.0 EV increments.



To set up U1 and U2 for a 9-frame bracket spaced 1 EV apart (YOU ONLY DO THIS ONCE):


* Set mode dial to A (Aperture priority)

* Set Shutter release mode = CH (continuous high speed)

* Custom setting e6 -> Bracketing order = Under, Meter, Over

* ISO = Auto
* Bracketing = 3F in 1.0 EV increments

* turn the Exposure comp dial to -3 EV

* Setup Menu -> Save user settings -> U1

* turn the Exposure comp dial to +3EV

* Setup Menu -> Save user settings -> U2


You are done setting up U1 and U2. Be sure to set Exposure comp dial back to 0 EV, set bracketing to 0F, and set the Shutter release mode to whatever you normally keep it at.



Now say you stumble on a scene that calls for HDR. 

(1) Set the Mode to A

(2) set Bracketing to 3F in 1.0 EV increments

(3) set the release mode to CH.


Now press the shutter release button three times:


(1) once with Mode dial set to U1

(2) once with Mode dial set to A

(3) once with Mode dial set to U2


This creates nine exposures in the following order (relative to normal exposure):


-4EV -3EV -2EV -1EV 0EV +1EV +2EV +3EV +4EV


After shooting, review the histograms and possibly select a subset of the nine shots, deleting others.


The procedure is similar for setting up a 5-frame bracket, and is easy to figure out once you understand the 9-frame setup.

Thanks for sharing your workaround in detail Bynx. This is bound to help somebody in the future and I'm sure they'll appreciate it. Since you shoot the D7k, you understand the Canon shooter's pain (given that almost all Canon shooters are forced to do something like this with comparable C1, C2, C3 buttons).

I mean, gosh, the D7000 is a beautiful camera and it's really too bad they cut something like AEB to keep the D300s at least somewhat relevant.

Although your method is a viable workaround, I'm sure you're fully aware that it is not the same as firing off 5-9 consecutive shots with AEB, using a 2 second timer and only pressing the shutter once. Thus the time lost while messing with dials while shooting fast moving scenes (clouds, etc) and camera shake issues are more of a possible issue.

 

[Bynx]

Youre absolutely right about the time to turn the dial to the 3 settings and clicking the shutter 3 times. Its about as efficient as doing it all manually. It is quicker, however it wont stop ghosting of any moving objects.

 

[GeorgieGirl]

I appreaciate the work-around and will adapt it to my Canon. Thanks a bunch.

 

[FlyingScot]

Think of it this way... you can use a screwdriver to bang in a nail, but that doesn't mean it was intended for that purpose. Or more appropriately, in this case... you can use a ROCK to bang in a nail...

AH BUT as any professional joiner will tell you you use a hammer to bang in a screw the slot is only for taking it out!!!!

I really can believe the venom being spouted here however one thing does puzzle me since it is so obvious that a Nikon is much better for this sort of photography why piss into the wind about a Canon not being so well specified - if this is your forte change your camera to the one that does what you want better/easier. Going back to the good old days out and about it was a motorised Nikon 35mm with a 250 bulk film back and in the studio it was a Hasselblad with film and Polaroid backs now both would have done the others job but with a bit of hassel and being a professional and a lazy one too one chose the best tool for the job. So while i find this thread interesting i am not convinced that it is not just a rant at Cannon which i find difficult to comprehend as speaking to Canon direct 'could be' much more productive. And if two people do this - then they might think.......but if just a hundred or even a thousand people do this then they might notice and make the changes you want to the firmware in their camera. There you go start The Canon HDR Movement and see what/where that gets you - posting here is obviously highly frustrating for you as few seem to get the point you are making OR read your first posts and reply in a sensible manner.

 

[pen]

I got about half way through this thread. Except for only a couple people on here I'm wondering what the average age of the people posting here are. My guess on closing the OP is under 16.

Grow up people, I'm sure none of you would talk to each other in person this way.

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