HDR questions

[BradUF]

Will HDR not work with film?

 

[lextalionis]

Use photomatix. It's alot easier, and gives better results.

I agree. I'm a very seasoned PS user and I have the latest version and even today, I can't achieve what I can achieve with Photomatix, plus I save a whole lot of time.

I wrote up a detailed tutorial here: Photomatix HDR Tutorial

-Roy

 

[dklod]

My camera can not shoot in raw, but it can shoot in TIFF. Although the obvious difference is the file size (almost 10x more than a jpeg), to be honest, I can not tell the difference between them. Everyone is talking about converting to TIFF so Im obviously better off shooting in this mode. HDR images have facinated me since I have delved deeper into the photographic relm, and even though I have many pictures that I have taken using bracketing (hand held most of them) to get the best exposure, I have yet to attempt to produce an HDR from them mainly because I get halfway through a tutorial and it all seems too hard or I could not be bothered at that time. I am currently waiting for perfect conditions to produce my first HDR of an old church a couple of kms from me. It seems Im always at work on those perfect days.

 

[lextalionis]

lextalionis, have you tried Essential HDR. Which do you like better, Essential HDR or Photomatix?

I have yet to try Essential HDR and I suppose if I shot for HDR at least 10% of the time I would try it, but I see HDR in my work holding at about 2%.

-Roy

 

[KhronoS]

Hi there.
After reading some tutorials, i recently started to experiment with HDRs, but i encountered a problem.

Every time i make an HDR i have massive amount of noise. I make the HDRs with Photomatix, and the photos are shot with a canon 40D at an iso ranging from 100-300 ISO. So i can't understand why that much of a noise. It's something that every HDR has or what?

I'm waiting for answers.

 

[Bifurcator]

Will HDR not work with film?

This one got missed so I'll scoop it up. But first I have to say that I'm really surprised at how much misinformation there is about HDRIs in this thread.

Anyway, the latitude of film is usually pretty close to a 96 bit HDRI. Just scan the negs or transparencies at different exposure values and use those results for your multiple images. Additionally many scanners are 48 bit and at least one I know of (the HP 4050 for about $150) can scan at 96 bit for a one-pass film to HDRI solution - assuming the drivers allow the import of all 96 bits. Keep in mind most 48 bit scanners will be scanning in fixed point files and not the official (and rare) "16 bpc Half Float" defined in the OpenEXR HDR standards.
(Note: There are three kinds of 16 bit files: 16 Bit Unsigned Integer, 16 Bit Fixed Point, and 16 Bit Half Float.)


Some useful tools include:

• PHOTOMATIX - http://www.hdrsoft.com/
• Wukong - http://www.imagingluminary.com/product.htm
• EasyHDR Pro - http://www.easyhdr.com/
• ARTIZEN HDR - http://www.supportingcomputers.net/Applications/Artizen/Artizen.htm
• HDRShop - http://gl.ict.usc.edu/HDRShop/ (probably the 1st HDRI tool published. Free and Pro versions available)
• Photogenics - http://www.idruna.com/photogenicshdr.html
• Photosphere (and tools) - http://www.anyhere.com/ (Mac and Linux only?)
• PhotoAcute Studio - http://www.photoacute.com/technology.html (Maybe only Mac??)
• EXR-Tools - http://scanline.ca/exrtools/
• SILVERFAST HDR Studio - http://www.silverfast.com/48bit-hdr-software/ (This should actually be called RAW Studio! There is a 16bit HDR format but this only uses the fixed point standard as far as I know.)
• PFSTools - http://www.mpi-inf.mpg.de/resources/pfstools/ (see: http://qtpfsgui.sourceforge.net/ for a nice GUI front end)
• The CinePaint Project - http://www.cinepaint.org/ (also see: http://www.cinepaint.org/docs/br2hdr/HDR_Tutorial-en.html )
• Fusion 5 - http://www.eyeonline.com
• LightWave 3D - http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/ (actually a nice HDR tool and the first 3D package (by a few years) to use HDRI files standardly.)
• Shake - http://www.apple.com/shake/

And the singular best file format to use and store HRDIs in is of course .EXR, the "Industrial Light & Magic" open source format officially called OpenEXR. Specs source and sample code for OpenEXR can be found here: ( http://www.openexr.com/ ). Next is probably .HDR or .HDRI, and then formats like RLA, Tiff 32 (Logluv), PSD 32, etc. and probably in that order. By "best" I mean robust... Convenience is another matter. If all you're using the files for is Photoshop and low dynamic range output (to jpeg or other) obviously PSD 32 is all you'll need to concern yourself with and etc..

And finally if you get confused by the contrasting and varied opinions in this thread and want a brain-straightener on the topic visit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_dynamic_range_imaging and don't forget to visit the links listed at the bottom of that page.

Three final points of clarification:

1. 8 bit files are also called 24 bit files. Luckily for us (see No. 3 below) besides the Targa company, not too many firms refer to 24bit+Alpha files as "32 bit files" even though they actually are.
2. 16 bit files are also called 48 bit files or 64 bit files. The terms are interchangeable except "64 bit" refers to the expected presence of an Alpha channel.
3. 32 bit files are also called 96 bit files or 128 bit files. The terms are interchangeable except an Alpha Channel is expected (or padded) in a "128 bit" file.

- Enjoy!

 

[JimmyO]

Got a question:

How do you do an HDR when there is a moving subject?

Sorry if this has already been asnwered

 

[Bifurcator]

Hopefully you don't have to. There's wares to remove the moving element tho. Both standalone and built in to some tools. Basically I think if you want to do that you need something like thi$: http://www.panoscan.com/. I guess there might be HDR cameras that are not set up just for spherical environment recordings though. I keep looking for one in main-stream SLR feature lists... I figure that's GOT to be the next thing they start adding feature-wise.

I had a scare recently with the "Finepix S100FS" as it calls itself an HDR camera. :stun: It might be... I'm kind of afraid to look.

In the meantime I guess you could do something like

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1057/1295149696_b3a9bacb76_b.jpg
or
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1080/1272780397_01aaa49c70_b.jpg

Man I love that last shot! (Graber ROCKS!!!)

 

[Vautrin]

Try looking up in your camera's manual "Auto Bracketing." My EVOLT 510 will automatically take three pictures with different exposures just like you'd need with an HDR image..... You've got to hit the button three times -- but it's quicker than changing the settings manually....

 

[DaveTaylor]

Got a question:

How do you do an HDR when there is a moving subject?

Sorry if this has already been asnwered

take a single raw format image and edit it's exposure

 

[Vautrin]

take a single raw format image and edit it's exposure

If you try doing that there won't be enough exposure info in the raw photo to make an HDR.... At least it doesn't work in photomatix... Photomatix does have a feature to take a single image and make it look like an HDR

 

[clupica]

About jpg
It's not photoshop that limits jpg to 8-bit imagery, it is the jpg specification itself. There is currently an initiative underway by Microsoft (with Adobe as a partner) to revise the jpg standard with a new jpg+ that will allow for lossless jpg and well greater bit-depth.

About single image "HDR"
As has been pointed out, HDR means high dynamic range and that means the range between black and white; 0,0,0 to 255,255,255 in an 8-bit image such as jpg. You can't produce an HDR from a single image no matter what you do. The range of the image remains the range of the image. To nit-pick, no image displayed as a jpg is really an HDR image, it is an HDR image tone-mapped to give a broader range of luminosity than the original.

Psuedo HDR
There are any of a number of ways you can do this. If all you have is PhotoShop you can create the same effect, more-or-less, by creating 3 layers and adjusting the layers differently; one dark, one where you think middle gray is and one light. Put a mask on each layer and then selectively remove the mask. I do this all the time in the context of doing a burn or a dodge. I seldom use the dodge / burn tool as it is destructive. I creat a "burn" layer and a "dodge" layer with inverted mask and then use a low-opacity brush to reveal / hide what I don't like. This really what you are trying to accomplish when you try to do an HDR from a single photo.

But creating a pseudo-HDR by hand is an immense time grabber. You'd better really want to do it.

About PhotoMatrix
I think it works pretty well and it is easy enough to use once you understand the steps. My first real attempt was horrible. I couldn't figure out what was wrong, why I couldn't get a descent HDR. Two words: dumb user. After "generating" the HDR you have to tone map it to get it to look good on a monitor; duh.

YUCK
Just be careful with HDR and tone-mapping. 90% of what is produced is very evident that it was tone-mapped and looks bad to anyone not an affectionado of unreal / over-processed / over-manipulated images. A light touch can produce some intersting photos but go just a bit too far and you've got 1960's velvet paintings of Elvis.

Charlie

 

[laurentharari]

Can you do HDR photos in PS? If so, how? Or is there a special program needed? Lastly, could you do something that looks similar to HDR in PS? Once again, if so, how?

Hello
I use a great software photomatrix pro. The result of four different apertures shot after hdr process ? Click here

 

[Bifurcator]

The "About single image "HDR" " and the above post are about Tone Mapping and have little or nothing to do with HDR - which is just a file format.

 

[Kalikala]

Ok, so my brother just recently showed me how to do an hdr. I expermented with it a bit, and have the general consept down. However, sometimes, the program doesn't line up the images exactly for some reason. Is there a way to manually adjust the images on PSPX2?